Am i the only one that thinks BJ will win?

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Rush
11/14/08 2:26:22PM

Posted by AchillesHeel


Posted by Panochador

I can't believe all the GSP nut-huggery going on here.

Listen, GSP is the most well rounded fighter there is right now, that's his strength, but that's also his biggest problem. He's a jack-of-all-trades, master of none.


I disagree. GSP is the best wrestler in his weight class, bar none, and one of the top 3-5 wrestlers in the entire sport.

GSP
Striking: B+
- Versatility:
Wrestling: A
- Ground n' Pound: A
- Takedowns: A
- Takedown defense: A
Jiu-Jitsu: B
- Submissions: B-
- Submission defense: B+
Cardio: A
Chin: B+
Confidence: B+
Adaptability: B+

Baby J
Striking: B+
Wrestling: C+
- Takedowns: C+
- Ground n' Pound: B
Jiu-Jitsu: A
- Takedown defense: A
- Submissions: A
- Submission defense: A
Cardio: hard to know, but in the past he's been a C to a B, my guess is he'll come into this match in good shape, so I'll give him a B; still behind GSP, but not enough to determine the outcome of the match by itself
Chin: B-
Confidence: A-
Adaptability: B+




A much more accurate set of grades. Thank you.
AchillesHeel
11/14/08 2:27:24PM

Posted by RedCloud

So Manyposts saying Bj cant do this and GSP cant do that.


I know what you mean. This fight is between two of the most talented, well-rounded fighters in the entire sport. Penn could walk onto a Division 1 NCAA wrestling team, and GSP could compete at the ADCC championships. Neither has any weakness, imo, only relative strengths.
AchillesHeel
11/14/08 2:30:17PM

Posted by Wolfenstein

GSP has B+ wrestling? I must have missed that when he took down NCAA Division 1 champ Josh Koscheck over and over again seemingly at will.


Jon Fitch and Sean Sherk can wrestle a little too, and what GSP did to Frank Trigg is a felony in most states. If Jakes Shields signs with the UFC, he's gonna need a bigger boat.
Rush
11/14/08 2:30:21PM

Posted by AchillesHeel
GSP could compete at the ADCC championships.



Isn't his record 1-1?
Jackelope
11/14/08 2:31:40PM
I think at this point BJ has proven his chin to be an A. I would also give the straight up boxing edge to BJ. Although the versatility of GSP's striking game far surpasses BJ's.

I want to see what GSP is going to do against BJ putting him in rubber guard. I think at some point GSP will take BJ down, and that when that point comes if BJ can dictate where the ground battle takes place via his rubber guard and sweeps he will win the fight. However, if GSP can impose his will on the ground and keep BJ on his back it is going to be a long night for BJ.
AchillesHeel
11/14/08 2:36:28PM

Posted by Rush


Posted by AchillesHeel
GSP could compete at the ADCC championships.



Isn't his record 1-1?


Dunno. Do you remember who he competed against?


Posted by Jackelope

I think at this point BJ has proven his chin to be an A.


Has he? I'm not sure I've seen him get roughed up, except by Matt Hughes, but that was on the ground. He seems to avoid damage, more than he takes it and soldiers on. I don't recall seeing him ever get rocked.


Posted by Jackelope

I would also give the straight up boxing edge to BJ. Although the versatility of GSP's striking game far surpasses BJ's.


This is my feeling also. If BJ can make a couple of respectable takedown attempts, enough to make GSP reluctant to kick, he should control the standup. It might not even matter if he gets GSP down or not, he just has to make him work to avoid it.
Rush
11/14/08 2:52:47PM

Posted by AchillesHeel

Dunno. Do you remember who he competed against?




Otto Olsen
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=K3W6RGQ0


looking for the second. The big list that used to be on wiki is now gone.


Leo Santos is the other

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCLoV40jDKM
roadking95th
11/14/08 4:44:31PM
Was bored today and picked up FightSport magazine. It was the October issue with BJ on the cover. In the article he said that GSP "uses steriods and is a coward." They added a "(laughs)' to the end of that statement.

Anyone have any background on this quote? It's the first I've heard of it. Was BJ serious or was he just joking? They had already asked him about steriods and he said there was no place for them in MMA, they were for cowards. Then they asked him about why he wants to fight GSP again. Actually, here is the whole sequence.

FS: Before you fought Sean Sherk, you were very outspoken about his drug related suspension. What do you have to say about that now that the fight is over?

BJ: I don't think steriods or performance enhancement drugs have any place in the UFC and anyone who does that is a coward.

