Randy has a better chance against Cro-cop than most

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MurillaNinjaScrilla
3/14/07 11:02:32PM
Don't get me wrong, Cro-cop is a great Mixed-Martial Artist. He is one of the best Strikers turned MMA fighters ever. While he is excellent at sprawling against double and single leg takedowns by freestyle/scholastic wrestlers, he can be taken down by grapplers with superior upper-body takedowns. Fedor vs. Cro-cop is a perfect example. Randy comes from a Greco-Roman background which is strictly upper-body takedowns. He has always been good at closing the distance with superior strikers, clinching, and opening up opportunities for throws. I think if Randy can take him down, he will win the fight because Cro-Cop has never been on his back in a promotion where elbows are allowed.
Stickan
3/14/07 11:10:09PM
I think you have a great point even though Barnett has got some great upper-body takedowns and didn't manage to bring CC down. Randy probably has a better chance than most people give him credit for and if he doesn't bob and weave and shit too much so he ends up without a head I think he'll do fine and has an excellent chance of pulling off another upset.
roman
3/15/07 1:12:19AM
Tons of good points but I still think Cro Cop will pick him apart counterstriking. IMO Mirko will do lots of leg and body kicks and eventually knock him out. If Randy does get him on the ground ,which I don't think will happen, he will be fine. His ground game has gotten a hundred times better since he started (the guy trains like a mad man) and he proved that when he faced Fedor. But again I hadn't thought about the elbow strikes but I'm sure he'll be ready for them too(like I said the guy trains).

Now don't get me wrong I love Couture and the guy proved he can topple a giant (which I thought he would do). But Cro Cop, in my mind, is a different story.
migo
3/15/07 6:04:51AM

Posted by Stickan

I think you have a great point even though Barnett has got some great upper-body takedowns and didn't manage to bring CC down. Randy probably has a better chance than most people give him credit for and if he doesn't bob and weave and shit too much so he ends up without a head I think he'll do fine and has an excellent chance of pulling off another upset.



Barnett has rather weak takedowns in general, he's great on the ground but he's no takedown artist.
BloodandTears
3/15/07 4:45:25PM

Posted by Stickan

I think you have a great point even though Barnett has got some great upper-body takedowns and didn't manage to bring CC down. Randy probably has a better chance than most people give him credit for and if he doesn't bob and weave and shit too much so he ends up without a head I think he'll do fine and has an excellent chance of pulling off another upset.



Thats a great point there. I think Barnett has at least as much upper body strength as Randy, and accomplished nothing with Mirko. The best chance you got with Mirko is to land a lucky punch, or else tie him up for 3 rounds and hope for a decision. I dont see Randy getting very far with CroCop though.
Ydoc
3/15/07 6:26:01PM
Good point. I think (and hope) this is a good fight and not just hl fodder for CroCop, I think if anybody can Randy will challenge him.
Jeffanori-Gomi
3/15/07 6:27:47PM

Posted by migo
Barnett has rather weak takedowns in general, he's great on the ground but he's no takedown artist.



I think Barnetts takedowns are pretty good. Hunt and Aleks were good takedown/sub Victories....Or do I have my facts mixed up and they took him down?
jdubs
3/15/07 6:32:11PM
can someone look up the tito v rashad july 7 post and tell me what it says, oh yea its on sherdog
johny_rotten
3/15/07 6:57:20PM
Randy deffinitly has the best skill set to challenge Cro Cop, out side of Fedor. On the other hand we have seen Randy get a bit sloppy charging for a take down. Chuck took advantage of it twice, Rizzo lit him up because of it in their first battle. If he does that against Cro it will be light out very quick. I also see Cro Cop as having the 2nd best take down defense in the game behind Chuck. His lower body strength is such a tool when trying to stay upright
hippysmacker
3/16/07 12:18:06AM

Posted by MurillaNinjaScrilla

Don't get me wrong, Cro-cop is a great Mixed-Martial Artist. He is one of the best Strikers turned MMA fighters ever. While he is excellent at sprawling against double and single leg takedowns by freestyle/scholastic wrestlers, he can be taken down by grapplers with superior upper-body takedowns. Fedor vs. Cro-cop is a perfect example. Randy comes from a Greco-Roman background which is strictly upper-body takedowns. He has always been good at closing the distance with superior strikers, clinching, and opening up opportunities for throws. I think if Randy can take him down, he will win the fight because Cro-Cop has never been on his back in a promotion where elbows are allowed.



