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Dana White Supports Overtime to Take Draws Out of the UFC

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emfleek

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The UFC has already had two pay-per-view main events end in draws this year, with neither fighter getting his hand raised in the Frankie Edgar vs Gray Maynard fight at UFC 125, or the B.J. Penn vs. Jon Fitch fight at UFC 127.

UFC President Dana White wasn't satisfied with those decisions, and he'd like to do something about it: Add overtime to UFC fights.

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Post #1   3/31/11 12:49:55PM   

kingsmasher

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I agree and with overtime...Quite frankly it sets the sport back and really a draw requires an immediate rematch to clear the picture..

Post #2   3/31/11 12:52:12PM   

jimmyinfamous

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I'd wholeheartedly agree with that. I think we as fans are getting somewhat tired of the umpteen rematches. The only other thing is the judges that come up with bad decisions (Leonard Garcia vs. Nam Phan, Sherk vs. Dunham) need to be dealt with in some fashion to get a positive affect on the score-keeping.

Post #3   3/31/11 12:56:23PM   

icantthinkofanything

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I do too, draws stink, but sometimes fights are close and 10-8 rounds happen sometimes. IMagine if they had a tie breaker for Championship fights where the fight had no time limit and had to be finished to award a winner? That would rule, but
most likely there will be a timed, 4th a 6th round. and hopefully the tie breaker round will produce a clear cut winner because usually in Draws it is an even fight and rounds are hard to score, having a 6th round may not fix the scoring in close fights.
the point system is the bigger problem, because sometime the wrestler will get his ass whooped and still win because takedowns are worth "points", I dont think a takedown, should be worth more than a big strike that almost ko's a guy, but doesnt.
they should also give a guy points for standing up and going for sub attempts off his back, that way strikers and bjj guys get credit for the times they are clearly winning the fight, but than
the other guy gets a takedwon, doesnt do damge or try to pass and than wins for being on top.
even though he was being choked or elbowed from the bottom the entire round!

Post #4   3/31/11 1:38:00PM   

mrsmiley

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Even with overtime, in some cases I just don't know how much it will do to fix the problem.

Post #5   3/31/11 1:56:03PM   

grappler0000

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Posted by mrsmiley

Even with overtime, in some cases I just don't know how much it will do to fix the problem.



It won't fix bad judges, but it will do 2 things:

(1) prevent unneeded rematches...hey if it was close, it's still an option, but it's not a necessity
(2) loosen up the AC's position on 10-10 rounds. If there's a tie breaker anyway, there's no pressure to score every round for a fighter, even when it's too close to call. this in and of itself should cut down on a small portion of bad scoring.

I do realize that #2 isn't a guaranteed result, but I strongly feel it would have that impact. Either way, there's much more to gain from an overtime round than there is to lose.

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Post #6   3/31/11 2:11:10PM   

kingsmasher

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Posted by jimmyinfamous

I'd wholeheartedly agree with that. I think we as fans are getting somewhat tired of the umpteen rematches. The only other thing is the judges that come up with bad decisions (Leonard Garcia vs. Nam Phan, Sherk vs. Dunham) need to be dealt with in some fashion to get a positive affect on the score-keeping.



Yeah Sherk Dunham was ludicrous....Its funny that Dunham put the pressure on and its teh exact same concept as the Diego Kampmann fight both fighters looked terrible but Dunham who actually won gets the loss and Diego who actually lost gets the win....Whats really bad I had money on both and got screwed..>real money that is...

Post #7   3/31/11 3:03:53PM   

machodog76

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Stephan Bonnar, "Josh Koscheck is just a prick at heart"

Post #8   3/31/11 3:50:09PM   

tallica62

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just get rid of decisions...eliminates stupid judges

Post #9   3/31/11 4:30:49PM   

DeadHead988

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Posted by machodog76

Stephan Bonnar, "Josh Koscheck is just a prick at heart"




While that;s a good quote, it has literally nothing to do with this topic

Post #10   3/31/11 5:12:33PM   

ncordless

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There is nothing wrong with a draw, and a draw shouldn't necessitate an immediate rematch.

In the entire history of UFC, there have been VERY few draws. Now part of that might be due to the traditional reluctance to give 10-10 and 10-8 rounds, but even now as 10-10 finally seems to be more common, it's not like draws are happening all the time. In fact, the current hissyfit about them seems to stem from only two fights (Maynard/Edgar and Fitch/Penn). In more 7 cards and approx. 80 fights this year, 2 of them have been draws. To change the fundamental structure of how an mma fight works because of 1 out of 40 chance that we do not get a win/loss resolution seems like a huge overreaction.

Also, an overtime period has just as much possibility to be a 10-10 round as any other round. For example, fighter A wins the first round 10-9. Fighter B wins the second round 10-9. The third round is 10-10. If there is an overtime period, and it ends up being 10-10 as well, then there is still the problem of a draw.

The other option for overtime is ridiculous. They could do a sudden death, but what would be the point at which a victor would be declared? A "first strike landed" threshold would turn it from an mma match into a point-fighting match, while a "KO" sudden death would return us to the early days of MMA and its corresponding perceived barbarity.

