Salaverry lost to... illegal blows?

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POLL: were terry's shots illegal to back of the head?
yes, completely illegal 47% (22)
no, the blows weren't illegal 53% (25)
Gladiator
5/27/07 8:30:08PM
i want to start off by saying im not making this thread in any relation to the illegal elbow by joe lauzon last week on TUF 5. i watched the fight this morning and when Ivan hits the ground he immediately covers his face and terry martin starts hitting him right at the base of the skull. i thought yamasaki was stopping the fight to give salaverry some recovery time, i was outraged that he lost like that! on a side note i would like to add that i thought salaverry's takedown defense i that fight was sick.
richieb19
5/27/07 8:39:54PM
Aside from the fact that it was illegal, there was almost no time in between Ivan landing and the fight being stopped... this stoppage along with the Jardine bout made me sick...
Svartorm
5/27/07 8:50:06PM
They looked like they hit the side of the head to me. It was a bit pre-mature, but Ivan didn't complain.
hughesfan1
5/27/07 9:00:21PM
Ivan never complains . He's not that kind fo fighter . Looked like some may have been to the back of the head . I think the quick stopage was much worse. IMO Ivan could've recovered and I really think he would've won the fight.
Ydoc
5/27/07 9:01:02PM
I thought they were mixed... some hit around his ear and a few on the back. A few times it looked like he hit the side of his head and dragged his fist to the back of Ivan's head.

Fight Report has a nifty gif of it up, and by going by it the first hit is clean, second misses the side and grazes the back of his head, the third hits the back of his head, and the last one is clean. As for the fall he lands on his shoulder and looks totally awake at that point.

Hard one to call.
Svartorm
5/27/07 9:06:31PM
Yeah, the slam initially looked much worse than it really was, which is probably why the ref stopped it a bit early. At first, I thought he'd be dumped right on his forehead.
shackle
5/27/07 9:24:26PM
If it wasn't stopped I think he would of been taking unfair punishment.

He wasn't moving or even blocking the shots... Why are some many people upset with the stoppage?

I could see if he was defending the shots or moving to get a better position, but it just didn't seem that way to me. He was laying there taking bombs to the head. I would of stopped the fight too.

I think if he allowed it to go 20-40 more seconds the outcome would still be the same or worst.

As for illegal .. I'm sure 1 or 2 hit the back of the head in the replay...
MattHughesFan
5/28/07 12:11:07AM

Posted by richieb19

Aside from the fact that it was illegal, there was almost no time in between Ivan landing and the fight being stopped... this stoppage along with the Jardine bout made me sick...



Are u serious. i might agree on the Slavery fight but come on i think Houston drooped Jardine like 3 or 4 times in 1 minute, the referrer gave him a lot more time then he should have and i could have seen a justified stoppage happening even earlier
Spiderman
5/28/07 6:43:14PM

Posted by MattHughesFan


Posted by richieb19

Aside from the fact that it was illegal, there was almost no time in between Ivan landing and the fight being stopped... this stoppage along with the Jardine bout made me sick...



Are u serious. i might agree on the Slavery fight but come on i think Houston drooped Jardine like 3 or 4 times in 1 minute, the referrer gave him a lot more time then he should have and i could have seen a justified stoppage happening even earlier



The rules need to be consistent .. Watch Suleov vs Baroni , or Baroni vs Tanner in both fights a fighter was about to get Ko , but got a break due to a illegal knee [ knee to the head , when fighter was on one knee ] The fighter who was on the verge of getting ko [ and would have been ko if not 4 ref interferance ] then came back to win the fight ...

Now that I think about the Tanner vs Baroni wasnt a knee , it was a stoppage to check a cut , or unknown reason ?


Not a racist , but anyone think its weird that 4 black fighters won fights , and 2 of them where under shady circumstances ?
Gladiator
5/28/07 6:50:54PM

Posted by Spiderman

Not a racist , but anyone think its weird that 4 black fighters won fights , and 2 of them where under shady circumstances ?



which other shady circumstance fight was there? why is it weird that 4 black fighters won fights in one night?
Mastodon2
5/28/07 6:53:36PM
Meh, the blows wernt really gross rule breaking, but the stoppage was awful, I know the ref couldnt quite see if Ivans head smashed the ground or not, but he could have given him the benefit of the doubt and let it go on for a few more seconds I thought!
Gladiator
5/28/07 6:59:03PM

Posted by shackle

If it wasn't stopped I think he would of been taking unfair punishment.

He wasn't moving or even blocking the shots... Why are some many people upset with the stoppage?

I could see if he was defending the shots or moving to get a better position, but it just didn't seem that way to me. He was laying there taking bombs to the head. I would of stopped the fight too.

I think if he allowed it to go 20-40 more seconds the outcome would still be the same or worst.

As for illegal .. I'm sure 1 or 2 hit the back of the head in the replay...



true only 1 or 2 shots might have been illegal but they were very hard shots and they were illegal. i dont think renzo got hit by that many knees and i know cole miller only took one elbow to the base of the skull and both of those guys were affected by it and given recovery time. Ivan wasnt even knocked out, and IMO there wasnt enough time between the stoppage to definitely say he wasnt intelligently defending himself.
rcg916
5/28/07 7:01:53PM

Posted by Spiderman

Not a racist , but anyone think its weird that 4 black fighters won fights , and 2 of them where under shady circumstances ?







next, please.
Spiderman
5/29/07 12:00:11AM

Posted by Gladiator


Posted by Spiderman

Not a racist , but anyone think its weird that 4 black fighters won fights , and 2 of them where under shady circumstances ?



which other shady circumstance fight was there? why is it weird that 4 black fighters won fights in one night?