Excellent points, and I'll be pulling for Randy, but I think Cro-cop will take this one. IMO the reason Randy was able to bob and weave and get close to Sylvia was his lack of hand speed, and unwillingness to kick. Cro-cop is probably the 1rst or 2nd fastest HVY and I fear he will catch Randy with straight punches down the pipe, or a head kick when he weaves.
SICKRICK
3/16/07 7:23:59AM
hippy do you think if randy loses big, what will happen with randy.. i know he has two more fight but if he loses really big to cro cop what will be the next move
hippysmacker
3/16/07 8:49:22AM
If he drops the belt , I wish he would drop to LHVY and fight Tito again. They could sell it, and I don't like Tito. Randy wins , Tito loses. Win-win for me
cowcatcher
3/16/07 8:57:42AM

Posted by hippysmacker

If he drops the belt , I wish he would drop to LHVY and fight Tito again. They could sell it, and I don't like Tito. Randy wins , Tito loses. Win-win for me



i was thinking along those lines, if randy fights CC next and drops the belt i would expect to see him fight once at lhw against a contender, then for his farewell match i would think it would be him and tito
madmarck
3/16/07 9:02:43AM

Posted by hippysmacker

If he drops the belt , I wish he would drop to LHVY and fight Tito again. They could sell it, and I don't like Tito. Randy wins , Tito loses. Win-win for me


That would be quite the big ticket seller for the UFC. If Randy retains the belt i can easily see him dropping to fight Tito againg. If he loses he will get resigned if he wins he will probably retire.

As for Cro Cop. He has no striker in comparison in the UFC HW division. Tim and AA would get knocked out by him. I think there are only a few guys who can beat him. Randy b/c of wrestling and Take downs, Werdum: for the fact of his BJJ and the ground game CC has is what Fabio taught him., and maybe gonzaga. Gabriel has good BJJ and fairly good takedowns. IF he can get hsi fight with Cro Cop on the ground he has a chance of winning. He has to get it there though and that is no easy task.

Cro Cop is afterall the best striker in MMA period. Yes Chuck is good but he is too small. Cro Cop is a superior striker to hunt. For anyone who simply looks at the records and says " well o Cro Cop lost to him" wathc it. Mirko had a injured foot and wore shoes. He couldnt kick.
Not to mention Mirko beat Hunts ass down in K1.

But yes i have to agree that Randy has a better chance agaisnt beating Cro Cop than most. Nog won't beat him in a rematch. Barnett wont beat him, Sylvia, AA, Kongo, Hunt, Liddell, wont beat him.

The only way to beat Cro Cop is to get him on the ground. (unless your Kevin Randleman) or Ernesto Hoost fights in the UFC. So the only guy that can beat him are guys with a good ground game. Fedor, Randy, Werdum, and to a less extent Gonzaga, are the guys who have the skills to beat Cro Cop. Although that wont Guarntee that ANY of them will beat him.
Pyrenus
3/16/07 9:46:14AM
Excellent point. Sprawl won't matter if Randy's got you in an upper body clinch.

Of course, it was the same sort of deal with Chuck too, and Cro Cop is a better striker than Chuck.

Using weak MMath, I can't see how Randy could beat CC. But I'll be rooting for Cap'n America the whole way!
MunkiChops
3/16/07 10:37:59AM
I dont think that you can ever count Randy out. Even though he's just proved the biggest point of his carrer I think that he'll always be the underdog and feel that he's got a point to prove. Also he'll always have the crowds support and that counts for something. When you watch Randy in any fight he's always just ploughing on through. It was just the last 2 Chuck fights where something seemed wrong.

I think that Randy will be looking at Chuck again sometime. After his 2 losses you can now see hes back and badder than ever.

I've only ever seen CC fight in UFC and I'll be watching him Live in Manchester so he'll hopefully give me a better impression than before. Dont get me wrong I thought that he was good it just seemed a little un matched.

wkm311
3/16/07 11:34:59AM

Posted by Pyrenus

Excellent point. Sprawl won't matter if Randy's got you in an upper body clinch.

Of course, it was the same sort of deal with Chuck too, and Cro Cop is a better striker than Chuck.

Using weak MMath, I can't see how Randy could beat CC. But I'll be rooting for Cap'n America the whole way!



Dont bring MMath into this..haha...

but seriously, I think Randy has a decent chance at winning and can never be counted out. I just think Cro Cop is the better fighter and will KO him via straight left...

