ARLOVSKI AGREES WITH STAND-UP, LOOKS TO FEDOR |
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MMA Sensei
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Career record: 121-59
Season: 55-15 (#42)
Location: Massachusetts
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“Before the fight we had a meeting with the ref and he said, so guys – and the UFC have the same and Affliction – you have 30 seconds to improve your position,” he said. “So I was pretty comfortable, I knew that I am safe. He was on top of me, but I controlled the situation.”
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Post #1 10/9/08 6:28:03PM
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MMA Sensei
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Career record: 121-59
Season: 55-15 (#42)
Location: Massachusetts
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I understand the need to kep the action moving, particularly to keep casual fans interested in a fight, but it sucks for hardcore MMA fans as well as fighters that the sport gets watered down to appease casual viewers and make it more watchable.
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Post #2 10/9/08 6:31:50PM
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aaa9erh8er
In Full Mount
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Career record: 115-80
Season: 37-33 (#3964)
Location: 707 CALi
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i honestly think that if you get into a stalmate its your own fault and you need to fight threw it
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Post #3 10/9/08 6:43:21PM
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BANNED
Career record: 116-60
Season: 45-21 (#854)
Location:
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im tired of all the stand up BS.
yeah it was early, but nelson should shut up about it
it's like when i fight goes to decision & the guy u KNOW won the fight loses by split decision
yeah, he mightve deserved it, but he left it in the judges hands & he lost. end of story
yeah nelson might have deserved to keep his position, but he looked inactive, he didnt be looking to go for anything in particular, & not once while he had AA down did he attempt to throw an elbow, punch, or even try to hurt him\
im not saying it was fair, im just saying that he couldve done more
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Post #4 10/9/08 6:48:01PM
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RMFG_187
MMA Sensei
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Career record: 129-84
Season: 38-24 (#1754)
Location: Toronto, Canada
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30 seconds hmmm. it was only 14.
If arlovski was on the other end, he would start an outcry, but because most of the people who watch the EXC show had no clue who Nelson was, they sided with the ref.
THANK GOD there will be no more EXC bullshit on CBS anymore.
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Post #5 10/9/08 7:10:34PM
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Obey The Stank-Nasty
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Career record: 144-84
Season: 43-26 (#1754)
Location: Los Angeles, CA
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(Hey look at me I'm a casual fan)"BOO"
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Rest In Peace Evan Tanner...
Props To Grappler0000 for making the Stank-A-Tar
Bas "El Guapo" Rutten: "Godspeed and Party On"
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Post #6 10/9/08 7:18:38PM
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postman
MMA Sensei
Career record: 149-93
Season: 42-28 (#1631)
Location: Delmont ,Pa
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It was side controll the only way to advance is to mount so if you mount a guy you have to do something in 30 seconds or they are going to stand you up?
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Post #7 10/9/08 7:24:52PM
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The Origional Playground Bully
Career record: 181-100
Season: 51-19 (#22)
Location: Minnesota
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you have 30 seconds to improve your position
just curious...How much more can you improve your position from side control? A lot of guys would rather work from there than mount even. If Nelson felt as though he had the best position possible to work from, then why should anyone tell him that he has to "Improve his position."
I understand that the ref meant he needed to work and stay busy. But if he wants to bring his submission game, it's going to take a little more then 30 seconds to impliment that game plan.
What truely saddens me is the fact that every casual fan who watched this dibacle of a show comes away with a very tilted and dirty impression of what true MMA is suposed to be. Makes me sick.
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And as El Guapo always says- "God speed, and party on. Whoap!"
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Post #8 10/9/08 7:26:02PM
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nickcuc547
MMA Sensei
Career record: 219-128
Season: 45-25 (#813)
Location:
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nelson wouldn't have gotten a kimura anyways. but i do agree you can't stand a guy up if they are in side control under any circumstance unless they are pulling an ausuerrio silva against chieck kongo.
