Sherdog´s MMA Rankings!!

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Stickan
8/10/07 7:53:29AM
They started their rankings today and I got some mixed feelings about it.
What do you think about it?
DCRage
8/10/07 8:22:06AM
Don't like them, not nearly comprehensive enough and they place too much emphasis on recent results. I prefer the MMAWeekly Rankings, they're a bit more comprehensive and more accurate in my view.
thepunisher
8/10/07 9:19:01AM
some of their picks i don't like at all
LR
8/10/07 9:45:21AM
I'm not a fan of Sherdog at all, and some of these rankings prove how skewed they are.

Heavyweights:
1. Fedor
2. Big Nog
3. Gonzaga
4. CroCop
5. Barnett
6. Couture
7. Sylvia
8. Arvloski
9. Werdum
10. Aleksander

I mean, what the hell are these rankings? Gonzaga is at #3. Except he hasn't got the record of Barnett, hasn't beaten Barnett or Couture, he's fought one big name in CroCop, and he LOST to Werdum. Gonzaga should be way down the ranks. Barnett should at LEAST be above him. I can't believe Sylvia is up there. But I'm biased in that regard because I really believe Sylvia can't compete anymore, not after he basically gave the MMA world a tape on how to beat him for 5 straight rounds. Werdum,I wouldn't give him top 10, but he's definitely going to be in there soon.

Light Heavyweight is somewhat bad too.
Soukodjou is number 6, above Arona(ok), Little Nog(ok) - but he's only 4-1. He's proved himself in two fights, but a 4-1 record, I can think of better guys to rank there. Especially since Sherdog put Rashad and Lambert at 9 and 10, even though Rashad technically LOST to Tito.

Middleweights.
After the last match, Silva should definitely be number 1, but Marquardt is ranked above..Dennis Kang, Lawler, and Trigg. I can see maybe Lawler and Trigg, but Kang, I believe, is much more dominant that Marquardt would be. Trigg has an awesome wrestling game at MW, we saw vs. Miller in ICON, and Kang is a beast at times in MW.

I like their WW and LW rankings. Penn at #10 is a stretch though.
thepunisher
8/10/07 9:50:48AM
Vera should be #3 HW
LR
8/10/07 9:56:42AM
LOL, yes MoJoy, he should.
thepunisher
8/10/07 10:01:00AM
that thread got deleted i was looking forward to reading what happened after i left yesterday
CwB
8/10/07 11:58:49AM
Moyjoy is probably reading these rankings and screaming in happiness that GG out ranked CC he probably loves this list.

ya the list has its flaws but i think it is better then MMAWeekly.

And how come chuck liddell isn't number one in light heavies he destroyed rampage...(wishful thinking)
cmill21
8/10/07 1:38:46PM
I guess winning one fight does make you better then guy's who have had amazing careers and fought 10x the competition you have....
Stickan
8/10/07 2:07:55PM
I believe that you should be ranked above the opponent you beat and in stone, scissors, bag situations you should compare the other victories to one another but Barnett should definately be ahead of Gonzaga.

Lambert being on the list is a joke IMO. He has 2(!!!!) total wins in the LHW division. I'd much rather put Overeem there. He's got wins over likes of Belfort (x2), Vovchanchyn and Kharitonov..

btw. Rashad didn't "technically lose" against Tito. Tito lost a point for cheating which he even admitted doing and who knows what would've happened if Rashad got the takedown there.
He might have pummeled him like he did the last seconds of the last round. I'm trying not to be biased or anything cuz I do like Rashad more than Tito but the draw was very justified IMO.

As for the rankings I think there is a lot of question marks in there and some down right stupid picks but hopefully it'll get better over time.
szucconi
8/10/07 2:15:55PM

Posted by cmill21

I guess winning one fight does make you better then guy's who have had amazing careers and fought 10x the competition you have....



Don't discount a high rank of Gonzaga so quickly. I think he may be a little to high, but he schooled CC. CC is a liget top tier HW. When you dominate a guy with his credentials then you are in the top ten instantly. GG lost to Werdum early in his career and if you watch that fight, GG dominated it until he gassed half way though the second round. (I highly recommend watching that fight before picking the UFC 74 main event). I don't think he will be able to go five rounds with Couture, but he will be able to hang until the later rounds. I think that a part of the ranking is potential and skill analysis. Also remember that GG is favored over Couture on all the sports books. They make there money on match up evaluation and they like GG to win most of the time.
StorminYourman
8/10/07 2:35:26PM
Picks they made are not too over the top.Sounds alright in my book.
fullerene
8/10/07 2:58:16PM
They look pretty good, but if I wanted to be a conspiracy theorist, I'd note that the reigning champions for the world's biggest MMA promotion--the UFC--aren't ranked #1 in two weight classes: 185 and 170. They are 7th, 2nd and 5th in the other ones promoted by the UFC. There's a justification that can be made for those lower rankings, but I wonder whether it's not also a way to take a jab at Sherdog's nemesis.
george112
8/10/07 3:44:34PM

Posted by LR

I'm not a fan of Sherdog at all, and some of these rankings prove how skewed they are.

