Pick'em Leagues: THE BIG SHOW CASUAL BEST OF THE REST Single Event PvP: FANTASY POOLS Betting Leagues: THE BIG SHOW BEST OF THE REST
  MMA Playground 4.0 is live!     Returning members: check out the patch notes     New members: visit our getting started guide, read the FAQ's and start playing!

MMA Is No Breakthrough for Women

Print  
Posted By Message

emfleek

FA-Q

emfleek Avatar
11
 
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:18,722
Career:2,245-1,185
Joined:Nov 2007
Camp: The Ringers
Chips:
2,241
We've just witnessed the greatest advancement for female sports since Brandi Chastain ripped off her shirt at the end of the World Cup.

So why does it feel more like a punch to the stomach?

I'm talking about last weekend's MMA bout between Gina Carano and Cristiane "Cyborg" Santos. It supposedly is the breakthrough battle that will make female fighting mainstream.

STORY

_______________________________________
"I'm like the superhero coming in with the anti-bullsh*t." - Nick Diaz

Post #1   8/18/09 8:25:20AM   

postman

Heavyweight Champ

postman Avatar
2

 
 
 


 
 
Posts:6,226
Career:746-420
Joined:Jun 2007
Chips:
1,039

In general, we are territorial, hunter-gatherers, hard-wired to see who is the king of the jungle. Women will show more fight than 10 men when their children are threatened, but they need a good reason to drop the gloves. Men just need an excuse.



You kinda saw that in the fight too. There where times Gina wanted to turn her head and run she almost did it a few times but she had to tell herself to get back in the fight turn and do battle. You don't see that much with the men. I remember saying that maybe woman shouldn't do MMA because of this very samething happening in a Carono Fight. I can't remember who it was but everytime Gina would hit her she would turn from the pain. I am all for Woman doing what they want but I don't think I will be a fan. I did watch the Cyborg Gina fight and I don't see it being any better then that.
Just one guy oponion I guess.

Post #2   8/18/09 11:13:59AM   

emfleek

FA-Q

emfleek Avatar
11
 
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:18,722
Career:2,245-1,185
Joined:Nov 2007
Camp: The Ringers
Chips:
2,241

Posted by postman

You kinda saw that in the fight too. There where times Gina wanted to turn her head and run she almost did it a few times but she had to tell herself to get back in the fight turn and do battle. You don't see that much with the men. I remember saying that maybe woman shouldn't do MMA because of this very samething happening in a Carono Fight. I can't remember who it was but everytime Gina would hit her she would turn from the pain. I am all for Woman doing what they want but I don't think I will be a fan. I did watch the Cyborg Gina fight and I don't see it being any better then that.
Just one guy oponion I guess.



I can't say I disagree. I've found myself thinking the same thing and it happens more often than not. The fights seem to be one-sided quite often and that results in one fighter covering up, turning and wanting to run away.

_______________________________________
"I'm like the superhero coming in with the anti-bullsh*t." - Nick Diaz

Post #3   8/18/09 11:17:44AM   

ncordless

MODulation

ncordless Avatar
12
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:4,843
Career:1,842-1,052
Joined:Apr 2007
Camp: The Ringers
Chips:
1,098
The problem is not that the fighters that are turning away are women. I watch local mma all the time and it happens frequently that a lesser inexperienced fighter will turn away from his opponent in an attack. It isn't a "girl" move, it is an inexperienced move.

The problem is not women, but inexperienced fighters in general. Even Gina, who has had a few fights, had never fought someone who was the same size as her. Why we see so many one-sided matches in women's mma is not because they are girls... it is because there is a lack of depth that leads to mismatches.

_______________________________________
Flame Not, Lest Ye Be Flamed Yourself.

Post #4   8/18/09 11:28:20AM   

postman

Heavyweight Champ

postman Avatar
2

 
 
 


 
 
Posts:6,226
Career:746-420
Joined:Jun 2007
Chips:
1,039

Posted by ncordless

The problem is not that the fighters that are turning away are women. I watch local mma all the time and it happens frequently that a lesser inexperienced fighter will turn away from his opponent in an attack. It isn't a "girl" move, it is an inexperienced move.

The problem is not women, but inexperienced fighters in general. Even Gina, who has had a few fights, had never fought someone who was the same size as her. Why we see so many one-sided matches in women's mma is not because they are girls... it is because there is a lack of depth that leads to mismatches.



Good Point. I have only been to one local show as its new to PA I didn't notice any of it going on but I do remember the first I ever watched a guy go mounted and was getting his face pounded and thinking dude turn over and when he did he was getting the sides of his head punched in and me thinking oh maybe he shouldn't have done that. HaHa funny how you forgrt things like that . If I can give them props to you.

