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"Anderson Sucks/ Is OverRated" Blah Blah Blah...

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Jackelope

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I have to laugh at some of the parallels being drawn here. Let's get one thing perfectly clear that I don't think people are realizing-

Thales Leites not engaging Anderson Silva on the feet is the EXACT same as Anderson Silva being unwilling to enter Thales Leites' guard. One fighter knows the other is good in one area, so they're unwilling to get into a fight there.

So, now that we've established both are to blame for the lack of engagement, let's discuss why and what went wrong. First of all, I do blame poor matchmaking for the fight turning out the way it did. We all knew instantaneously that this was a terrible matchup for Thales. He shouldn't have won against Marquardt, and he had no business in there against Anderson. How the UFC could possibly decide to go through with that matchup is completely beyond me.

I agree with those who say if you want the champions' belt, you've got to come for it. However, I also agree with those who say if Anderson Silva wants to be considered the G.O.A.T. (which has become quite the popular term) he needs to put on performances that warrant him that moniker. I think the UFC going on their anti-Fedor hype spree is backfiring against them. They're so busy calling Anderson the P4P best no question, that they're literally digging their own grave underneath themselves. Anderson Silva, unfortunately, seems to be falling right into that trap. His mocking of his opponent was so blatant and unprofessional that it drove me nuts. How can you mock someone for doing essentially the exact same thing you're doing?

To the people saying Thales was flopping onto his back- Yes, he was. He was falling down while up against the cage and attempting to grab at one of Anderson's legs so he could perform either a leglock or a sweep from the ground. Make no mistake- this is no different than Anderson Silva atttacking with low risk, low reward moves of his own. Attacking the legs because its easy and it puts him in little danger. Falling down on your back to grab at legs because it's easy and it puts you in little danger. These are the same thing, just a different medium. Again, the only difference is that Anderson holds the belt, and Thales wants it, so he should go after it.

Post #16   4/19/09 11:26:19AM   

Franklinfan47

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Anderson Silva is not overated, he just a had a lackluster performance. Both guys were tentative and unwilling to enter into eachothers games, and unfortunately thats just how fights go down sometimes. Does it suck for fans? of course, but hopefully he'll just be that much more exciting next time.

Post #17   4/19/09 11:31:26AM   

State_Champ

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Posted by Jackelope

I have to laugh at some of the parallels being drawn here. Let's get one thing perfectly clear that I don't think people are realizing-

Thales Leites not engaging Anderson Silva on the feet is the EXACT same as Anderson Silva being unwilling to enter Thales Leites' guard. One fighter knows the other is good in one area, so they're unwilling to get into a fight there.




imo it is the challenger's responsibility to take the fight to the champ because the the champion has something the challenger should want. On the other hand, the champion is perfectly in the right to play a conservative game and stay away from his opponents because champ needs to keep the belt.

Post #18   4/19/09 11:32:56AM   

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Posted by State_Champ


Posted by Jackelope

I have to laugh at some of the parallels being drawn here. Let's get one thing perfectly clear that I don't think people are realizing-

Thales Leites not engaging Anderson Silva on the feet is the EXACT same as Anderson Silva being unwilling to enter Thales Leites' guard. One fighter knows the other is good in one area, so they're unwilling to get into a fight there.




imo it is the challenger's responsibility to take the fight to the champ because the the champion has something the challenger should want. On the other hand, the champion is perfectly in the right to play a conservative game and stay away from his opponents because champ needs to keep the belt.



If you read the rest of the original post you'll see that I agree

Post #19   4/19/09 11:35:57AM   

SociopathX

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here's what i Saw.

1. You have Anderson Silva's oppenent who is obviously so fricken scared of the Spider's power he will NOT ENGAGE. He went almost full rounds without throwing a punch (scared he'd be countered and TKO'd probably).

2. Every time Silva started putting together a combo (especially in the mid to later rounds) before he could do any damage Leites just went down on his own. He'd fall down on purpose to avoid it.

IT's Leites's fault the fight was slow or boring or w/e people want to call it. I still found it fun to watch Silva literally play with him like a tiger toying with it's prey. Every fight of Silva's is a great fight imo.

Post #20   4/19/09 11:46:12AM   

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I said recently that in the Cote fight Anderson was starting to fight "cute" and caught a little flack for it.
I definitely do not retract my statement. Anderson Silva is a great fighter, but until he gets past this "shucking and jiving" "cuteness" garbage he is doing right now it's hard to think of him as the 1 p4p.

Punching the leg and hammerfisting the ankle are not the kind of offense the best employ. Would GSP or Fedor ever do crap like that?

I love Genki Sudo, but he was never a top fighter because he was too gimmicky and cute. Anderson has looked alot like Genki recently.

Anderson is really reminding me of Roy Jones Jr. in his prime right now... maybe they should box.

I recognize that neither Cote or Thales offered much offense, but that is going to be the way people fight Anderson. Limit the exchanges as much as possible, play defense, and try to take the fight to the ground. If Anderson is going to literally dance around waiting for his opponent to engage him on the feet he should think about "Dancing with the Stars" where his talents will be appreciated.

Last edited 4/19/09 11:59AM server time by ncordless
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Post #21   4/19/09 11:53:10AM   

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I understand the "being champ, being challenger" and "who should bring the fight" situation.

But still, I think that it is really disrespectful on BOTH fighters to bring that kind of fights to the fans like me that spend $$ on the PPV and the fans that laid down more than that to see it live there. I know it sounds kind of weird logic b/c you dont know what will happen in an event, but for Silva this was the second time in a row, and the "I'll perform better next time" has been said twice already...