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Post #9 10/9/08 7:40:04PM
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mkiv9secsupra
MMA Sensei
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Career record: 211-136
Season: 41-29 (#1810)
Location: ATL, GA
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Posted by aaa9erh8er
i honestly think that if you get into a stalmate its your own fault and you need to fight threw it
If you get into a stalemate then there is obviously not going to be a winner. The only way to get through a stalemate without giving a fighter a more dominant grapplng position is to stand them up. A real MMA fighter should be able to get the fight back to the ground if he needs to.
Nelson did nothing to warrant the fight staying on the ground. He had extremly limited GnP attempts and only a couple of submission attempts in the entirety of the ground fight.
Last edited 10/9/08 10:17PM by mkiv9secsupra
Edit note/reason: n/a
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Post #10 10/9/08 10:12:46PM
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Wolf
MMA Regular
Career record: 204-120
Season: 35-29 (#3170)
Location: Indianapolis, IN
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Posted by mkiv9secsupra
Posted by aaa9erh8er
i honestly think that if you get into a stalmate its your own fault and you need to fight threw it
If you get into a stalemate then there is obviously not going to be a winner. The only way to get through a stalemate without giving a fighter a more dominant grapplng position is to stand them up. A real MMA fighter should be able to get the fight back to the ground if he needs to.
Nelson did nothing to warrant the fight staying on the ground. He had extremly limited GnP attempts and only a couple of submission attempts in the entirety of the ground fight.
The thing is, it wasn't a stalemate. Side-Control is a TOTALLY dominant position. You're basically on top of the guy controlling him completely. He has no control over your body whatsoever. It may be boring, but it's control and thus winning the fight. I don't care if he falls asleep. You should never, EVER, stand someone up from side control. It is totally on the other guy to escape or recover guard. At least guard is a neutral position. That's why you can stand the fight up from there. Each guy has some semblance of control over the other. So if nothing happens, stand them up.
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Post #11 10/9/08 10:58:33PM
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jocka
Standup Guy
Career record: 128-96
Season: 35-33 (#3044)
Location:
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Personnaly i l take cross side (side control) over mount anyday so i don't understand why they stood them up cause it is a very dominant position
IMO they should never stand fighters up. Even if its the most boring fight ever, it happends plus its mma, its up to fighter on the bottom to work for a sweep/reversal or a scramble to get back up to his feet.
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Post #12 10/10/08 11:25:04AM
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MaxOne
MMA Regular
Career record: 121-92
Season: 24-29 (#4780)
Location: San Diego
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Nelson was in an excellent position. Having them stand up was a horrible call on the refs part.
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Post #13 10/10/08 12:36:59PM
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The People's Mod
Career record: 152-91
Season: 47-23 (#137)
Location: Getting choked out or arm barred
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Standing up to avoid LnP should be completely based on posturing, improvement of position, and attempt at finishing.
Since good GnP and many submissions require posturing (whether it be from side control, mount, guard, whatever) that is a number one criteria refs should be looking for. Not to mention that the top game opens up subs for the bottom game when the top player postures.
Second to posturing should be improvement of position. The knee sliding over either the arm for crucifix or the hips for full mount should come next.
Third should be movement towards submissions. It is possible to secure certain submissions from a non-postured position in side control (arm triangles, kimuras, americanas, etc.)
I don't agree with standups at all, but to me often times it seems like refs don't look for basic criteria like the ones mentioned above. Granted, if a guy is stuck going for one submission and getting stopped at every opportunity then it should be stood up. However, it's important to give guys time to work.
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"It is a shame that in this society we've been taught to judge a man's worth by what he owns instead of who he is." - Evan Tanner
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Post #14 10/10/08 12:58:05PM
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NeaRMisS
MMA Regular
Career record: 62-50
Season: 3-8 (#8687)
Location:
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Maybe if they actually get some refs with a backround and understand that sidecontrol is in fact a GREAT position then we wont be seeing 14 second stand ups.
I really hope the UFC / Future promotions take on pride rules a bit more. The yellow card system was great for this imo.
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Post #15 10/10/08 1:01:43PM
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