Shiela Gaff vs. Jennifer Maia - touch gloves/sucker punch

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POLL: Cheap shot or protect yourself at all times
Cheap shot 63% (17)
Protect yourself at all times 37% (10)
FastKnockout
3/19/12 4:24:53PM
Sheila Gaff ignores Jennifer Maia's offer to touch gloves and lands a quick hook to face at Cage Warriors Fight Night 4 on Friday. Cheap shot or protect yourself at all times?

Video
emfleek
3/19/12 4:26:45PM

Posted by FastKnockout

Sheila Gaff ignores Jennifer Maia's offer to touch gloves and lands a quick hook to face at Cage Warriors Fight Night 4 on Friday. Cheap shot or protect yourself at all times?

Video



Both.
Budgellism
3/19/12 4:50:42PM
Exactly, both.

I really dislike when fighters do that though.
Twenty20Dollars
3/19/12 4:54:59PM
They touched gloves when they were with the ref. Don't need to again, so protect yourselves at all times as the fight has started.

I know they touch gloves out of respect, but you know everyone doesn't have it.
cowcatcher
3/19/12 5:03:57PM
I won't disagree with "both", but I definitely lean toward that being a cheap shot. I wouldn't feel too great about myself after the fight if I was Gaff, that much I know for sure.
postman
3/19/12 5:12:46PM

Posted by cowcatcher

I won't disagree with "both", but I definitely lean toward that being a cheap shot. I wouldn't feel too great about myself after the fight if I was Gaff, that much I know for sure.



I don't really think it was the reason she won though. Its Legal first and foremost. Being cheap is secondary however true it is.
cowcatcher
3/19/12 5:22:04PM

Posted by postman


Posted by cowcatcher

I won't disagree with "both", but I definitely lean toward that being a cheap shot. I wouldn't feel too great about myself after the fight if I was Gaff, that much I know for sure.



I don't really think it was the reason she won though. Its Legal first and foremost. Being cheap is secondary however true it is.



I don't disagree with you, except that I think it definitely had something to do with her winning. In the end it's legal like you said, and there are no do overs in MMA.
pmoney
3/19/12 6:08:42PM

Posted by cowcatcher
...there are no do overs in MMA.



There should be! I'd be calling do-overs like a seven year old.
Kpro
3/19/12 6:48:46PM
I say protect yourself at all times. Nothing cheap about it unless they mad eye contact post-glove-touch-with-ref and made the customary "we're touchin gloves?" hand raise and the other fighter shakes their head yes. If that didn't happen, nothin cheap about it. When the bell rings, the fight starts.
Bubbles
3/19/12 7:55:38PM
i think its a cheap shot, but at the same time I can see it being a "protect yourself at all times" scenario. IMO raising your hand to touch gloves is a sign of respect and honor taught from TMA...it was something I always did during karate sparring tournaments back in the day. At the same time once the bell rings, be prepared to fight.

It's like in basketball, a pickup game you "check" the ball...you do that in the NBA and its 2 points for your opponent. Nothing illegal about it but it isn't something you'd expect.

I did see this one video a little while back where fighter A had his hand out and his opponent faked to touch gloves and shot in for a takedown. Fighter A landed a well timed knee and knocked Fighter B out cold - kinda like last week's TUF.
Pookie
3/19/12 8:20:47PM

Posted by Kpro

I say protect yourself at all times. Nothing cheap about it unless they mad eye contact post-glove-touch-with-ref and made the customary "we're touchin gloves?" hand raise and the other fighter shakes their head yes. If that didn't happen, nothin cheap about it. When the bell rings, the fight starts.