Heavyweights:
1. Fedor
2. Big Nog
3. Gonzaga
4. CroCop
5. Barnett
6. Couture
7. Sylvia
8. Arvloski
9. Werdum
10. Aleksander

I mean, what the hell are these rankings? Gonzaga is at #3. Except he hasn't got the record of Barnett, hasn't beaten Barnett or Couture, he's fought one big name in CroCop, and he LOST to Werdum. Gonzaga should be way down the ranks. Barnett should at LEAST be above him. I can't believe Sylvia is up there. But I'm biased in that regard because I really believe Sylvia can't compete anymore, not after he basically gave the MMA world a tape on how to beat him for 5 straight rounds. Werdum,I wouldn't give him top 10, but he's definitely going to be in there soon.

Light Heavyweight is somewhat bad too.
Soukodjou is number 6, above Arona(ok), Little Nog(ok) - but he's only 4-1. He's proved himself in two fights, but a 4-1 record, I can think of better guys to rank there. Especially since Sherdog put Rashad and Lambert at 9 and 10, even though Rashad technically LOST to Tito.

Middleweights.
After the last match, Silva should definitely be number 1, but Marquardt is ranked above..Dennis Kang, Lawler, and Trigg. I can see maybe Lawler and Trigg, but Kang, I believe, is much more dominant that Marquardt would be. Trigg has an awesome wrestling game at MW, we saw vs. Miller in ICON, and Kang is a beast at times in MW.

I like their WW and LW rankings. Penn at #10 is a stretch though.





i and cmill were trying to prove that exact same point last night when the thread got deleted....
cmill21
8/10/07 4:02:19PM
See but you guys are saying barnetts to low, gg's to high but Mirko should be lower then gg. Now gg beat Mirko once(lucky kick didn't prepare blah blah blah) Mirko in turn beat barnett(the guy your saying should be 3-4 three straight times in very convincing fashion(breaking his face). Now this cannot happen by your guys logic, because if gg should be above Mirko then he has to be #3, Mirko should be infornt of barnett #4, but barnett should be higher? #3 or 4? I think gg should be at 6 until he beats randy(who will prepare for him). Mirko should be 3, barney #4, randy #5, fedor and nog at 1 and 2 respectivly. I dunno I guess beating one guy 3 times convincingly is more impressive then beating one guy once with so many stupid things happening.
DJDark41
8/10/07 4:23:23PM
Serra is once again #1 which is total BS, drop him to at least 5. No way he is #1 in the world. Gabe Gonzaga is too high as well, one win shouldn't put you up that high no matter who the opponent is. Other then that, I'm fine with the list.
Stickan
8/10/07 5:18:59PM

Posted by fullerene

They look pretty good, but if I wanted to be a conspiracy theorist, I'd note that the reigning champions for the world's biggest MMA promotion--the UFC--aren't ranked #1 in two weight classes: 185 and 170. They are 7th, 2nd and 5th in the other ones promoted by the UFC. There's a justification that can be made for those lower rankings, but I wonder whether it's not also a way to take a jab at Sherdog's nemesis.


Damn I feel like the defender of Sherdog but would you put Sean Sherk (2-0 at 155 against KenFlo and Franca) at #1?
Or Couture ahead of Fedor? or Mirko for that matter?
And it's pretty damn hard putting Rampage above Shogun after the beatdown he recieved in 05.
Like you said yourself. There's a justification that can be made for those ranks.

I think everything Sherdog does nowadays gets scrutinized and interpreted as blows at the UFC. Sherwood himself seems a little pissed at all the "whale" comments but other than that I don't see no hidden agenda.
fullerene
8/10/07 5:43:12PM
^ No, I can see the reasoning behind each of those decisions. I'm just pointing out that you would expect the #1 promotion in the world to have most or all of the #1 ranked fighters and they only have two.

Could you put Randy higher? Of course. He beat one of the two big-league champions in his last fight to win his 3rd HW championship. Mirko Cro-Cop lost his last fight, Gonzaga and Barnett have never won a championship and Barnett's last win against a top 10 fighter was 10 months ago.

Could you vote Rampage over Shogun? Sure. Rampage beat the #1 LHW in the world in his last fight. Shogun hasn't beaten a top 10 HW (maybe Overeem was borderline) since Ricardo Arona in August of 2005. I would vote for Shogun myself, but I can see the argument.

