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richieb19's MMA Hall of Fame (20/02/07)

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JunCTion

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Posted by richieb19


Posted by Snacks


Posted by richieb19


Posted by Snacks


Posted by richieb19


Posted by Snacks

Also, I'd have given you props had you mentioned ANY of the old school Shooters, as opposed to the useless Pancrase fighters who worked fights.

PARAESTRA SAIKOU!

Thats a little harsh, and claiming that old Pancrase fighters performed worked shoots in Pancrase is very misinformed.



Ken Shamrock and Masakatsu Funaki disagree.

Really, and what proof of that do you have? Aside from popular claims that people make, there has never been one recorded work that I've ever heard about in Pancrase. I agree that there most likely has been worked shoots in the Pancrase org, but they have also been claimed in both the UFC and Pride. So please either come up with some useful information to back up your claim, or just keep your imaginary facts to yourself...




Rickson is 400-0, Takada legitimately beat Coleman, Otsuka, and Sturgeon; Kimo submitted Sakuraba, and Dan Severen is one of the most legitimate fighters in all of MMA..

Oh, and Shamrock-Hume continues to a shining example of what Pancrase is all about.



Coleman hinted to letting Takada beat him so it's no big surprize there. I don't even think Sakuraba / Kimo was never even billed as an MMA match to start with, and how does Rickson's inflated record relate to a worked bout?

Last I remember Shamrock / Hume was called an exhibition match due to Hume having been injured before the fight. Either way, the only that fight has ever been concidered a work is because of Shamrock's finish on Hume, which IMO isn't much of a reason at all seeing as Ken hugely outweighed and outpowered Hume, and had an American Pro-Wrestling background long before joining Pancrase.




19, your getting pretty worked up when snacks is only abiding by what your disclaimer said.


Posted by richieb19

Disclaimer: Please realize that the list mentioned above is completely subjective, but if you feel that I have left something important out, please add. If you wish to mention a fighter who you think is deserving of being in this list, please feel free to share.



Last edited 2/21/07 7:16PM server time by JunCTion
Edit note/reason: n/a

Post #31   2/21/07 7:14:47PM   

richieb19

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Posted by Snacks


Posted by richieb19


Posted by Snacks


Posted by richieb19


Posted by Snacks


Posted by richieb19


Posted by Snacks

Also, I'd have given you props had you mentioned ANY of the old school Shooters, as opposed to the useless Pancrase fighters who worked fights.

PARAESTRA SAIKOU!

Thats a little harsh, and claiming that old Pancrase fighters performed worked shoots in Pancrase is very misinformed.



Ken Shamrock and Masakatsu Funaki disagree.

Really, and what proof of that do you have? Aside from popular claims that people make, there has never been one recorded work that I've ever heard about in Pancrase. I agree that there most likely has been worked shoots in the Pancrase org, but they have also been claimed in both the UFC and Pride. So please either come up with some useful information to back up your claim, or just keep your imaginary facts to yourself...



Rickson is 400-0, Takada legitimately beat Coleman, Otsuka, and Sturgeon; Kimo submitted Sakuraba, and Dan Severen is one of the most legitimate fighters in all of MMA..

Oh, and Shamrock-Hume continues to a shining example of what Pancrase is all about.



Coleman hinted to letting Takada beat him so it's no big surprize there. I don't even think Sakuraba / Kimo was ever even billed as an MMA match to start with, and how does Rickson's inflated record relate to a worked bout?

Last I remember Shamrock / Hume was called an exhibition match due to Hume having been injured before the fight. Either way, the only reason that fight has ever been concidered a work is because of Shamrock's finish on Hume, which IMO isn't much of a reason at all seeing as Ken hugely outweighed and outpowered Hume, and had an American Pro-Wrestling background long before joining Pancrase.



Pancrase has stated they had worked matches, I REALLY hope you realize that.



The only thing I've ever heard is them not denying having had worked matches, which really means the same thing anyways. I just don't understand how this makes you think that all (or a majority) fights in Pancrase where works. The only ones I've ever heard that where rumoured to be worked (and remember, it's just a rumour) are the following:

Ken Shamrock Vs. Matt Hume: Because of the suplex finish.
Ken Shamrock Vs. Minoru Suzuki II: Because people thought that Panrcase didn't want their champion to lose in a title fight in the UFC.
Masakatsu Funaki Vs. Jason Delucia: Because Delucia won via kneebar.
Masakatsu Funaki Vs. Minoru Suzuki: Not even sure why.

...and maybe a few that I might be forgetting

You have to realize that these are all rumours that got out of hand when people got wind that Pancrase did in fact have worked shoots, there is no legitamate proof that suggests that any of these fights where works. Secondly Funaki, being the creator of the organization and a much better fighter than most at the time carried many fights in order to build stars, carrying a fight also does not equate to a work.

