Freddie Roach: The UFC is using James Toney to prove MMA fighters are better than boxers |
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SmileR
Buy the ticket, take the ride
Career record: 649-352
Season: 34-16 (#461)
Location: My big ass bed
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"I think they're using James as a way to say MMA fighters are better than boxers. If he fights a quality ground guy, once he goes to the ground he's gonna get killed. But If a guy chooses to stand up with James, James is gonna destroy him. That’s why they call him 'Lights Out.' I really don’t think there’s one fighter in MMA that could stand with James."
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Post #1 3/11/10 5:01:58PM
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seanfu
BANNED
Career record: 162-89
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Fort Wayne IN
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Lyoto, BJ, Anderson, GSP, what do these fighters have in common, they would all kick James Toney's ass standing.
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Post #2 3/11/10 5:48:48PM
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Jackelope
Go ahead, MOD my day
Career record: 586-330
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Getting choked out or arm barred
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I honestly agree with Roach about the standup department. And about the ground game, too.
So really.. what is his point? I don't think they're using Toney for anything. He's the one that signed on the dotted line. He's not stupid- he knows what is at stake. Boxers talk a lot of noise and now they're given the chance to prove whether their style is superior or not. What is the problem????
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Post #3 3/11/10 6:01:24PM
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NatedawgThaM
MMA Sensei
Career record: 343-224
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: New Providence, Pa
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Obviously 99% accurate except I don't think that's Dana's intentions. I'm pretty sure it's a good way to make money and plus boxers have been knocking on our sport for the longest time so it's time to see if they can really back up all that talk.
Posted by seanfu
Lyoto, BJ, Anderson, GSP, what do these fighters have in common, they would all kick James Toney's ass standing.
IMO no way. Anderson definitely has the best shot because he's more versatile wth kicks and knees. GSP's biggest striking advantage is the threat you have to watch out for his amazing takedowns at all times so it takes away from your striking IMO. But if Toney didn't have to worry about the takedowns and if he was at the weight I think he could take him. Lyoto would be interesting as he likes to work from a distance and boxing has alot to do with distance so I don't wanna say anything about that. BUt I'm pretty confident if anybody throws hands with Toney he's getting dropped. His only downside IMO is that philly shell, it won't work that well against a more versatile striker with kicks and knees.
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Post #4 3/11/10 6:05:02PM
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seanfu
BANNED
Career record: 162-89
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Fort Wayne IN
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Posted by NatedawgThaM
Obviously 99% accurate except I don't think that's Dana's intentions. I'm pretty sure it's a good way to make money and plus boxers have been knocking on our sport for the longest time so it's time to see if they can really back up all that talk.
Posted by seanfu
Lyoto, BJ, Anderson, GSP, what do these fighters have in common, they would all kick James Toney's ass standing.
IMO no way. Anderson definitely has the best shot because he's more versatile wth kicks and knees. GSP's biggest striking advantage is the threat you have to watch out for his amazing takedowns at all times so it takes away from your striking IMO. But if Toney didn't have to worry about the takedowns and if he was at the weight I think he could take him. Lyoto would be interesting as he likes to work from a distance and boxing has alot to do with distance so I don't wanna say anything about that. BUt I'm pretty confident if anybody throws hands with Toney he's getting dropped. His only downside IMO is that philly shell, it won't work that well against a more versatile striker with kicks and knees.
aggressive Toney's a beast. But the philly shell doesn't work in mma period.
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Post #5 3/11/10 6:19:57PM
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bojangalz
The Original Playground Bully
Career record: 720-392
Season: 36-14 (#330)
Location: Minnesota
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Funny... I thought they were using him to make money. 
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Post #6 3/11/10 6:37:13PM
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Pookie
Heavyweight Champ
Career record: 742-383
Season: 36-14 (#183)
Location: NorCal
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Anybody 205 or higher with good kicks would probably break him down, and work they're ways up.
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Post #7 3/11/10 6:51:56PM
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haggiswashere
MMA Sensei
Career record: 352-262
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Roy Utah in the United States of AMIRica
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Posted by seanfu
Lyoto, BJ, Anderson, GSP, what do these fighters have in common, they would all kick James Toney's ass standing.
If he fights any of those I will av bet you that he will knock any of them out if they stand. The only on I could see standing even the slightest chance would be Machida. and thats a maybe.