Salaverry vs Martin ,,, and Jaridine vs Anderson . Where Jardine got Kneeded on the ground . This isnt the first time a fighter has been allowed to get away with illegal blows its happened way to often in the ufc . Seems like the rules only apply to some fighters . When a Illegal blow is thrown the fight should be stopped and the fighter who got hit with the illegal blow should get a rest .

I bring up the black fighters , because the ufc lately has been gettting a lot of heat about being for Rednecks and appealing to white america because of there being prodominatly white fighters . This just seems convienent . [ I guess the people makeing the accusations didnt know about A.Silva ? ]


@ posters saying " well maybe 1 or 2 of the shots where illegal " ??? what are you thinking ?? what do you think actually constitutes a rule infraction ? If its a knee to the balls , or a eye poke , or a knee on the ground , or elbow to the spine The fight has to be interuppted and the offending fighter given a warning , and the other fighter given a rest . Dosent matter if the fighter was hurt by it or not , or it a critical time in the fight .

Or why have rules at all , as it is now its just creating a unfair playing field where some of the fighters are allowed to get away with fouls , but other are penelized .
ButterBalls
5/29/07 12:15:14AM
you guys are rediculous...

Quit your whining and wait for the next event, then complain about that too. Its a sport. Its fighting. Everyone isn't going to be happy about every decisions the refs make.

Hell, I'm still not happy that the ref didn't dock Lennox Lewis points for hugging Tyson every time he worked his way inside from Lewis' jab. You don't see me making threads bitching about it, then or now.
Believe-in-judo81
5/29/07 12:15:46AM
My 0.2: Though the stoppage was a bit premature, Ivan could have been badly hurt had he continued taking shots in that position. Mario Yamasaki simply erred on the side of caution and you can't be too upset about that.

Also, Jardine/Houston was in NO way controversial, watch the fight again, the knee hit Jardine squarely in his upper chest. He had plenty of time to recover and if anthing the fight could have been stopped before the knee even landed, Kieth was in trouble as soon as he ate those hooks in the clinch.
ac_gi
5/29/07 1:41:49AM
Illegal or not, Terry Martin is a far superior fighter at this point in their careers. The fight would have ended with Martin's hand raised, one way or the other.
roman
5/29/07 1:51:09AM
Ivan is a badass but I think it was not illegal..... maybe a bit immtaure but not illegal. And Ivan doesn't complain because he knows it was his fault he put it in the judges decision.
shackle
5/29/07 3:15:15AM
You are a racist ... Why would they rig these fights? WHY would they want their poster boy chuck liddell to lose? Just saying your not racist doesn't prove nothing. Your upset your race is losing fights point blank you just not saying it like that to avoid flaming/ban.

There is no way in hell the jardine fight was shady. Maybe the martin fight was a little shady because 1-2 shots may of hit the back of the head, but it's happen before in other fights too. Sometimes people get away with illegal shots it happens get over it.

Anderson silva is Brazilian btw His skin color is black, but I don't beleave he is African decent...



Posted by Spiderman


Posted by Gladiator


Posted by Spiderman

Not a racist , but anyone think its weird that 4 black fighters won fights , and 2 of them where under shady circumstances ?



which other shady circumstance fight was there? why is it weird that 4 black fighters won fights in one night?




Salaverry vs Martin ,,, and Jaridine vs Anderson . Where Jardine got Kneeded on the ground . This isnt the first time a fighter has been allowed to get away with illegal blows its happened way to often in the ufc . Seems like the rules only apply to some fighters . When a Illegal blow is thrown the fight should be stopped and the fighter who got hit with the illegal blow should get a rest .

I bring up the black fighters , because the ufc lately has been gettting a lot of heat about being for Rednecks and appealing to white america because of there being prodominatly white fighters . This just seems convienent . [ I guess the people makeing the accusations didnt know about A.Silva ? ]


@ posters saying " well maybe 1 or 2 of the shots where illegal " ??? what are you thinking ?? what do you think actually constitutes a rule infraction ? If its a knee to the balls , or a eye poke , or a knee on the ground , or elbow to the spine The fight has to be interuppted and the offending fighter given a warning , and the other fighter given a rest . Dosent matter if the fighter was hurt by it or not , or it a critical time in the fight .

Or why have rules at all , as it is now its just creating a unfair playing field where some of the fighters are allowed to get away with fouls , but other are penelized .

xchickox
5/29/07 9:20:12AM
i think that stoppage was justified, salaverry wasn't defending them shots at all, and i dont think they were illegal at all

also i thought the alexander win was fair, jardine was completely nailed, he wouldn't have been able to come back and that knee looked like it was right at the top of the chest in the neck area (not the head), also the knee lands as he only has one knee on the ground not both (so that doesn't count as a grounded opponent, not sure if i'm right there)
Leland
5/31/07 10:22:39AM
When did these forums become an english class?
xchickox
6/2/07 10:46:12AM

Posted by Leland

When did these forums become an english class?



??
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