Post #32   2/21/07 7:24:36PM   

richieb19

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Posted by JunCTion
19, your getting pretty worked up when snacks is only abiding by what your disclaimer said.


No, I'm getting worked up because hes trying to pass rumour off as truth. Claiming that a fighter worked fights without any proof is disrespectful.

Post #33   2/21/07 7:26:23PM   

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Posted by richieb19


Posted by JunCTion
19, your getting pretty worked up when snacks is only abiding by what your disclaimer said.


No, I'm getting worked up because hes trying to pass rumour off as truth. Claiming that a fighter worked fights without any proof is disrespectful.



well i dont know either way but this has become a richieb19 vs snacks thread.
but i do like your opening thoughts

Post #34   2/21/07 7:36:49PM   

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PROPS ANSWER FROM HIPPYSMACKER (MOD)

You can only give a second one to somebody after you have given out 10 total. There is a limit of like 8 to 10 a day( not sure of the exact number. I give them out all the time( becsuse I have to read every post and see a lot of good stuff) and every day it tells me that I can't give them to someone and I've usually reached the limit in a 24 hour period. I try to give prop's to not only good post, but someon posting a good interview and especially someone trying to make peace or town down a thread where 2 guys are "Sherdogging " it. Hope that helps


Last edited 2/22/07 1:09AM server time by hippysmacker
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Post #35   2/22/07 1:04:49AM   

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Posted by Lay_N_Pray

I love that list, but I think you should add Pat Militech as a coach in the HOF. He has had plenty of champions in his camp



Good point, I second that notion. He was also the first UFC welterweight champ and had the most successful title defenses till Hughes broke it at that weight.

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Post #36   2/22/07 2:47:12AM   

richieb19

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Posted by hippysmacker


Posted by Lay_N_Pray

I love that list, but I think you should add Pat Militech as a coach in the HOF. He has had plenty of champions in his camp



Good point, I second that notion. He was also the first UFC welterweight champ and had the most successful title defenses till Hughes broke it at that weight.

Yeah but I don't actually believe he deserved the win over Burnett at Ultimate Brazil to become the first LW Champion, so it kinda starts the whole thing off on a bad note.

Post #37   2/22/07 8:11:48AM   

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Agree to disagree then.

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Post #38   2/22/07 3:00:19PM   

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Posted by Lay_N_Pray

I love that list, but I think you should add Pat Militech as a coach in the HOF. He has had plenty of champions in his camp


Yeah some guys should be added just gor that reason. MFS is clearly one of those sick camps like Team Punishment or Greg Jacksons.

I gotta say Bas and Pat are in the Same League. In the UFC they both accomplished about hte same (Bas did do Pancrase) and they both are known for producign top level fighters. I think MFS even a bit mroe so.

Post #39   2/22/07 3:30:40PM   

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How About adding Cro Cop ? I think hes worthy of being mentioned as long with Big Nog. Or is it too soon to add them ?

Post #40   2/22/07 8:47:27PM   

richieb19

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Posted by RichBoy

How About adding Cro Cop ? I think hes worthy of being mentioned as long with Big Nog. Or is it too soon to add them ?

CroCop is on the list... Nogueira was one of the many guys I was on the fence about... but if he beats Barnett in the third match or has a good year in '07 hes earned a spot in any mma hof...

Post #41   2/23/07 12:05:38AM   

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Posted by richieb19


Posted by RichBoy

How About adding Cro Cop ? I think hes worthy of being mentioned as long with Big Nog. Or is it too soon to add them ?

CroCop is on the list... Nogueira was one of the many guys I was on the fence about... but if he beats Barnett in the third match or has a good year in '07 hes earned a spot in any mma hof...


Oh crap forgot he was already on it .

Post #42   2/23/07 1:17:36AM   

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Anyone on steroids shouldn't be on that list IMO.

Post #43   2/23/07 8:30:53AM   

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Posted by MMA

Anyone on steroids shouldn't be on that list IMO.


I didnt know there were any proven cases on there. It was thought that Ken did them big time back in the day. And Wand has been accused of doing them often. i don't think anyone else there has been accused of doping.

Post #44   2/23/07 8:39:05AM   

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Posted by madmarck


Posted by MMA

Anyone on steroids shouldn't be on that list IMO.


I didnt know there were any proven cases on there. It was thought that Ken did them big time back in the day. And Wand has been accused of doing them often. i don't think anyone else there has been accused of doping.

Shamrock has spoken out against steroids in MMA, saying that they hinder you more than they help. He obviously took them in his stint in the WWF, but I'm honestly not sure if he ever took them during his MMA career.

Post #45   2/23/07 12:09:02PM   
 
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