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Post #8 3/11/10 7:41:14PM
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jae_1833
Heavyweight Champ
Career record: 659-398
Season: 34-16 (#496)
Location: Cali
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I think any MW or higher with decent stand up skills will surprise the world and show every one that pure Boxers don't belong in a cage......by KOing Toney without taking it to the ground! Go ahead and flame me but if you all don't think Hendo hits hard enough or has enough skills to land a solid one on Toney then I think you are sadly mistaken. I'd bet on Belcher in a fight against Toney based on the simple principle of the rules allowing for kicks of all kinds. There is just no way a 40+ old boxer is going to not get kicked in the legs ribs and head. He doesn't know what to do against them and that is going to be extremely obvious and problematic very early on in the fight. I just think that if a boxer wants to come into MMA then he shoud do it early on in his career and use boxing as one of his base fightings styles like Chris Lytle and Marcus Davis did.
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Post #9 3/11/10 8:57:23PM
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postman
Heavyweight Champ
Career record: 564-321
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Delmont ,Pa
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Posted by jae_1833
I think any MW or higher with decent stand up skills will surprise the world and show every one that pure Boxers don't belong in a cage......by KOing Toney without taking it to the ground! Go ahead and flame me but if you all don't think Hendo hits hard enough or has enough skills to land a solid one on Toney then I think you are sadly mistaken. I'd bet on Belcher in a fight against Toney based on the simple principle of the rules allowing for kicks of all kinds. There is just no way a 40+ old boxer is going to not get kicked in the legs ribs and head. He doesn't know what to do against them and that is going to be extremely obvious and problematic very early on in the fight. I just think that if a boxer wants to come into MMA then he shoud do it early on in his career and use boxing as one of his base fightings styles like Chris Lytle and Marcus Davis did.
Sorry Hendo would get smashed if he tried to stand with Toney. If not then Hendo would be a boxer. Hendo dosn't kick much and unless your talking about working in the clinch or on the ground Heno would get knocked out. Look at what anderson did to him on the feet. By the way Hendo is my fav fighter butg i got to call them as I see em.
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Post #10 3/11/10 10:42:36PM
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Taylor8766
Belt Contender
Career record: 551-369
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Ontario, Canada
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I agree and disagree, IMO the UFC is using Toney to bring out more boxers like Maywheather, Hatton, Jones Jr etc. to try their hand at MMA. Now to be honest I think Toney could handle himself very well in the stand-up against some of the top strikers, guys like Silva, Liddell, Machida, SHogun, Cro Cop etc., I mean of course he wont have the kicking power at all, but hes a straight up brawler good chin and power strikes and Im sure his speed is decent. Im not saying he would beat the top guys in MMA or even have a shot at them, but he does have a very god chance at beating guys like Kimbo, Coleman, Fedor(JUST KIDDING), but seriously he has a decent shot at getting some nice KO's and a decent future in MMA, but I dont see him making a run for the title any time soon.
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Post #11 3/11/10 11:50:40PM
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Always Lurking
Career record: 705-375
Season: 36-14 (#122)
Location: Coon Rapids, Minnesota
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I say lets have a best of 3. First fight is in the cage, second is in the boxing ring, third is a potato sack race.
I would actually like to see A. Silva and Toney go at it under boxing rules. The one catch would be to use the 4 oz gloves. Let us see how his chin holds up then.
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Billy Madison-
What you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in the playground is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no props, and may God have mercy on your soul.
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Post #12 3/12/10 12:26:12AM
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jae_1833
Heavyweight Champ
Career record: 659-398
Season: 34-16 (#496)
Location: Cali
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Posted by postman
Sorry Hendo would get smashed if he tried to stand with Toney. If not then Hendo would be a boxer. Hendo dosn't kick much and unless your talking about working in the clinch or on the ground Heno would get knocked out. Look at what anderson did to him on the feet. By the way Hendo is my fav fighter butg i got to call them as I see em.
I guess Hendo was a bad example when it comes to versatility, but certainly not for KO Power....I just think that the versatility of the striking game that is in MMA will prove to be too much for a purebred boxer.
Last edited 3/12/10 2:52PM by jae_1833
Edit note/reason: n/a
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Post #13 3/12/10 2:51:51PM
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cmill21
Heavyweight Champ
Career record: 369-196
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Regina SK
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You guys are crazy. Anderson and BJ look great against guys who have trained boxing mixed in with other things, they do not face guys like Toney or Buakaw on the reg. It's a different game, mma fighters stand with these guys and they go down, thats the way it plays out for the most part. I can't believe how arrogant mma fans have become. MMA hasn't come so far that the JJ guys have passed the pure JJ guys outside of it, and the stand up has definetly not come to the level of K-1 and boxing, sorry boys.
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Post #14 3/12/10 4:52:09PM
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CwB
MMA Sensei
Career record: 221-151
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Sin Sh*tty
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Posted by Pookie
Anybody 205 or higher with good kicks would probably break him down, and work they're ways up.
Exactly what I was thinking... Chop his legs until the head kick opens up.
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Post #15 3/12/10 7:13:46PM
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