Weight Cutting

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NinjaCyborg
1/7/09 1:01:54PM
I believe weight cutting for a fight is an issue that seriously needs to be dealt with.
Many fighters cut weight by dehydrating themself for a weigh-in which takes place the day before the actual fight, and then by the next day they have rehydrated themselves to the point that they can weigh 20 or 30 pounds over the weight class limit. I find it border line cheating.
There should be a consistent natural weight standard. A fighter should weigh within the weight class boundries during fight time, not the day before.

Am I the only one who feels this way?
SmileR
1/7/09 1:27:49PM
I think you have a point but if more weight classes are added MMA will end up in the same state as boxing in my opinion. Theirs two many weight classes there and even hardcore boxing fans have trouble naming the champ in each devision.
MMA I think has the perfect weight classes up to HW.

The only real place i think it needs to be addressed is the HW devision with a lower limit of 225lb and cut off point at 265lb theirs already a 40lb difference between some fighters. Add the likes of Brock and Tim Sylvia who cut weight to reach the cut off point and some fighters can be outweighed by 60lb or more.
Even at the 40lb mark thats like a WW taking on a LHW!
But on the other hand the HW devision in MMA right now is so weak around the world that adding a SWH devision would drain three or four of the top 10 HW guys
and then it would weaken a already weak devision.
SeanSalmonisGod
1/7/09 1:36:14PM

Posted by SmileR

I think you have a point but if more weight classes are added MMA will end up in the same state as boxing in my opinion. Theirs two many weight classes there and even hardcore boxing fans have trouble naming the champ in each devision.
MMA I think has the perfect weight classes up to HW.

The only real place i think it needs to be addressed is the HW devision with a lower limit of 225lb and cut off point at 265lb theirs already a 40lb difference between some fighters. Add the likes of Brock and Tim Sylvia who cut weight to reach the cut off point and some fighters can be outweighed by 60lb or more.
Even at the 40lb mark thats like a WW taking on a LHW!
But on the other hand the HW devision in MMA right now is so weak around the world that adding a SWH devision would drain three or four of the top 10 HW guys
and then it would weaken a already weak devision.




???
bojangalz
1/7/09 1:42:37PM
I can't get on board with this at all actually. The fact of the matter is, it's still very much a level playing field. The weight class structure and weigh-in parameters are clear and consistant across the board. If a fighter feels he is being cheated because someone is cutting extreme weight to fight in his weight class, there is nothing that stops him from making the same decision and cutting HIS weight to move down as well.

There is a very clear price to pay for additional weight. Athletes lose agility, speed, and cardio proportionatly to the amount of bulk they have. Thats why lower weight classes are seperated by 10 pounds or less, and larger weight classes are seperated by 15 pounds or more.

Mind you there are some genetic freaks which alter the defy those rules (ie Lesnar) but they are very few and far between. Its rediculous to consider changing weight class structures because of a few humans who are build like animals. Geneticly gifted freaks will come and go, some will be successful and other will not. But the basic structure of the weight classes is fine and needs no tweaing at all.

As far as weigh-ins go...Some states have regulations through their athletic commissions already which regulate "fight-weights". If I'm not mistaken the fighters on the Fight for the Troops card would not weigh over 9 pounds above weight class (or catch-weight) the day of the fight. It was a regulation within the North Carolina state rules. So there is some regulation set forth in some places. However like I said- If a fighter feels cheated by his opponent's weight-cutting there is nothing that stops him from doing the same thing.
NinjaCyborg
1/7/09 2:04:58PM
Just to clarify, I'm not talking about changing anything about the weight classes.

My issue is with fighters who cut weight. For example in welterweight, the weight limit is 156 - 170, correct? I believe a welter weight fighter must weigh 170 pounds at the time of the fight, not the day before.
Many welterweight fighters will cu down to 170 for the weigh ins, and then by the next day be back up to 190 pounds or more. That is what I have a problem with.

Perhaps 1 solution to this would be to have a second weigh in right before the fight to make sure fighters are still at the required weight?
telnights
1/7/09 2:23:32PM
Weight cutting goes on in all contact sports wrestling, boxing, Sambo, and Judo. This isn't anything new and I don't see a problem with it. Its an even playing field for everyone because they make the choice to cut weight or not. Its not forced on anyone and some people that cut weight also pay the price for doing so. It just adds another aspect to the game.
bojangalz
1/7/09 2:32:31PM

Posted by NinjaCyborg
My issue is with fighters who cut weight. For example in welterweight, the weight limit is 156 - 170, correct? I believe a welter weight fighter must weigh 170 pounds at the time of the fight, not the day before.
Many welterweight fighters will cu down to 170 for the weigh ins, and then by the next day be back up to 190 pounds or more. That is what I have a problem with.



I understand the issue...But the fact of the matter is, EVERY fighter is regulated by those exact same guidelines. If a fighter is walking around at 170 and doesn't cut for a fight than he is doing himself a disservice. There is no reason he can't put in the effort and cut to 155 and be big for that division. If he chooses to stay at 170, then he has to know that he'll be undersized for the weight class.

He's not at a disadvantage because of the fact that he's fighting guys much bigger then him...He's at a disadvantage because he doesn't want to put in the time to cut to the smaller class. The fact of the matter is, weight-cutting is not only within the rules, but it's the status quo.