Thats what it all boils down to.
Chael_Sonnen
3/19/12 8:31:53PM
Touching gloves before a fight is sooooo overdone, I really wish fighters would stop doing that. Here, I'm about to throw down in a dark alley, hey, wait, lets do a fist pound before we scrap

If you want to show sportsmanship, then buy me a steak dinner after the fight....Medium Rare!
mrsmiley
3/19/12 8:33:41PM
Little low but like everyone has stated keep yourself protected at all times.
If the women who refused to touch gloves would have been the one to initiate the touch and then punched her opponnet then I would scream cheap shop,and possible think it (but not admit) it was a good though vile strategy.
tcunningham
3/19/12 9:34:00PM
i went with protect your self at all times. when you put your fist out to touch gloves and the other person doesnt do the same you gotta expect they dont wanna touch they wanna get it.
warglory
3/19/12 9:36:08PM

Posted by Kpro

I say protect yourself at all times. Nothing cheap about it unless they mad eye contact post-glove-touch-with-ref and made the customary "we're touchin gloves?" hand raise and the other fighter shakes their head yes. If that didn't happen, nothin cheap about it. When the bell rings, the fight starts.



Uh, that's exactly what they did. Before they started throwing, there was clearly the intent by both individuals to touch gloves.

To the question at hand, I said it's a blatant cheap shot. Unlike what some people say, this isn't combat first, it's a sport first, don't mix the two up. Is this a violent sport? Yes, but it's not a street fight where survival is of the essence, there should be honor amongst competitors as with any sport. I won't say it's cheating, because the competitor didn't bend the rules to come out on top, but it is classless and will reflect on the person's reputation and legacy.
Twenty20Dollars
3/19/12 9:46:10PM
Not the first time someone has done something cheap like that to get an edge in winning a sport.
Cooler
3/20/12 1:18:35AM
Getting cheap shotted should definitely not be covered under the 'Protect yourself at all times' notion, and we already know that since they get disqualified most of the time for this if a knockdown or knockout is caused, but I would say just DQ them anyway and if not at least take a point away for being a stupid douche.

Advocating the protect yourself notion here is being insincere if you're also saying that it was a cheap shot, but you give them the loophole to do it. It's a copout, just like saying 'don't let it go to the judges' Then we need some trained judges not some scapegoat excuse like you should'nt have let it go the distance.
ncordless
3/20/12 4:09:22AM
Both.


Did anyone else notice when Joe Warren did the glove touch/leg kick combo on Curran? Wasn't sad at all to see him get a couple extra at the end after that.
FlashyG
3/20/12 2:18:42PM
You can't hear the ref in this video but isn't the instructions from them normally.

"If you want to touch gloves do it now", and "Protect yourselves at all times"

Fighters need to leave the sportsmanship for after the bell, this has happened too many times for people to still keep falling for it.
prophecy033
3/20/12 7:42:31PM
Cheap cheap cheap cheap cheap
Cooler
3/21/12 4:46:55AM

Posted by FlashyG

You can't hear the ref in this video but isn't the instructions from them normally.

"If you want to touch gloves do it now", and "Protect yourselves at all times"

Fighters need to leave the sportsmanship for after the bell, this has happened too many times for people to still keep falling for it.



Usually I like your posts but thats a scummy thing to advocate and or condone.
Cooler
3/21/12 4:49:55AM

Posted by ncordless

Both.



It's not both, that's disingenuous.
warglory
3/21/12 7:36:54AM

Posted by FlashyG

You can't hear the ref in this video but isn't the instructions from them normally.

"If you want to touch gloves do it now", and "Protect yourselves at all times"

Fighters need to leave the sportsmanship for after the bell, this has happened too many times for people to still keep falling for it.



It's not the instructions that are key here, it was the voluntary touching of gloves after the bell, that both fighters were motioning to do. If you aren't interested in doing this, than signify you aren't interested, but going through with it, and then taking advantage of an opponent whose defenses are slightly down due to good sportsmanship is the very definition of a cheap shot.
FlashyG
3/21/12 12:08:07PM

Posted by warglory

It's not the instructions that are key here, it was the voluntary touching of gloves after the bell, that both fighters were motioning to do. If you aren't interested in doing this, than signify you aren't interested, but going through with it, and then taking advantage of an opponent whose defenses are slightly down due to good sportsmanship is the very definition of a cheap shot.