MMA is a simple sport. Two people fight for 5:00 at a time for a set amount of rounds. Barring a mid-fight finish, the fighter will have either won, lost, or drawn.

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Post #11   3/31/11 5:25:00PM   

Sir_Karl

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I actually feel there should be MORE draws in MMA. The number of draws in MMA is actually very tiny. I think too many close decision and split decision losses ruins the careers of fighters.

Post #12   3/31/11 6:46:27PM   

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Ok guys, here's my revolutionary plan to reform mma rules to make them fit to the reality of two men/women fighting each other!

First, i don't think an overtime round would change that much. As ncordless said, it also could be scored a 10-10 round. Or even worse, if there's a wrestler involved he takes the guy down and hold's him there for 3 minutes and wins the fight. Takedowns are already way overrated by the judges and nobody would like to watch that. The draw itself isn't that much of a problem, as long as it represents the actual fight that happened. BJ vs. Fitch was infact a draw. Maynard vs. Edgar II was a draw. Also i think machida vs. shogun I was a draw or machida vs. rampage, as several others.

So i, in my humble opinion, would change things the following way:

1.) Educate the effing judges and pay them more for doing a good job/less for a bad job! More ex-fighters should get involved, cause they know what they are talking about. Comissions, go for it! hard!

2.) Takedowns are mostly not able to finish a fight. Striking and subattempts very well can at any time! Stop deciding fights only on takedowns, they are still overrated. And if the guy on top can't pass the guard or isn't able to do some damage on the opponent after a minute, stand them back up!

3.) Implement Doc Hamiltons half point system, which they are testing in amateur bouts right now and encourage judges to score with:

10-10 for an even round means too close round for a clear winner
10-9.5 for a close but admissible round win
10-9 for a decisive round win
10-8 for a dominant round win

This way you might even have more draws especially in 3 round fights.

4.) In case there is a draw, an extra judge uses the japanese mma judging criteria. Score the whole fight with:
a) which fighter was closer to finish the fight (sub or tko)? If that's not possible use
b) fightmetric stats, means who scored more total strikes/sub attempts/takedowns to call the winner

I think this way you get as close as possible to represent the fight. Of course there is still room for bad judging, but that won't change with any rule change, only with better judges.

Post #13   3/31/11 6:58:43PM   

bjj1605

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Posted by XblacksheepX

Ok guys, here's my revolutionary plan to reform mma rules to make them fit to the reality of two men/women fighting each other!

First, i don't think an overtime round would change that much. As ncordless said, it also could be scored a 10-10 round. Or even worse, if there's a wrestler involved he takes the guy down and hold's him there for 3 minutes and wins the fight. Takedowns are already way overrated by the judges and nobody would like to watch that. The draw itself isn't that much of a problem, as long as it represents the actual fight that happened. BJ vs. Fitch was infact a draw. Maynard vs. Edgar II was a draw. Also i think machida vs. shogun I was a draw or machida vs. rampage, as several others.

So i, in my humble opinion, would change things the following way:

1.) Educate the effing judges and pay them more for doing a good job/less for a bad job! More ex-fighters should get involved, cause they know what they are talking about. Comissions, go for it! hard!

2.) Takedowns are mostly not able to finish a fight. Striking and subattempts very well can at any time! Stop deciding fights only on takedowns, they are still overrated. And if the guy on top can't pass the guard or isn't able to do some damage on the opponent after a minute, stand them back up!

3.) Implement Doc Hamiltons half point system, which they are testing in amateur bouts right now and encourage judges to score with:

10-10 for an even round means too close round for a clear winner
10-9.5 for a close but admissible round win
10-9 for a decisive round win
10-8 for a dominant round win

This way you might even have more draws especially in 3 round fights.

4.) In case there is a draw, an extra judge uses the japanese mma judging criteria. Score the whole fight with:
a) which fighter was closer to finish the fight (sub or tko)? If that's not possible use
b) fightmetric stats, means who scored more total strikes/sub attempts/takedowns to call the winner

I think this way you get as close as possible to represent the fight. Of course there is still room for bad judging, but that won't change with any rule change, only with better judges.



You know I'm not claiming that he stole the idea from me or anything but I actually came up with the half point system on this forum.

I like some of the suggestions you made though. But the biggest problem is just uneducated judges. We're getting to the point where finishing fights is overrated. Fighter are encouraged by the judges to lay and pray because they favor wrestlers so much. Fighters like Lil Nog, Jeff Curran, and Nate Diaz (basically guys who like to play guard) get screwed because the judges don't understand their game. People are discouraged from having a good guard because it isn't scored. This is an even greater advantage for wrestlers because now not only are they getting preferential scoring, they have nothing to worry about from the guard. Its a vicious cycle that is bringing down the caliber of Jiu Jitsu in MMA.

As to ncordless, statistically the chances of the overtime round being scored 10-10 and the fight still being a draw are much lower. Add to the fact that the judges know that the overtime round is supposed to decide a winner, and I think this solution would do away with draws all together.

It would make PPV timing impossibly hard to plan though, which is my main knock against it.

Post #14   3/31/11 8:27:15PM   

jgtribbett

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Nice to hear Dana say that he wants an overtime... that means it is in the works haha... probably

Post #15   4/1/11 2:49:10AM   
 
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