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Say it isn't so Shogun
Say it isn't so Shogun |
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cmill21
Heavyweight Champ
Career record: 369-196
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Regina SK
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Posted by zephead
Posted by cmill21
Posted by zephead
Posted by Copenhagen
I should make a thread about "I told you so" for Chuck. That way I can be cool too.
No, just continue to dog Chuck in thread after thread. You're cool doing that, right?
Everyone smashing the Pride guys, whats wrong with giving the UFC's golden boy a little bit of the same?
That's been going on from the get. Before the buying of Pride, it was "Pride is the best. Pride fighters would kill UFC fighters." And then when the UFC bought Pride and and Pride fighters were coming over, it "Shogun will wipe up. Mirko will dominate. UFC fighters suck."
But lo and behold, Pride fighters aren't doing good. Now the shoe is on the other foot and it don't feel to good, does it?
I don't know I wasn't on here until well after that happend. What I do know if how well UFC guys who wen't to pride did. Look at how Mirko did against people who were UFC champs, and how well he did against the guy who dominated Randy. It's a pointless argument, but one thing I do know is rampage was never able to hold a belt in Pride and now he's got one in the UFC, and anderson was barley able to go win half of his fights in Pride, now he's got the UFC belt. Odd....
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Post #16 9/23/07 10:07:48PM
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nubby
Banned
Career record: 206-111
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Bay Area
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Posted by cmill21
Posted by zephead
Posted by cmill21
Posted by zephead
Posted by Copenhagen
I should make a thread about "I told you so" for Chuck. That way I can be cool too.
No, just continue to dog Chuck in thread after thread. You're cool doing that, right?
Everyone smashing the Pride guys, whats wrong with giving the UFC's golden boy a little bit of the same?
That's been going on from the get. Before the buying of Pride, it was "Pride is the best. Pride fighters would kill UFC fighters." And then when the UFC bought Pride and and Pride fighters were coming over, it "Shogun will wipe up. Mirko will dominate. UFC fighters suck."
But lo and behold, Pride fighters aren't doing good. Now the shoe is on the other foot and it don't feel to good, does it?
I don't know I wasn't on here until well after that happend. What I do know if how well UFC guys who wen't to pride did. Look at how Mirko did against people who were UFC champs, and how well he did against the guy who dominated Randy. It's a pointless argument, but one thing I do know is rampage was never able to hold a belt in Pride and now he's got one in the UFC, and anderson was barley able to go win half of his fights in Pride, now he's got the UFC belt. Odd....
And yet weren't you the one that disagreed with me that UFC and Pride are two different beasts?
It's really not that odd at all, to me it just means that Pride was AAA and UFC is the big leagues.
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Post #17 9/23/07 11:04:17PM
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Lay_N_Pray
In Full Mount
Career record: 206-117
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location:
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SHUT THE HELL UP ABOUT PRIDE VS UFC
What the hell is wrong with you people...thread after thread its the same bs, get over yourselves and please just f'n admit the fighter who fights the best wins the damn fight. I dont care if your from Pride, UFC, IFL, Jane Adams Hull House, Mars, or the local YMCA.
Shut the hell up everyone about "he holds a title here he couldnt do it there"...it makes no difference. Page is betternow then compared to before, Cro Cop was better before...I dont care and either do most people!!!!!
For us true lovers of the sport...we dont care if Martha Stewart promotes the fight, we dont care if its in Japan or America, a ring or a cage...and we RESPECT not just one group, but EVERYONE who makes the sacrifice and has the incredible gift to perform at the highest level.
So shame on all who disrespect one group of people for who they fought for and where it was...its close minded and prejudice and ignorant. Learn to accept all groups of people...it applies in all aspects of life
Thank You
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Post #18 9/23/07 11:05:42PM
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cmill21
Heavyweight Champ
Career record: 369-196
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Regina SK
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Posted by nubby
Posted by cmill21
Posted by zephead
Posted by cmill21
Posted by zephead
Posted by Copenhagen
I should make a thread about "I told you so" for Chuck. That way I can be cool too.
No, just continue to dog Chuck in thread after thread. You're cool doing that, right?
Everyone smashing the Pride guys, whats wrong with giving the UFC's golden boy a little bit of the same?