FS: Why do you want a rematch with GSP so badly?

BJ: Because he takes steriods and he's a coward (laughs).

FS: You really think he takes steriods? But he has been tested in the past and always passed.

BJ: There are tests in Mr Olympia and they pass.

Sounds like much more than just trying to "hype" the fight.
Jackelope
11/14/08 4:46:34PM
Surprisingly offensive of BJ to say that. I don't know why he would make that accusation. Anyone who knows me knows that I think most guys have used or are using, but I would say GSP strikes me as the type that would never use.
Rush
11/14/08 7:27:20PM
The day GSP tests positive for steroids is the day I take him off my #1 fighter spot.

I'll also mail him his photo (that he signed) torn in half. I would just need to find a mailing address.
roadking95th
11/14/08 7:48:46PM
I know what you're saying Rush. When I read that, I was like WTF? GSP seems like a very decent person.
higdon10
11/14/08 11:46:27PM
Its probably just fight hype.
EvenFlow
11/15/08 12:35:55AM

Posted by Rush


Posted by AchillesHeel


Posted by Panochador

I can't believe all the GSP nut-huggery going on here.

Listen, GSP is the most well rounded fighter there is right now, that's his strength, but that's also his biggest problem. He's a jack-of-all-trades, master of none.


I disagree. GSP is the best wrestler in his weight class, bar none, and one of the top 3-5 wrestlers in the entire sport.

GSP
Striking: B+
- Versatility:
Wrestling: A
- Ground n' Pound: A
- Takedowns: A
- Takedown defense: A
Jiu-Jitsu: B
- Submissions: B-
- Submission defense: B+
Cardio: A
Chin: B+
Confidence: B+
Adaptability: B+

Baby J
Striking: B+
Wrestling: C+
- Takedowns: C+
- Ground n' Pound: B
Jiu-Jitsu: A
- Takedown defense: A
- Submissions: A
- Submission defense: A
Cardio: hard to know, but in the past he's been a C to a B, my guess is he'll come into this match in good shape, so I'll give him a B; still behind GSP, but not enough to determine the outcome of the match by itself
Chin: B-
Confidence: A-
Adaptability: B+




LOL ... BJ's chin at (B-) and you have GSP's chin higher??? If there was a stat on BJ's chin It'd be an (A) and keep GSP's chin at (B+)... BJ's cardio as of lately is a (B+).
Pookie
11/15/08 3:07:00AM


Posted by AchillesHeel


Posted by Panochador

I can't believe all the GSP nut-huggery going on here.

Listen, GSP is the most well rounded fighter there is right now, that's his strength, but that's also his biggest problem. He's a jack-of-all-trades, master of none.


I disagree. GSP is the best wrestler in his weight class, bar none, and one of the top 3-5 wrestlers in the entire sport.

GSP
Striking: B+
- Versatility:
Wrestling: A
- Ground n' Pound: A
- Takedowns: A
- Takedown defense: A
Jiu-Jitsu: B
- Submissions: B-
- Submission defense: B+
Cardio: A
Chin: B+
Confidence: B+
Adaptability: B+

Baby J
Striking: B+
Wrestling: C+
- Takedowns: C+
- Ground n' Pound: B
Jiu-Jitsu: A
- Takedown defense: A
- Submissions: A
- Submission defense: A
Cardio: hard to know, but in the past he's been a C to a B, my guess is he'll come into this match in good shape, so I'll give him a B; still behind GSP, but not enough to determine the outcome of the match by itself
Chin: B-
Confidence: A-
Adaptability: B+




Bj has a very good chin. Only tko loss was from a Physical checkmate via crucifix hold and 1 broken rib against matt hughes..
AchillesHeel
11/15/08 12:30:31PM

Posted by EvenFlow

LOL ... BJ's chin at (B-) and you have GSP's chin higher??? If there was a stat on BJ's chin It'd be an (A) and keep GSP's chin at (B+)...



Posted by Pookie

Bj has a very good chin. Only tko loss was from a Physical checkmate via crucifix hold and 1 broken rib against matt hughes..


His ability to avoid taking damage is the key. I don't recall ever seeing Penn get clocked, so I don't know if he has a good chin or not. I've seen GSP get knocked around and come back to win (it was against Penn, in fact).
Pookie
11/15/08 1:09:02PM

Posted by AchillesHeel


Posted by EvenFlow

LOL ... BJ's chin at (B-) and you have GSP's chin higher??? If there was a stat on BJ's chin It'd be an (A) and keep GSP's chin at (B+)...