Both fighters weren't motioning to touch gloves....unless there was another camera angle that I'm not seeing.

Only Maia extended her arm, and she paid the price for it.

They touched gloves less than 10 seconds before, why should Gaff be expected to tell Maia she isn't going to touch gloves again just seconds later. Is she obligated to tell her she's not going to touch gloves at the beginning of the 2nd and 3rd rounds too?


Posted by Cooler
Usually I like your posts but thats a scummy thing to advocate and or condone.



Glove touches during the fight are just absurd to me, its like having both lines in a football game shakes hands after the snap but before making contact with eachother. Or Hockey centers having to shake hands after puck drop but before either touches the puck.

Kpro
3/21/12 3:01:17PM

Posted by FlashyG


Posted by warglory

It's not the instructions that are key here, it was the voluntary touching of gloves after the bell, that both fighters were motioning to do. If you aren't interested in doing this, than signify you aren't interested, but going through with it, and then taking advantage of an opponent whose defenses are slightly down due to good sportsmanship is the very definition of a cheap shot.



Both fighters weren't motioning to touch gloves....unless there was another camera angle that I'm not seeing.



This. What video are you watching warglory?
Pookie
3/21/12 4:41:08PM

Posted by Kpro


Posted by FlashyG


Posted by warglory

It's not the instructions that are key here, it was the voluntary touching of gloves after the bell, that both fighters were motioning to do. If you aren't interested in doing this, than signify you aren't interested, but going through with it, and then taking advantage of an opponent whose defenses are slightly down due to good sportsmanship is the very definition of a cheap shot.



Both fighters weren't motioning to touch gloves....unless there was another camera angle that I'm not seeing.



This. What video are you watching warglory?



Interested in the exact same thing. Solves the thread.
Cooler
3/21/12 4:59:05PM

Posted by FlashyG
Glove touches during the fight are just absurd to me, its like having both lines in a football game shakes hands after the snap but before making contact with eachother. Or Hockey centers having to shake hands after puck drop but before either touches the puck.



I agree with you, I think glove touches should be strictly pre-fight but to take advantage of someone like that.. I just cant condone, at least acknowledge you are not going to touch gloves, theres no substitute for class. I still say being a stupid douche like that doesn't fall under the Protect yourself at all times notion... You dont blame a guy for getting hit in the back of the head do you? thats a better example than using a trying to use a different sport ;)

Sometimes a douche is just a douche.
FlashyG
3/21/12 10:19:59PM
hitting someone in the back of the head is against the rules of the sport.

Hitting someone while they stick their arm out isn't

warglory
3/22/12 7:47:40AM

Posted by Pookie


Posted by Kpro


Posted by FlashyG


Posted by warglory

It's not the instructions that are key here, it was the voluntary touching of gloves after the bell, that both fighters were motioning to do. If you aren't interested in doing this, than signify you aren't interested, but going through with it, and then taking advantage of an opponent whose defenses are slightly down due to good sportsmanship is the very definition of a cheap shot.



Both fighters weren't motioning to touch gloves....unless there was another camera angle that I'm not seeing.



This. What video are you watching warglory?



Interested in the exact same thing. Solves the thread.



Yes, they did touch gloves. Seconds 8 and 9 clearly show her motioning and then touching gloves before throwing a punch. It's very quick because of the camera angle, but it's there. Do you think that Maia would have wandered into punching range with her defenses down if Gaff was in a complete defensive stance and not extending her arm? Come on now.
cowcatcher
3/22/12 8:23:39AM
Anyone can say it wasn't a cheap shot, but if that was their favorite fighter, a friend of theirs, or the person saying it was cheap him/herself in there I'd guess 99.9999% of them would say it was cheap. That to me solves the thread.
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