I still think that while you have a very good point being its HUMAN nature to turn from pain......Never mind I'm not sure what I think now.

Post #5   8/18/09 11:39:55AM   

emfleek

FA-Q

emfleek Avatar
11
 
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:18,722
Career:2,245-1,185
Joined:Nov 2007
Camp: The Ringers
Chips:
2,241

Posted by ncordless

The problem is not that the fighters that are turning away are women. I watch local mma all the time and it happens frequently that a lesser inexperienced fighter will turn away from his opponent in an attack. It isn't a "girl" move, it is an inexperienced move.

The problem is not women, but inexperienced fighters in general. Even Gina, who has had a few fights, had never fought someone who was the same size as her. Why we see so many one-sided matches in women's mma is not because they are girls... it is because there is a lack of depth that leads to mismatches.



Very true. Showcasing inexperienced fighters *could* set the sport back. To the "un-trained" eye, it *does* look like a glorified street fight if one fighter is running away and not using technique to defend themselves. In those cases, who does want to watch a one-sided beatdown? It does make MMA seem overly brutal if you're unfamiliar with the sport.

_______________________________________
"I'm like the superhero coming in with the anti-bullsh*t." - Nick Diaz

Post #6   8/18/09 11:46:54AM   

EliasG

In Full Mount

EliasG Avatar
 
 
 


 
 
Posts:586
Career:222-176
Joined:Oct 2007
Chips:
85
I disagree. I can't tell you how many times I have seen fighters tap out, get a TKO on strikes because they are turtled, or give up the back to stop taking shots. It's a double standard to scrutinize women for this if you don't admit that it happens MORE often with men. if we did a statistical analysis of punches thrown, action in a fight, etc... along with percentage of tko's submissions by strikes, etc.. I bet we would end up with finding that women's fights had MORE brawls and far fewer subs by strikes.

It's men's own predilictions and hangups that affect their perception of a women turning. When MOST fighters take serious shots that ring their bell their reaction time gets slower and its ONLY heart and training that causes you to throw back. I just see men go for single leg takedowns when they get hit, turtle up, give up the back, go into full guard, clinch, or run.

Post #7   8/18/09 6:07:51PM   

AchillesHeel

Heavyweight Champ

AchillesHeel Avatar
2

 
 
 


 
 
Posts:3,108
Career:845-448
Joined:Feb 2007
Chips:
603
The author compares women's MMA to the WWE, snuff films, and dog fighting.

What a [douche-bag].

Post #8   8/18/09 7:11:17PM   

mrsmiley

Heavyweight Champ

mrsmiley Avatar
4



 
 
 


 
 
Posts:4,291
Career:1,446-842
Joined:Apr 2007
Camp: Nutthuggers Suck
Chips:
638
One thing I will say in defense of womans MMA,inparticularly Gina and Cyborg,is the fact we got a very anticipated and hyped fight that wasn't past its expiration date.
Even if the fight itself didn't live up to the hype,at least we got to see it when the idea was still fresh out of the oven.

Post #9   8/18/09 7:52:06PM   

postman

Heavyweight Champ

postman Avatar
2

 
 
 


 
 
Posts:6,226
Career:746-420
Joined:Jun 2007
Chips:
1,039

Posted by EliasG

I disagree. I can't tell you how many times I have seen fighters tap out, get a TKO on strikes because they are turtled, or give up the back to stop taking shots. It's a double standard to scrutinize women for this if you don't admit that it happens MORE often with men. if we did a statistical analysis of punches thrown, action in a fight, etc... along with percentage of tko's submissions by strikes, etc.. I bet we would end up with finding that women's fights had MORE brawls and far fewer subs by strikes.

It's men's own predilictions and hangups that affect their perception of a women turning. When MOST fighters take serious shots that ring their bell their reaction time gets slower and its ONLY heart and training that causes you to throw back. I just see men go for single leg takedowns when they get hit, turtle up, give up the back, go into full guard, clinch, or run.



Pulling Guard or Clinching have nothing to do with standing on your feet and instead of firing punches back, you turn your head and put one hand out in the air. Turtleing happens for sure maily when the fight has ended and its your last form of defense. You can not say that top level men fighters run from punches. Maybe in smaller shows but it almost never happens in the UFC, Dream ,Strikeforce, now we most defenitly saw Gina cause other woman to run and she wanted to do it agianst Cyborg. I'm sure one of the above posts was right that its more about quilty of fighter then gender but thats where it is right now.

Post #10   8/19/09 8:23:52AM