And as much as I like Randy Couture, I will be rooting for Mirko Filipovic...
Jeffanori-Gomi
3/16/07 6:52:40PM
Does it really matter if Randy loses...IMO hes got nothing to lose going into that fight. People will still love him and he will still be one of the greatest of all time.

I think the Tito vs Randy match would be awsome. Whats up with Tito trying pick on old men?
ryderstrong69
3/17/07 11:19:03PM
i like randy but cro cops goona hurt him and hurt him bad
somethingclever
3/18/07 6:24:00PM
I would actually go so far as to say that Randy has the best chance to beat CC out of all the current UFC HW.
shogunassassin
3/19/07 6:37:52AM

Posted by roman

Tons of good points but I still think Cro Cop will pick him apart counterstriking. IMO Mirko will do lots of leg and body kicks and eventually knock him out. If Randy does get him on the ground ,which I don't think will happen, he will be fine. His ground game has gotten a hundred times better since he started (the guy trains like a mad man) and he proved that when he faced Fedor. But again I hadn't thought about the elbow strikes but I'm sure he'll be ready for them too(like I said the guy trains).

Now don't get me wrong I love Couture and the guy proved he can topple a giant (which I thought he would do). But Cro Cop, in my mind, is a different story.



Randy has never been hit as hard as Crocop hits/kicks.

Randy couldnt finish sylvia. He dominated him, but couldnt finish, this is his problem. No disrespect to sylvia, but he is rubbish, Crocop will be hard to put away, and Randy will get hit by something eventually.

Crocop could stick to leg kicks and win like he did over Yoshida.
madmarck
3/19/07 9:04:34AM

Posted by shogunassassin


Posted by roman

Tons of good points but I still think Cro Cop will pick him apart counterstriking. IMO Mirko will do lots of leg and body kicks and eventually knock him out. If Randy does get him on the ground ,which I don't think will happen, he will be fine. His ground game has gotten a hundred times better since he started (the guy trains like a mad man) and he proved that when he faced Fedor. But again I hadn't thought about the elbow strikes but I'm sure he'll be ready for them too(like I said the guy trains).

Now don't get me wrong I love Couture and the guy proved he can topple a giant (which I thought he would do). But Cro Cop, in my mind, is a different story.



Randy has never been hit as hard as Crocop hits/kicks.

Randy couldnt finish sylvia. He dominated him, but couldnt finish, this is his problem. No disrespect to sylvia, but he is rubbish, Crocop will be hard to put away, and Randy will get hit by something eventually.

Crocop could stick to leg kicks and win like he did over Yoshida.



Randy has never been hit has hard as a Cro Cop punch/ kick? Maybe not. But he has gotten hit really really really fricking hard. Fighting Chuck 3 times. Getting KO'd 2 of them. Not to mention he fought Rizzo twice. And he needed months of rehab to fix his legs after the 1st fight. He got pounded by both Ricco and Barnett on the Ground. He fought Vitor 3 times, and he fought kickboxer Mo smith.

Randy has been hit hard his whole Career. I think he can take a punch. I dont think he has faced a sub guy yet. Hmmm thats weird. So it kinda seems Randy gets heavy punchers every fight whetere its strong GNP guys or big strikers.

Randy has been hit hard period. Toughest 40 yr old man out there. Well 43 year old. He can take head/body/leg shots and keep goin. Randy is gonna have to be not able to stand to quit and you know it.
shogunassassin
3/19/07 11:23:08AM

Posted by madmarck


Posted by shogunassassin


Posted by roman

Tons of good points but I still think Cro Cop will pick him apart counterstriking. IMO Mirko will do lots of leg and body kicks and eventually knock him out. If Randy does get him on the ground ,which I don't think will happen, he will be fine. His ground game has gotten a hundred times better since he started (the guy trains like a mad man) and he proved that when he faced Fedor. But again I hadn't thought about the elbow strikes but I'm sure he'll be ready for them too(like I said the guy trains).

Now don't get me wrong I love Couture and the guy proved he can topple a giant (which I thought he would do). But Cro Cop, in my mind, is a different story.



Randy has never been hit as hard as Crocop hits/kicks.

Randy couldnt finish sylvia. He dominated him, but couldnt finish, this is his problem. No disrespect to sylvia, but he is rubbish, Crocop will be hard to put away, and Randy will get hit by something eventually.

Crocop could stick to leg kicks and win like he did over Yoshida.