Posted by Pookie

Bj has a very good chin. Only tko loss was from a Physical checkmate via crucifix hold and 1 broken rib against matt hughes..


His ability to avoid taking damage is the key. I don't recall ever seeing Penn get clocked, so I don't know if he has a good chin or not. I've seen GSP get knocked around and come back to win (it was against Penn, in fact).



I dont know man, ive seen bj repeatedly get punched in the face just because he was too tired to move anymore.
EvenFlow
11/15/08 5:05:46PM



Posted by AchillesHeel


Posted by EvenFlow

LOL ... BJ's chin at (B-) and you have GSP's chin higher??? If there was a stat on BJ's chin It'd be an (A) and keep GSP's chin at (B+)...



Posted by Pookie

Bj has a very good chin. Only tko loss was from a Physical checkmate via crucifix hold and 1 broken rib against matt hughes..


His ability to avoid taking damage is the key. I don't recall ever seeing Penn get clocked, so I don't know if he has a good chin or not. I've seen GSP get knocked around and come back to win (it was against Penn, in fact).



Well Serra sure wouldnt and couldnt KO Penn. If you have GSPs chin higher than BJ's regardless of what grade you have thats just crazy to start off with right there, you should watch all his fights or at least all the UFC fights.
jack
11/19/08 10:04:13PM

Posted by higdon10


Posted by jack

Where did you learn how to grade? BJ doesn't have any power in his hands? Did you just start watching MMA? You rated BJ's striking better than GSP's...I am sorry...BJ finally showed that he figured out how to use his jab against Sherk and all of a sudden he is an excellent striker? I must have missed the last couple of years of MMA.
Talk about nuthugging....



I also think that BJ's striking is better than St. Pierre's. I dont see why you have flame somebody's decent opinion. My friend.



That's awesome...I get a thumbs down for expressing my opinion...classy

Anyways, you try to use Fitch as an example as to GSP's lack of hand power but when was the last time anybody had Fitch in that much trouble? Fitch is a phenomenal fighter imho....believe it or not I am actually a BJ fan. I just don't think that he has the tools to beat BJ at this point in time. Whoops, I expressed my opionion again....here I'll give myself the thumbs down so that you won't have to take time to respond.
Jackelope
11/19/08 10:42:17PM

Posted by jack


Posted by higdon10


Posted by jack

Where did you learn how to grade? BJ doesn't have any power in his hands? Did you just start watching MMA? You rated BJ's striking better than GSP's...I am sorry...BJ finally showed that he figured out how to use his jab against Sherk and all of a sudden he is an excellent striker? I must have missed the last couple of years of MMA.
Talk about nuthugging....



I also think that BJ's striking is better than St. Pierre's. I dont see why you have flame somebody's decent opinion. My friend.



That's awesome...I get a thumbs down for expressing my opinion...classy

Anyways, you try to use Fitch as an example as to GSP's lack of hand power but when was the last time anybody had Fitch in that much trouble? Fitch is a phenomenal fighter imho....believe it or not I am actually a BJ fan. I just don't think that he has the tools to beat BJ at this point in time. Whoops, I expressed my opionion again....here I'll give myself the thumbs down so that you won't have to take time to respond.



Take it easy you guys.

He responded the way he did because of the way you had insulted his opinion in your first post.


Where did you learn how to grade? BJ doesn't have any power in his hands? Did you just start watching MMA?


Seems insulting to me, so I'd say the backlash was warranted- although not encouraged. Anyway, we don't want to see fights break out on the forums so please just take it easy and respect each other's opinions without crapping on them

(My two thumbs up should negate the two thumbs down )
jack
11/21/08 9:10:31PM

Posted by Jackelope


Posted by jack


Posted by higdon10


Posted by jack

Where did you learn how to grade? BJ doesn't have any power in his hands? Did you just start watching MMA? You rated BJ's striking better than GSP's...I am sorry...BJ finally showed that he figured out how to use his jab against Sherk and all of a sudden he is an excellent striker? I must have missed the last couple of years of MMA.
Talk about nuthugging....



I also think that BJ's striking is better than St. Pierre's. I dont see why you have flame somebody's decent opinion. My friend.



That's awesome...I get a thumbs down for expressing my opinion...classy

Anyways, you try to use Fitch as an example as to GSP's lack of hand power but when was the last time anybody had Fitch in that much trouble? Fitch is a phenomenal fighter imho....believe it or not I am actually a BJ fan. I just don't think that he has the tools to beat BJ at this point in time. Whoops, I expressed my opionion again....here I'll give myself the thumbs down so that you won't have to take time to respond.