That's been going on from the get. Before the buying of Pride, it was "Pride is the best. Pride fighters would kill UFC fighters." And then when the UFC bought Pride and and Pride fighters were coming over, it "Shogun will wipe up. Mirko will dominate. UFC fighters suck."
But lo and behold, Pride fighters aren't doing good. Now the shoe is on the other foot and it don't feel to good, does it?
I don't know I wasn't on here until well after that happend. What I do know if how well UFC guys who wen't to pride did. Look at how Mirko did against people who were UFC champs, and how well he did against the guy who dominated Randy. It's a pointless argument, but one thing I do know is rampage was never able to hold a belt in Pride and now he's got one in the UFC, and anderson was barley able to go win half of his fights in Pride, now he's got the UFC belt. Odd....
And yet weren't you the one that disagreed with me that UFC and Pride are two different beasts?
It's really not that odd at all, to me it just means that Pride was AAA and UFC is the big leagues.
What? I've said for the longest time that the UFC favours grapplers, while pride favord strikers....The UFC looked like the big's when Rizzo, chuck, ricco and those guys wen't there and got their asses kicked after doing pretty well in the UFC. Then Barney who was the UFC champ beating the hero Randy, Randleman was also the UFC, Coleman won UFC tourney's, shamrock didn't do that well over there. Rampage and Anderson did not dominate, now they are. If you want to make an argument besides, shogun gassed and Mirko doesn't look like he used to then please do, until then save your crappy arguments of "I think this is how it is."
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Post #19 9/23/07 11:09:00PM
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cmill21
Heavyweight Champ
Career record: 369-196
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Regina SK
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Posted by Lay_N_Pray
SHUT THE HELL UP ABOUT PRIDE VS UFC
What the hell is wrong with you people...thread after thread its the same bs, get over yourselves and please just f'n admit the fighter who fights the best wins the damn fight. I dont care if your from Pride, UFC, IFL, Jane Adams Hull House, Mars, or the local YMCA.
Shut the hell up everyone about "he holds a title here he couldnt do it there"...it makes no difference. Page is betternow then compared to before, Cro Cop was better before...I dont care and either do most people!!!!!
For us true lovers of the sport...we dont care if Martha Stewart promotes the fight, we dont care if its in Japan or America, a ring or a cage...and we RESPECT not just one group, but EVERYONE who makes the sacrifice and has the incredible gift to perform at the highest level.
So shame on all who disrespect one group of people for who they fought for and where it was...its close minded and prejudice and ignorant. Learn to accept all groups of people...it applies in all aspects of life
Thank You
Nice post. I do respect all fighters, I don't necissarily like all of them, but I do have alot of UFC fighters that I love. I like the style of pride better, and I feel it takes more skill to be successful in a ring then a cage because you can't use the cage to trap people and lean them against and punch, that's my opinion.
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Post #20 9/23/07 11:21:44PM
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Mastodon2
MMA Sensei
Career record: 188-114
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Newcastle England
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Posted by cmill21
What? I've said for the longest time that the UFC favours grapplers, while pride favord strikers....The UFC looked like the big's when Rizzo, chuck, ricco and those guys wen't there and got their asses kicked after doing pretty well in the UFC. Then Barney who was the UFC champ beating the hero Randy, Randleman was also the UFC, Coleman won UFC tourney's, shamrock didn't do that well over there. Rampage and Anderson did not dominate, now they are. If you want to make an argument besides, shogun gassed and Mirko doesn't look like he used to then please do, until then save your crappy arguments of "I think this is how it is."
"Unable to give props to this user again, you must spread the love first"
Total truth man.
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Post #21 9/24/07 2:51:08AM
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CwB
MMA Sensei
Career record: 221-151
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Sin Sh*tty
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Posted by cmill21
Posted by Lay_N_Pray
SHUT THE HELL UP ABOUT PRIDE VS UFC
What the hell is wrong with you people...thread after thread its the same bs, get over yourselves and please just f'n admit the fighter who fights the best wins the damn fight. I dont care if your from Pride, UFC, IFL, Jane Adams Hull House, Mars, or the local YMCA.
Shut the hell up everyone about "he holds a title here he couldnt do it there"...it makes no difference. Page is betternow then compared to before, Cro Cop was better before...I dont care and either do most people!!!!!
