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Fallon Fox releases statement regarding UFC heavyweight MattĀ Mitrione   [View Full Version]
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prophecy033 » Posted 7/4/07 4:41:00AM

Fallon Fox has responded to Matt Mitrione following his derogatory tirade on "The MMA Hour".

Link

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SmileR » Posted 12/17/07 8:56:00PM

That statment may as well say I'm riding the publicity of his comments an I have nothing to add. Its a joke shes sanctioned to fight women

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mattjonesy » Posted 5/22/07 7:05:00PM

Well I for one totally agree with Mitriones comments I just think he should have worded it a little differently!

prophecy033 » Posted 7/4/07 4:41:00AM


Posted by mattjonesy

Well I for one totally agree with Mitriones comments I just think he should have worded it a little differently!

If he had articulated it better he wouldn't have had the harsh backlash

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#12 TUF 8 FINALE Points #12 Bellator 91 / Legacy FC / CCCW Combo Points #12 M-1/FA8/CFA/GC/IGF Wagers #14 UFC 143 Diaz vs Condit Points

Kpro » Posted 1/27/07 9:53:00PM

Schedule it Joe Silva!

Mitrione vs. Fox!

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If I was 50 years younger I'd kick your ass!

Adam_Buru » Posted 1/22/07 7:55:00PM


Posted by SmileR

That statment may as well say I'm riding the publicity of his comments an I have nothing to add. Its a joke shes sanctioned to fight women



A joke? It should be a criminal offence!

FlashyG » Posted 2/13/08 10:33:00AM

I think a lot of you guys are missing the point here regarding Meatheads comments.

If he had just expressed his opinion on whether Fox should be able to fight as a woman he wouldn't have been suspended and some worthwhile discussion would have taken place.

Instead he decided to make an insanely idiotic rant that not only got himself suspended but also distracted everyone from the topic that should be discussed by the MMA community, which is how do you properly handle a transgender fighter.

Personally I have next to no knowledge at all on transgender individuals so I will concede that the word of the medical professionals that say she should fight as a woman, have probably got a more convincing argument than my own "She looks like a dude" argument.

Kpro » Posted 1/27/07 9:53:00PM

`Her`nickname is "The Queen of Swords".

Possibly the most fitting nickname in the history of MMA.

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If I was 50 years younger I'd kick your ass!

Kpro » Posted 1/27/07 9:53:00PM

`She` is 37 and had `her` surgery at 30 when all her Male physiological changes had already happened over a decade prior, it's not like the gender change surgery or at least hormone treatments had begun at an age where the structure of the body could still be influenced by hormone treatments. Without the surgery, `he` would probably be close to needing TRT at this point.

The IOC (International Olympic Committee) allows transgender athletes to compete as long as they have had 2 years of consistent hormone therapy. Basically after 1-2 years of consistent hormone therapy, the muscles will be the same as born-Female muscles but the person still has Male bones which are larger and thicker. This can give advantages like a longer reach and disadvantages like slowing the fighter's speed due to the Female muscles having to move Male bones. The body structure would make the person weigh more in skeletal weight also as their bone to muscle ratio would be higher than other WMMA fighters giving a disadvantage as a born-Female fighter could carry the extra pounds in muscle that the transgender fighter carries in having thicker bones (I'm not sure how many pounds this difference is). I checked around and there really aren't any studies on how much of an effect on speed Female muscles moving Male bones has.

Basically, as long as a third party specialist verifies `she` has been on the hormone therapy consistent with a transgender athlete and `her` hormone levels fall in the range of a Female fighter, it's legal and will continue to be so.

I'm sure some more studies will be done on the Physiological advantages/disadvantages of a Male bone structure with Female muscles though. As long as the 2+ years of consistent hormone therapy is verified and `she` is within a regular Female's hormone level, the disadvantage would be the thicker bones making it impossible to carry as much muscle mass, and making reactions/movements slightly slower. The advantage would be harder to break bones and (I'm guessing here) being harder to knock out due to having a Male Cranium/Upper & Lower Jawbone/etc and likely with Male bones making up `her` fist, I'd imagine it would be easier to knock out a Female as the thicker Male bones hit the thinner Female jawbone, even though the muscles used to throw the punch are Female. I don't know how big of a difference the bone density is or if it varies bone to bone but it does sound like the hormone therapy does slightly affect the bone mineral density though the skeletal structure never becomes `Female` regardless of the therapy. The Female hormone therapy will also affect the size of the heart/lungs as the Male organs are about 10% larger but I'm not sure if it completely brings them down to Female size. If not, the person could have a stronger heart and more efficient/larger lungs, but it's possible the hormone therapy affects the organs just like the muscles making them essentially Female. With a difference of 10% or less that is likely negated with the therapy, it doesn't seem like a big issue since there are people who just genetically have those differences in the same sex anyways. I didn't see anything comparing how easy it is for a Male to cut weight versus a Female who was born Male but that could be an advantage or disadvantage also. I'm sure there are other things too, but it sounds like there are multiple positives and multiple negatives, not all positives like it seemed at first glance in a combat sport. Just some information, draw your own conclusion.

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If I was 50 years younger I'd kick your ass!

tcunningham » Posted 9/30/09 9:33:00PM

Kpro i just gave you a prop because in one post you gave me every bit of info i could ever care about on this subject. now i can die in peace.

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infestructure » Posted 1/18/12 9:29:00PM


Posted by Kpro

`She` is 37 and had `her` surgery at 30 when all her Male physiological changes had already happened over a decade prior, it's not like the gender change surgery or at least hormone treatments had begun at an age where the structure of the body could still be influenced by hormone treatments. Without the surgery, `he` would probably be close to needing TRT at this point.

