UFC Is Considering A Smaller Octagon |
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Steady MODdin'
Career record: 749-421
Season: 33-17 (#668)
Location: Milwaukee
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Posted by Rush
That being said, if all is well, why take a risk changing something that is working?
i think thats the best argument out there against this, i was just playing devils advocate. the thing about some of these guys that are relative unknowns is that you might find a guy like shane carwin that looks like he could be something special, but unfortunately most of the relative unknowns are that way for a reason, they arent ufc quality fighters.
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Post #16 10/8/09 2:27:44PM
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Rush
Laying down the beats
Career record: 467-329
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Canadian living in the SF Bay Area
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Posted by bjj1605
It all comes down to greed, more seats and more money.
Less octagon floor space means less/smaller advertising. 
That is why I don't think it's a matter of money and space. I really think they genuinely hope that it will improve the sport (we'll let's say improve the entertainment factor for most of the fans). I'm just not convinced it will have the impact they think it will. I also think it would cause as many problems as it would solve.
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Post #17 10/8/09 2:29:01PM
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Rush
Laying down the beats
Career record: 467-329
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Canadian living in the SF Bay Area
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Posted by cowcatcher
i think thats the best argument out there against this, i was just playing devils advocate. the thing about some of these guys that are relative unknowns is that you might find a guy like shane carwin that looks like he could be something special, but unfortunately most of the relative unknowns are that way for a reason, they arent ufc quality fighters.
I expanded on this issue with a post that was posted concurrently with yours.
Regarding the fighters (your second point) I agree in hindsight that works, but a) how many cans does the UFC need to go through to find one gem and b) what is wrong with them being discovered in the WEC. I know the WEC needs heavier weight classes, but I don't see the harm in using the WEC to foster up and coming fighters (including the less than elite TUF members) to see if they are ready for the UFC. A cooperative effort between TUF and the WEC could really breathe new life into both companies.
Then again, going back to what you mentioned, if the UFC is doing fine as is, why would they feel the need to tinker with it... (even though I personally feel that their business model is not built off of what they claim it to be in their PR)
Last edited 10/8/09 2:42PM by Rush
Edit note/reason: n/a
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Post #18 10/8/09 2:40:57PM
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Steady MODdin'
Career record: 749-421
Season: 33-17 (#668)
Location: Milwaukee
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they do need to keep some guys around to feed to their stars when they have taken a couple of losses in a row, there are certain guys they just cant lose, and a win can go a long way to getting a guy back on track.
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Post #19 10/8/09 2:48:27PM
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StorminYourman
Belt Contender
Career record: 532-328
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location:
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I am against it but who knows my mind could be changed
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Post #20 10/8/09 2:48:32PM
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Rush
Laying down the beats
Career record: 467-329
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Canadian living in the SF Bay Area
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Posted by cowcatcher
they do need to keep some guys around to feed to their stars when they have taken a couple of losses in a row, there are certain guys they just cant lose, and a win can go a long way to getting a guy back on track.
I know why they (the UFC) do it. I just don't personally believe in the fights involving stars and cannon fodder fighters. then again, I don't jump off a fighter's bandwagon because he lost a couple fights in a row against other top guys. I think if fighter has lost enough to warrant him a fight with a guy not of UFC calibre, he shouldn't be in the UFC (at that time).
Again, I understand that the UFC wants can sell a big name fighting with a can and wants to prevent smaller orgs from using the big names themselves, but I really think if Elite fighter x has lost against UFC fighters (going down the UFC ladder,) he should fight Joe Boxer in a smaller org, not in the UFC undercard.
That being said, I don't think two way contracts (with the WEC) would be a bad idea for this type of thing.
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Post #21 10/8/09 2:59:50PM
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Steady MODdin'
Career record: 749-421
Season: 33-17 (#668)
Location: Milwaukee
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i agree, but they really dont seem to want to make the WEC a "feeder league". i think down the road that just might happen, but im also thinking that the bubble will burst on this sport just like the poker craze if it doesnt constantly reinvent itself.
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Post #22 10/8/09 3:07:03PM
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Rush
Laying down the beats
Career record: 467-329
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Canadian living in the SF Bay Area
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Posted by cowcatcher
i agree, but they really dont seem to want to make the WEC a "feeder league".
i think down the road that just might happen, but im also thinking that the bubble will burst on this sport just like the poker craze if it doesnt constantly reinvent itself.