For us true lovers of the sport...we dont care if Martha Stewart promotes the fight, we dont care if its in Japan or America, a ring or a cage...and we RESPECT not just one group, but EVERYONE who makes the sacrifice and has the incredible gift to perform at the highest level.
So shame on all who disrespect one group of people for who they fought for and where it was...its close minded and prejudice and ignorant. Learn to accept all groups of people...it applies in all aspects of life
Thank You
Nice post. I do respect all fighters, I don't necissarily like all of them, but I do have alot of UFC fighters that I love. I like the style of pride better, and I feel it takes more skill to be successful in a ring then a cage because you can't use the cage to trap people and lean them against and punch, that's my opinion.
trapping people against a cage is just a different aspect of the fight game, some fighters can use it to there advantage others cant.
also anderson silva is a striker but he is doing better in a cage instead of a ring, so maybe the cage doesnt favor all grapplers.
and i agree 100% that fighters change. Anderson silva and Rampage look way better now then they have ever looked in there entire careers. Liddell didnt lose to only a pride fighter he also lost to a ufc fighter so to say orgs determine the fighter and not where they are in there careers as far as being in there prime or not is kinda dumb.
(i think shogun is still in his prime, but not being able to soccer kick oponents plus fighting in the ufc for the first time led to his downfall, also forest i think was underrated and every time he fights he looks better and better(even though he lost to jardine he was winning until he got caught) all of these factors are the reasons why he lost and maybe he should increase his cardio)
Shogun is still a top 5 fighter and now forest is a top 10 fighter
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Post #22 9/24/07 3:14:50AM
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Aether
Heavyweight Champ
Career record: 929-503
Season: 18-6 (#402)
Location: Edmonton
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Why does someone thinking a fighter from PRIDE will win mean that they will pick every PRIDE fighter over every UFC fighter? You guys can sit around saying "PRIDE is AAA and UFC is the big leagues" but it's pretty amusing to listen to since 2 of the current champions fought more of their fights in PRIDE than any other organization. Some PRIDE fighters have come over and completely dominated, some have come over and been dominated, you can't say "PRIDE fighters this, UFC fighters that" because it's completely retarded to lump and entire bevy of fighters together under a single brand name. None of these matchups have anything to do with the organization the fighters previously fought in and it's foolosh to turn every single argument into a PRIDE vs UFC thread.
Nubby your posts about PRIDE are incredibly ignorant, and you willfully omit the fact that 2 former PRIDE fighters came over and demolished everyone they fought to take and defend their titles impressively. PRIDE is dead, both organizations had good and bad fighters and dominant UFC fighters have had equally lackluster performances in PRIDE. The organization is irrelevant, stop making every single debate into a PRIDE vs UFC thread, it's really getting old and your comments are not supported by any logic.
I understand why you love Tito so much. You really seem to be the kind of person who just likes to act like a fool for no reason other than to be different. Birds of a feather I guess.
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Post #23 9/24/07 6:28:35AM
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xillum
Learning to Sprawl
Career record: 16-7
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: angleton texas
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First off I think Forrest is awesome, and I am sorry I bet on Shogun. But thats not what this about.
It doesn't have to do with if Pride or UFC is better there are super athletes in both. It has to do with how they adapt to rules. Many UFC are better in the cage, not having to worry about a head stomp when they are down on the ground. Pride guys aren't used to elbows being thrown or rope-a-doped. Look at Canadian football players coming to the U.S. how do they deal with such a small field, while American Players going to Canada don't do well without that extra down. What happens to all those awesome Formula 1 drivers when they go to stock car, and stock car drivers when they go to GT. They are the best where they are not because of just there skills but because they excel at operating within the rules of their organization. This said its apparent Rampage wasn't meant for Pride, and maybe Cro Cop wasn't meant for UFC.
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Post #24 9/24/07 11:37:12AM
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rcg916
He's Back...
Career record: 333-186
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Sacramento, CA
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For all of the keyboard warriors with opinions of why Shogun lost, why Chuck lost, blah blah......
Shut the hell up.
You have never trained at their level (or at all, Im guessing)... After all, how can you learn to fight when your hands are covered with Cheeto Dust?
Save the expert opinions for... well, the experts.
Last time I checked, having every UFC event on DVD didnt qualify you as a black belt in anything...