Could Sherk be higher than #5? Hell yes. His two wins at 155 were a win and a defense of the UFC title against tough opponents and in his entire career he's only lost to two guys (the #2 and #3 guys at 170) and he has victories over a ranked 170 fighter (Karo Parisyian) and the guy who beat the #1 ranked 155 pound fighter in his last fight (Nick Diaz).

I meant what I said when I said the rankings seemed pretty good. People can and will argue with any set of rankings. Whether by design or coincidence, though, the top guys from the top promotion didn't rank all that highly.
george112
8/10/07 6:03:44PM
to me it looks like all sherdogs rankings are, are based on who has beaten who
Stickan
8/10/07 6:31:12PM

Posted by fullerene

^ No, I can see the reasoning behind each of those decisions. I'm just pointing out that you would expect the #1 promotion in the world to have most or all of the #1 ranked fighters and they only have two.

Could you put Randy higher? Of course. He beat one of the two big-league champions in his last fight to win his 3rd HW championship. Mirko Cro-Cop lost his last fight, Gonzaga and Barnett have never won a championship and Barnett's last win against a top 10 fighter was 10 months ago.

Could you vote Rampage over Shogun? Sure. Rampage beat the #1 LHW in the world in his last fight. Shogun hasn't beaten a top 10 HW (maybe Overeem was borderline) since Ricardo Arona in August of 2005. I would vote for Shogun myself, but I can see the argument.

Could Sherk be higher than #5? Hell yes. His two wins at 155 were a win and a defense of the UFC title against tough opponents and in his entire career he's only lost to two guys (the #2 and #3 guys at 170) and he has victories over a ranked 170 fighter (Karo Parisyian) and the guy who beat the #1 ranked 155 pound fighter in his last fight (Nick Diaz).

I meant what I said when I said the rankings seemed pretty good. People can and will argue with any set of rankings. Whether by design or coincidence, though, the top guys from the top promotion didn't rank all that highly.


Yeah I agree. Rankings are usually very subjective.
I hadn't thought about reasoning like that about Randy and Rampage . Sherk still would still feel misplaced for me in the top 3 thoughas only his LW fights should be taken into consideration when ranking.
Pitbull09
8/11/07 1:16:56AM
I want conture to win jsut so GG goes down in ranking now lol. But I'm glad to see AA got some respect. These ranking mean nothing since I could care less what sherdog thinks about top fighters.
Pitbull09
8/11/07 1:21:34AM
Yea, its a huge joke to have serra even in the top 5 like one of you guys said.
I honestly think he should only be in the top 10 cause he has the title. After Matt Hughes beats him, he better disapper from the list.
hippysmacker
8/11/07 1:49:59AM
This is why i don't like Rankings , or even there discussion some time. Why I can see the reasoning behind their picks, I still can't agree with many of them. the whole belief that someone would beat someone at a given weight, but they haven't fought there enough, vs how someone has done at a weight is probably one of the reasons for P4P. There are many picks I don't agree with( and apparently most of you don't either) , but the worst is Serra at#1 Gonzaga ahead of Croc-cop and Sherk at #5 to me. I know all the argument for each, and understand them, I just don't agree. I would have SerrA #10 , One big victory does not a top guy make. Barnett at # 3 for the reasons already stated by many. Sherk, who I beleive is innocent, would handle anyone at 155 ( cept maybe BJ ) at that weight. Until he is actually suspended and stripped he's my # 1 LW.
cmill21
8/11/07 1:57:27AM
I still don't like how the UFC decided serra recieved a title shot, they put together a bunch of b level fighters, why should they get a shot? They didn't earn it by fighting contenders why should they earn it by fighting other b level fighters? Rant for the day.
SpiderSilva
8/11/07 2:08:47AM
the best #1 next to Fedor was Silva the dude is on fire right now he looks unbeatable
If Hendo moves down thats gonna be a fight to see
cmill21
8/11/07 2:18:51AM
Yeah, I'd still probly pick silva though, he gets a clinch when hendo tries to take him down it's over, and no one can strike with anderson at 185.
Stickan
8/11/07 5:53:41AM

Posted by hippysmacker
I would have SerrA #10 , One big victory does not a top guy make. Barnett at # 3 for the reasons already stated by many. Sherk, who I beleive is innocent, would handle anyone at 155 ( cept maybe BJ ) at that weight. Until he is actually suspended and stripped he's my # 1 LW.


But if one big victory isn't enough, why are two smaller victories enough? (Sherk)

It's even harder to make rankings based on potential. I think BJ has the potential to be the best at both 155 and 170. Should he be ranked #1 at those for that? Even though Bj only has 1 W at 170 and 1 W at 155 in the latest 3 years.
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