On your first point, do you have any thoughts as to why that is the case (other than that Dana has said so in the past)?
On the second point, I agree, but I think that possibility is why people will consider MMA more of a spectacle than a sport. I think there should be more structure, which would include a "minor league".
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Post #23 10/8/09 3:14:31PM
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prozacnation1978
Heavyweight Champ
Career record: 720-362
Season: 36-14 (#165)
Location: san diego
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i say don't do it but if they do just move it in like 3 feet in at the most
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Post #24 10/8/09 3:16:59PM
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seanfu
BANNED
Career record: 162-89
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Fort Wayne IN
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That idea is fukking retarded. One of the greatest things about Elite XC was the circular cage which was noticably larger and had minimal cage interferance.
If guys like Lyoto, Anderson, Shogun, have to fight in a smaller range then that kills an intelligent striking game. I biases the cage EVEN MORE than it currently is toward wrestlers.
I mean, think about it, in ring fighting promotions how many outstanding wrestlers are there that can be successful with pure wrestling and maybe some GnP??? Now look at cage promotions, how much more effective is wrestling, and how much more dominant are they???
This is rediculous. If the UFC really needs 10000$ seats that ******* much while they rake in millions multiple times a month then the UFC in no better than Showtime hosting boxing.
God save the sport of MMA if it deteriorates in this fashion as greed begins to take a firm hold in the heart of the sport.
I am disgusted.
Changing the cage to even a small degree can change the UFC entirely.
Last edited 10/8/09 3:28PM by seanfu
Edit note/reason: n/a
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Post #25 10/8/09 3:21:40PM
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Steady MODdin'
Career record: 749-421
Season: 33-17 (#668)
Location: Milwaukee
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i really dont know why they wouldnt make the WEC their equivalent of AAA baseball, i think at this point they are using it to showcase, and measure interest in smaller weight classes. at some point they will have enough legit stars where that wont be necessary anymore and a change will probably be considered. i think they are also very leery of the fact that other things like rival promotions and poker have seen the bottom fall out and they want to avoid that so they are very calculating in just about everything they do, and sometimes seem unwilling to do things that the fans and sometimes fighters call for like unions, better pay, signing certain guys for too much money, etc. for all the things that get said about dana, he has proven that he is an extremely shrewd businessman and he doesnt make many major mistakes because he is so aware that failure is just a bad move or two away in a young sport that still has a "fad" label in many circles.
Last edited 10/8/09 3:28PM by cowcatcher
Edit note/reason: n/a
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Post #26 10/8/09 3:24:22PM
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landstander
Learning to Sprawl
Career record: 47-32
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: aus
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I have never gone to a live cage fight show but I hear it is harder to see whats going on than in the ring. They should concentrate on making it better for the live spectators first.
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Post #27 10/8/09 5:01:53PM
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Steady MODdin'
Career record: 749-421
Season: 33-17 (#668)
Location: Milwaukee
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Posted by landstander
I have never gone to a live cage fight show but I hear it is harder to see whats going on than in the ring. They should concentrate on making it better for the live spectators first.
thing is, the live spectators dont bring in the revenue that the PPV audience does so they are the last people the ufc is thinking about in terms of logistics.
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Post #28 10/8/09 5:04:13PM
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CwB
MMA Sensei
Career record: 221-151
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Sin Sh*tty
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Posted by seanfu
It biases the cage EVEN MORE than it currently is toward wrestlers.
Smaller cage equals good thing for wrestlers...
sidenote
thank you rush and cowcatcher for a great debate which brought up numerous points for both causes
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Post #29 10/8/09 5:25:25PM
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Sinister
BANNED
Career record: 22-17
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Cedarville, OH and Connellsville, PA
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Wasn't the TUF 9 finale's cage smaller? I don't see why people would like this. Anyone in favor of a ring to me would like a bigger cage. That way, strikers still have an advantage of staying hear the middle to avoid be pushed against the wall and taken down.
A smaller cage to me is a bad idea. Keep it the way it is.
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Post #30 10/8/09 6:02:28PM
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