Last edited 9/24/07 1:39PM by rcg916
Edit note/reason: n/a
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Post #25 9/24/07 1:38:10PM
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The Dancer
Career record: 353-258
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Maryland
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Posted by rcg916
For all of the keyboard warriors with opinions of why Shogun lost, why Chuck lost, blah blah......
Shut the hell up.
You have never trained at their level (or at all, Im guessing)... After all, how can you learn to fight when your hands are covered with Cheeto Dust?
Save the expert opinions for... well, the experts.
Last time I checked, having every UFC event on DVD didnt qualify you as a black belt in anything...
Don't mess with my Cheeto's.
_______________________________________
"To me the records were just a starting point," recalls John Paul Jones, "The most important thing was always the stage show. So many great nights. At our worst we were still better than most. At our best we could just wipe the floor with the lot of them. It was just a very good live band."
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Post #26 9/24/07 2:38:13PM
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BigEvil
Standup Guy
Career record: 297-177
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: SC
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I don't know about the whole Pride vs. UFC thing... but I think SHogun will be back better than ever, he's only what 24 years old! It was a great job y Forrest not buying into the hype and eing better conditioned. I'm sure having Randy Couture in your ear during training helps a hell of a lot!
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Post #27 9/24/07 4:54:04PM
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kimoron
MMA Regular
Career record: 389-235
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: San Mateo
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this ppv was more suiting of the name "reality check" then ufc 59 was. shogun is a great fighter but when it comes down to it his style can be very wreckless and the pace he pushes can be a disadvantage to him at times. i picked forrest to win for these exact reasons. i dont know why more people did not see this. shogun will be back stronger but he will not be nearly as dominant as he was in pride and he will not be champ. i cant wait to see shogun fight again but his days of dominace are over.
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Post #28 9/24/07 7:58:38PM
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fullfighting
MMA Regular
Career record: 136-84
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Wichita, Kansas
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its worth noting that he and his brother both completely gassed in their fights. That camp is not getting the job done.
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Post #29 9/25/07 12:29:37AM
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nubby
Banned
Career record: 206-111
Season: 0-0 (#-)
Location: Bay Area
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Posted by Aether
Why does someone thinking a fighter from PRIDE will win mean that they will pick every PRIDE fighter over every UFC fighter? You guys can sit around saying "PRIDE is AAA and UFC is the big leagues" but it's pretty amusing to listen to since 2 of the current champions fought more of their fights in PRIDE than any other organization. Some PRIDE fighters have come over and completely dominated, some have come over and been dominated, you can't say "PRIDE fighters this, UFC fighters that" because it's completely retarded to lump and entire bevy of fighters together under a single brand name. None of these matchups have anything to do with the organization the fighters previously fought in and it's foolosh to turn every single argument into a PRIDE vs UFC thread.
Nubby your posts about PRIDE are incredibly ignorant, and you willfully omit the fact that 2 former PRIDE fighters came over and demolished everyone they fought to take and defend their titles impressively. PRIDE is dead, both organizations had good and bad fighters and dominant UFC fighters have had equally lackluster performances in PRIDE. The organization is irrelevant, stop making every single debate into a PRIDE vs UFC thread, it's really getting old and your comments are not supported by any logic.
I understand why you love Tito so much. You really seem to be the kind of person who just likes to act like a fool for no reason other than to be different. Birds of a feather I guess.
That's because Anderson Silva was never really considered a pride fighter. Look at his record. He competed in pride 5 times and lost two of those times. The dude has had 23 fights, that hardly makes him a pride fighter. Now lets look at Quinton Jackson, he has 34 fights, 18 of those were in pride. So we have one example where a pride fighter came in and has run the table. ONE out of how many recently signed pride fighters, shall we go down the list of fighters that have lost or looked like shit?
Nakamura
Rua
Werdum
Filipovic
Herring
Okami
Nogueira
Aurelio
There are probably even more that I can't think of. And regardless of wether or not I act like a fool, at least I can accept the truth in front of me by looking at the facts rather than just staying neutral. Pride fighters, what ever the reason don't fare well in the UFC. It's fact with few exceptions. And if/when that changes I will have no problem admitting it but this is the trend and you need to taking it personally and just accept it.
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Post #30 9/25/07 1:34:24PM
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