The IOC (International Olympic Committee) allows transgender athletes to compete as long as they have had 2 years of consistent hormone therapy. Basically after 1-2 years of consistent hormone therapy, the muscles will be the same as born-Female muscles but the person still has Male bones which are larger and thicker. This can give advantages like a longer reach and disadvantages like slowing the fighter's speed due to the Female muscles having to move Male bones. The body structure would make the person weigh more in skeletal weight also as their bone to muscle ratio would be higher than other WMMA fighters giving a disadvantage as a born-Female fighter could carry the extra pounds in muscle that the transgender fighter carries in having thicker bones (I'm not sure how many pounds this difference is). I checked around and there really aren't any studies on how much of an effect on speed Female muscles moving Male bones has.

Basically, as long as a third party specialist verifies `she` has been on the hormone therapy consistent with a transgender athlete and `her` hormone levels fall in the range of a Female fighter, it's legal and will continue to be so.

I'm sure some more studies will be done on the Physiological advantages/disadvantages of a Male bone structure with Female muscles though. As long as the 2+ years of consistent hormone therapy is verified and `she` is within a regular Female's hormone level, the disadvantage would be the thicker bones making it impossible to carry as much muscle mass, and making reactions/movements slightly slower. The advantage would be harder to break bones and (I'm guessing here) being harder to knock out due to having a Male Cranium/Upper & Lower Jawbone/etc and likely with Male bones making up `her` fist, I'd imagine it would be easier to knock out a Female as the thicker Male bones hit the thinner Female jawbone, even though the muscles used to throw the punch are Female. I don't know how big of a difference the bone density is or if it varies bone to bone but it does sound like the hormone therapy does slightly affect the bone mineral density though the skeletal structure never becomes `Female` regardless of the therapy. The Female hormone therapy will also affect the size of the heart/lungs as the Male organs are about 10% larger but I'm not sure if it completely brings them down to Female size. If not, the person could have a stronger heart and more efficient/larger lungs, but it's possible the hormone therapy affects the organs just like the muscles making them essentially Female. With a difference of 10% or less that is likely negated with the therapy, it doesn't seem like a big issue since there are people who just genetically have those differences in the same sex anyways. I didn't see anything comparing how easy it is for a Male to cut weight versus a Female who was born Male but that could be an advantage or disadvantage also. I'm sure there are other things too, but it sounds like there are multiple positives and multiple negatives, not all positives like it seemed at first glance in a combat sport. Just some information, draw your own conclusion.



Good post, Kpro.
The conclusion I draw is when it comes to transgenders fighting anything other than other transgenders, there are too many parameters to attempt to make it a level playing field. Trying to take into account all the physical aspects would be daunting, and the mental side of things even worse. 30 years of being a man would be hard to forget.

Dana should jump on this and open a transgender league

Tyzzler » Posted 1/27/09 10:52:00PM

I really don't know EXACTLY how to think on this subject, but by admitting my shortcomings in the technical/physical knowledge of this subject, I will IN NO WAY judge one way or the other.

YES: there may be some strong advantages for Fallon being born a male

YES: there are likewise some VERY strong disadvantages as to her "being" or "existence" as a person. I'm not even about to use the words "choice" "decision" etc...

Her male-born qualities may be superior to others' woman-born qualities.

Her estrogen-influenced qualities (via hormones) are surely a disadvantage to others' male born-testosterone qualities.

It's hard to give a "RIGHT" or "WRONG" answer here, & I am in no way qualified to make such a judgement...& for the record, I doubt any of you are either. So instead of spouting "overly-strong judgements" simply to get props or agreement, let those that are, at least in some sense considered, experts decide this case. AND even if you want to give your 2 cents, please cease the HATE

Kpro » Posted 1/27/07 9:53:00PM


Posted by Tyzzler

I really don't know EXACTLY how to think on this subject, but by admitting my shortcomings in the technical/physical knowledge of this subject, I will IN NO WAY judge one way or the other.

YES: there may be some strong advantages for Fallon being born a male

YES: there are likewise some VERY strong disadvantages as to her "being" or "existence" as a person. I'm not even about to use the words "choice" "decision" etc...

Her male-born qualities may be superior to others' woman-born qualities.

Her estrogen-influenced qualities (via hormones) are surely a disadvantage to others' male born-testosterone qualities.

It's hard to give a "RIGHT" or "WRONG" answer here, & I am in no way qualified to make such a judgement...& for the record, I doubt any of you are either. So instead of spouting "overly-strong judgements" simply to get props or agreement, let those that are, at least in some sense considered, experts decide this case. AND even if you want to give your 2 cents, please cease the HATE




Chill out bud. Each post in this thread has been sarcastic, informative, or opinion but there is no "HATE" and "overly-strong judgments to get props" for anyone to cease. Did you just read comments on another site and then respond on this one? Your posts are usually very high-strung, time to just and leave Caps Lock alone.

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If I was 50 years younger I'd kick your ass!

BigBadAl » Posted 6/18/09 8:26:00AM

If I take two wheels off my car does it make it a motorbike?

Pookie » Posted 4/8/07 11:48:00PM

A thicker skeletal structure has been shown to retain speed at higher weights. Having thicker bones is going to in no way be a disadvantage in fighting.

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BJ Penn beat Frankie Edgar more times than Benson Henderson beat Frankie Edgar.

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