Take it easy you guys.

He responded the way he did because of the way you had insulted his opinion in your first post.


Where did you learn how to grade? BJ doesn't have any power in his hands? Did you just start watching MMA?


Seems insulting to me, so I'd say the backlash was warranted- although not encouraged. Anyway, we don't want to see fights break out on the forums so please just take it easy and respect each other's opinions without crapping on them

(My two thumbs up should negate the two thumbs down )



You're right...sorry I got carried away!!
Jackelope
11/21/08 9:19:40PM

Posted by jack


Posted by Jackelope


Posted by jack


Posted by higdon10


Posted by jack

Where did you learn how to grade? BJ doesn't have any power in his hands? Did you just start watching MMA? You rated BJ's striking better than GSP's...I am sorry...BJ finally showed that he figured out how to use his jab against Sherk and all of a sudden he is an excellent striker? I must have missed the last couple of years of MMA.
Talk about nuthugging....



I also think that BJ's striking is better than St. Pierre's. I dont see why you have flame somebody's decent opinion. My friend.



That's awesome...I get a thumbs down for expressing my opinion...classy

Anyways, you try to use Fitch as an example as to GSP's lack of hand power but when was the last time anybody had Fitch in that much trouble? Fitch is a phenomenal fighter imho....believe it or not I am actually a BJ fan. I just don't think that he has the tools to beat BJ at this point in time. Whoops, I expressed my opionion again....here I'll give myself the thumbs down so that you won't have to take time to respond.



Take it easy you guys.

He responded the way he did because of the way you had insulted his opinion in your first post.


Where did you learn how to grade? BJ doesn't have any power in his hands? Did you just start watching MMA?


Seems insulting to me, so I'd say the backlash was warranted- although not encouraged. Anyway, we don't want to see fights break out on the forums so please just take it easy and respect each other's opinions without crapping on them

(My two thumbs up should negate the two thumbs down )



You're right...sorry I got carried away!!



No problem, bro.

This fight is going to be so good. It will answer so many questions. I honestly think boxing wise BJ has a huge advantage over GSP, but when it comes to kickboxing and the use of the legs that GSP has a huge advantage. So it will be really interesting to see how it all plays out.

haggiswashere
11/21/08 11:20:20PM

Posted by AchillesHeel

GSP
Striking: B+
- Versatility:
Wrestling: A
- Ground n' Pound: A
- Takedowns: A
- Takedown defense: A
Jiu-Jitsu: B
- Submissions: B-
- Submission defense: B+
Cardio: A
Chin: B+
Confidence: B+
Adaptability: B+

Baby J
Striking: B+
Wrestling: C+
- Takedowns: C+
- Ground n' Pound: B
Jiu-Jitsu: A
- Takedown defense: A
- Submissions: A
- Submission defense: A
Cardio: hard to know, but in the past he's been a C to a B, my guess is he'll come into this match in good shape, so I'll give him a B; still behind GSP, but not enough to determine the outcome of the match by itself
Chin: B-
Confidence: A-
Adaptability: B+



you forgot to mention GSP goes up one full letter grade in everything when he does the nip pinching
Bobby-B-Bonkers
11/26/08 11:57:28PM

Posted by Rush


Posted by Bobby-B-Bonkers

OK... who is better?

standup - BJ
bjj - BJ
wrestling - even
clinch - even

*unless GSP plans on another boring 5 round dec, I give it 2 BJ hands down!!!









Watch their first fight. GSP was the better fighter there and has improved much more than BJ has since then. The only thing that BJ has improved is his conditioning and it is still not going to match GSP's. Their first fight should have been a UD for GSP. That's not subjective either. Watch their fight again, it's pretty obvious.

BJ does not have the better clinch and he certainly does not have better wrestling. You will not see BJ take GSP down or have an effective clinch. He will be doing nothing but trying to keep his ass off the mat.

BJ has better boxing and submissions. I see him winning either by eye poke or catching GSP in a sub.

Personally, I htink Alves is a tougher fight for GSP than BJ.



and i think Alves will be the champ when BJ feels like giving his belt back
Pride-Fighter
11/27/08 2:40:57PM
BJ has better Jiu-Jitsu, GSP would be stupid to take the fight to the ground.
If it stays on the feet GSP will get Serra'd.
BJ by destruction
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