Post #22   4/19/09 12:26:17PM   

Mattchoo

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Looks to me that someone is a little bored with the poor level of competition they'r being fed. He probably sees fighting Leites as disrespectful to his superior skill set so in return gives a fight like that were he didnt look like he was trying in many cases, nor putting much effort in or respect to his opponent.

But as soon as he gets a high caliber fighter like Franklin or Henderson he puts on a fantastic performance and rinses them inside 2 rounds.

He gives what he gets basicly its pretty damn obvious to me.

Post #23   4/19/09 12:44:52PM   

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I said it in the spoilers forum so I'll say it here, I was following the mmajunkie play by play and from what it said, it sounded like anderson was doing his basic disrespectful thing like hands on the hips, "bobbing and weaving" (which to me is just extremely arrogant.) walking forward with his hands down. I don't care if you are the best or the worst fighter, someone came to fight you, so fight them.

now leites didn't do much better, he wanted to try to get the fight to the ground, he tried and failed repeatedly, but wasn't as disrespectful to anderson as anderson was to him.

my post in the spoilers thread:




from the live updates on mmajunkie, sounds like anderson is extremely arrogant and refusing to engage. I picked anderson but from what it sounds like, he NEEDS to lose. he has forgotten how to be humble.




mmajunkie didn't make it clear that leites wasn't engaging like anderson was. but still he was at least trying to make a fight where he was comfortable. anderson didn't care he was toying with leites. when is he going to "do better"? I'm still waiting. I might not like him but when he puts on a good fight at least he can be entertaining.

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Post #24   4/19/09 12:51:55PM   

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When he gets an opponent worthy enough to get in there and fight him properly ala Franklin, Henderson, Marquart he might put on a great showing. He doesnt train for months to walk in there and destroy somebody in under 2 minutes who shouldnt even be fighting him in the first place. Hell if i was Anderson id be doing the exact same thing.

Post #25   4/19/09 1:05:02PM   

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Both fighters are to blame for a bad fight imo, but......................Anderson is said to be p4p best right now, a creative striker, a devastating attack game, 80% of his shots land. So if he is this great best ever fighter then he should have been able to put on a better show & shouldn't have to wait for his opponent to attack first & then counter. A great striker will attack you. If he trully is the best then he shouldn't have to wait, plain & simple imo, i know alot will disagree, thats ok. The solution to me is move him up to LHW. Game over

Post #26   4/19/09 1:34:09PM   

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it shouldn't matter who he has to fight. he is being paid to fight not to prance around and taunt.

and about the "putting himself in harms way" argument, he is a fighter, when you get in the cage, ring, etc. to are always in harms way. IMO both fighters in a title match should put themselves in harms way. a challenger should be trying to take the title from the champ. the champ should do everything in his power to stop that from happening. and that doesn't mean dancing around bobbing and standing around with his hands on his hips.

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Post #27   4/19/09 1:40:44PM   

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Posted by Mattchoo

Looks to me that someone is a little bored with the poor level of competition they'r being fed. He probably sees fighting Leites as disrespectful to his superior skill set so in return gives a fight like that were he didnt look like he was trying in many cases, nor putting much effort in or respect to his opponent.

But as soon as he gets a high caliber fighter like Franklin or Henderson he puts on a fantastic performance and rinses them inside 2 rounds.

He gives what he gets basicly its pretty damn obvious to me.



That's what I saw as well. He could've ended the fight whenever he chose to...he chose not to. He wasn't choosing low risk attacks, he was choosing attacks that just pestered his opponent without taking him out. He would punch him in the face now and then to remind Thales that he was in a fight, but he just toyed with him the whole time. Why punch someone in the leg from a standing position? It's much riskier than punching someone in the face...and there's less reward to boot. He did it because he could. I just hope his next opponent is up to par, or I have a feeling we'll see another one of these type of fights.

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Post #28   4/19/09 2:02:26PM   

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They need to put him up against a solid LHW. Cane, Vera or Thiago Silva... someone who will take the fight to him and not be scared to bang.

I think him fighting Evans / Rampage or even Machida would all be good fights as well but I don't think any of those fights would ever happen.

Post #29   4/19/09 2:19:17PM   

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Posted by grappler0000


Posted by Mattchoo

Looks to me that someone is a little bored with the poor level of competition they'r being fed. He probably sees fighting Leites as disrespectful to his superior skill set so in return gives a fight like that were he didnt look like he was trying in many cases, nor putting much effort in or respect to his opponent.

But as soon as he gets a high caliber fighter like Franklin or Henderson he puts on a fantastic performance and rinses them inside 2 rounds.

He gives what he gets basicly its pretty damn obvious to me.



That's what I saw as well. He could've ended the fight whenever he chose to...he chose not to. He wasn't choosing low risk attacks, he was choosing attacks that just pestered his opponent without taking him out. He would punch him in the face now and then to remind Thales that he was in a fight, but he just toyed with him the whole time. Why punch someone in the leg from a standing position? It's much riskier than punching someone in the face...and there's less reward to boot. He did it because he could. I just hope his next opponent is up to par, or I have a feeling we'll see another one of these type of fights.



Exactly, someone of Andersons caliber can hit you when and wherever he likes. How is it not that obvious that he is deliberately fighting like that due to his sheer boredom? I see it all the time at training, he's fighting Cote and Leites like an advanced kickboxer fighting a very beginner in sparring.

UFC in my eyes are disrespecting his skills and should either get in some major talent to challenge him or move him up straight to a top contender spot in the LHW's. Theyr wasting him at middleweight aslong as they keep up with these opponents.

Hes not even one of my favourite fighters and it pisses me off with what people come out with like them sherdog links and how the UFC are treating him in terms of fights..

Post #30   4/19/09 2:44:26PM   
 
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