I'd be all for a rule change if I felt the current regulations unfairly impacted any number of fighters. Thats simply not the case in this instance.
seanfu
1/7/09 2:36:03PM
It's a dumb arguement. You probably just haven't been around a bunch of wrestlers or amature boxers, but these guys weigh in an hour before competition and still will cut around 5 to 10 or more pounds to make weight.

I knew a guy that went to the sauna and would cut a total 9 or so pounds. It's just a bigger pain in the ass. It won't change much if it is ever implemented. LW's will still cut around the same amount of sweat (9 pounds or so)

And LHW's would still cut around 15 or so instead of 20 or 30.

It's just something that can't be helped. And there are a lot of in between guys who would get screwed.
SeanSalmonisGod
1/7/09 3:00:12PM

Posted by telnights

Weight cutting goes on in all contact sports wrestling, boxing, Sambo, and Judo. This isn't anything new and I don't see a problem with it. Its an even playing field for everyone because they make the choice to cut weight or not. Its not forced on anyone and some people that cut weight also pay the price for doing so. It just adds another aspect to the game.



Someone else who doesn't understand the original topic.
Diamondback2
1/7/09 3:10:28PM
Here's the answer fro ya:

If they did weigh ins before the fight everyone would STILL cut weight. But now they would be dehydrated going into the fight and put themselves at a great risk of harm.

Plus 2 dehydrated fighters could be a really boring match as they would have a very limited gas tank.

Also,

If everyone just did the natural wight thing EVERYTHING WOULD BE THE SAME. it'd just be one weight class up. BJ would be the WW champ, GSP would be the MW, Silva would be the LHW, and god knows what happens to the HW division.

If it was just onbe or two guys that were good at cutting like back in the day (ie: Tito, Hughes) it would be more of an issue. But pretty much everyone does it and is good at it so it's a pretty level playing field.

On a side note i've cut weight before to see if i could make 155 (which was a big no, 160 was my lightest i can go) and I know when i start fighting i would rather not cut weight.

Hendo's the same way, and the weight cutting of opponents has never been a factor for him.
telnights
1/7/09 3:13:58PM

Posted by SeanSalmonisGod


Posted by telnights

Weight cutting goes on in all contact sports wrestling, boxing, Sambo, and Judo. This isn't anything new and I don't see a problem with it. Its an even playing field for everyone because they make the choice to cut weight or not. Its not forced on anyone and some people that cut weight also pay the price for doing so. It just adds another aspect to the game.



Someone else who doesn't understand the original topic.



Just some advice don't talk trash to a MOD if your on a dub account and your old account has been perm banned . Just saying not the best idea .
king_katool
1/7/09 4:03:21PM

Posted by telnights


Posted by SeanSalmonisGod


Posted by telnights

Weight cutting goes on in all contact sports wrestling, boxing, Sambo, and Judo. This isn't anything new and I don't see a problem with it. Its an even playing field for everyone because they make the choice to cut weight or not. Its not forced on anyone and some people that cut weight also pay the price for doing so. It just adds another aspect to the game.



Someone else who doesn't understand the original topic.



Just some advice don't talk trash to a MOD if your on a dub account and your old account has been perm banned . Just saying not the best idea .




cmb19932
1/7/09 4:39:31PM

Posted by telnights


Posted by SeanSalmonisGod


Posted by telnights

Weight cutting goes on in all contact sports wrestling, boxing, Sambo, and Judo. This isn't anything new and I don't see a problem with it. Its an even playing field for everyone because they make the choice to cut weight or not. Its not forced on anyone and some people that cut weight also pay the price for doing so. It just adds another aspect to the game.



Someone else who doesn't understand the original topic.



Just some advice don't talk trash to a MOD if your on a dub account and your old account has been perm banned . Just saying not the best idea .




shut down that was the biggest burn iv ever seen on the playground props
bls1919
1/7/09 7:25:23PM
I have to think even with weigh ins right before the fight, the guys would still cut the weight. Leaving them exhausted, making for less exciting fights. Everyone can cut weight, but not everyone does. Its a choice. Look at Sherk, dude almost has to cut to fight at 170 and fights at 155.
Kpro
1/7/09 7:32:58PM
The only thing that I dislike about weight cutting is that they don't have the fighters step back on a scale before the fight so we know how much they added on. Boxing does it most of the time, why can't MMA let us know their real pre-fight weight yet.
seanfu
1/7/09 8:40:28PM
I think HBO's the only one who does the unofficial weighins. But it is really interesting. I think fans would want to know.

Tito Ortiz- 230 Lyoto Machida- 210 hahahaha
mentalcase
1/7/09 10:51:26PM
Anderson Silva cut down from 230 for his fight with Cote

link

I'm curious to know what he actuality weighs during the fight it would be great if they weighed fighter just before the fight so we have a better idea of who has the weight advantage
Diamondback2
1/8/09 2:05:06AM
I would love it too but it would confuse the casual fan worse than Eddie Bravo scoring. Most people don't know about weight cutting. Plus it more gives the image the playing field is perfectly level.

And to the MOD. As soon as i saw he was dissing a mod i wanted to go and . LOL!
State_Champ
1/8/09 8:22:51AM

Posted by Kpro

The only thing that I dislike about weight cutting is that they don't have the fighters step back on a scale before the fight so we know how much they added on. Boxing does it most of the time, why can't MMA let us know their real pre-fight weight yet.



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