Randy has never been hit has hard as a Cro Cop punch/ kick? Maybe not. But he has gotten hit really really really fricking hard. Fighting Chuck 3 times. Getting KO'd 2 of them. Not to mention he fought Rizzo twice. And he needed months of rehab to fix his legs after the 1st fight. He got pounded by both Ricco and Barnett on the Ground. He fought Vitor 3 times, and he fought kickboxer Mo smith.

Randy has been hit hard his whole Career. I think he can take a punch. I dont think he has faced a sub guy yet. Hmmm thats weird. So it kinda seems Randy gets heavy punchers every fight whetere its strong GNP guys or big strikers.

Randy has been hit hard period. Toughest 40 yr old man out there. Well 43 year old. He can take head/body/leg shots and keep goin. Randy is gonna have to be not able to stand to quit and you know it.


No doubt he has been hit hard, but I think a Crocop left high kick is one of the most devastating blows out there. period.
Vitor, never really showed up in those fights. Rizzo, good, but overrated. The rest beat him. If chuck can out-strike him, Crocop can. What would you reckon Crocop vs Chuck?
madmarck
3/19/07 11:49:23AM
Cro Cop, Chuck, Kinda frciking hard hitters. Just brought Rizzo up for the leg kick factors. Those were never overrated jsut ask Dan Severn. Randy knows what it is like to hit hard. I just hope his chin can take it. While it isnt glass, it isnt Rock or Cabbage chin. And it is possible to KO him. Not to mention with age the body detrioeates right? I mean look at Tim Sylvia he is 31 and he just got pwned thats old J/k.

Hope Randy wins. He has a good chance of winning, but its a chance not a guarntee. Who knows maybe he will hit Cro Cop with a huge punch like Randleman did. All i know is that if Randy is gonna fight CC he is gonna have to bring in some big strikers to his training camp like Chuck Liddell to help him train.
shogunassassin
3/19/07 12:03:56PM

Posted by madmarck

Cro Cop, Chuck, Kinda frciking hard hitters. Just brought Rizzo up for the leg kick factors. Those were never overrated jsut ask Dan Severn. Randy knows what it is like to hit hard. I just hope his chin can take it. While it isnt glass, it isnt Rock or Cabbage chin. And it is possible to KO him. Not to mention with age the body detrioeates right? I mean look at Tim Sylvia he is 31 and he just got pwned thats old J/k.

Hope Randy wins. He has a good chance of winning, but its a chance not a guarntee. Who knows maybe he will hit Cro Cop with a huge punch like Randleman did. All i know is that if Randy is gonna fight CC he is gonna have to bring in some big strikers to his training camp like Chuck Liddell to help him train.



Agreed. I know Rizzo had great kicks, his defence wasnt great so as a fighter he was overrated. I do think crocops kicks are in a different league though. Remember his first ufc fight, when he kicked whatzisname and the whole arena went silent!
I think Randys only chance is to get him to the fence and take him down.

Wanna wager on the fight?
madmarck
3/19/07 12:44:28PM

Posted by shogunassassin


Posted by madmarck

Cro Cop, Chuck, Kinda frciking hard hitters. Just brought Rizzo up for the leg kick factors. Those were never overrated jsut ask Dan Severn. Randy knows what it is like to hit hard. I just hope his chin can take it. While it isnt glass, it isnt Rock or Cabbage chin. And it is possible to KO him. Not to mention with age the body detrioeates right? I mean look at Tim Sylvia he is 31 and he just got pwned thats old J/k.

Hope Randy wins. He has a good chance of winning, but its a chance not a guarntee. Who knows maybe he will hit Cro Cop with a huge punch like Randleman did. All i know is that if Randy is gonna fight CC he is gonna have to bring in some big strikers to his training camp like Chuck Liddell to help him train.



Agreed. I know Rizzo had great kicks, his defence wasnt great so as a fighter he was overrated. I do think crocops kicks are in a different league though. Remember his first ufc fight, when he kicked whatzisname and the whole arena went silent!
I think Randys only chance is to get him to the fence and take him down.

Wanna wager on the fight?


Ill wager if you take the loser. And yeah Rizzos kicks arent in the league of Cro Cops. But really who's are? I think the fence will work to Randys advantage to take CC down. But i think CC is working on how to use the fence to get up like Chuck does.
shogunassassin
3/19/07 2:55:13PM

Posted by madmarck


Posted by shogunassassin


Posted by madmarck

Cro Cop, Chuck, Kinda frciking hard hitters. Just brought Rizzo up for the leg kick factors. Those were never overrated jsut ask Dan Severn. Randy knows what it is like to hit hard. I just hope his chin can take it. While it isnt glass, it isnt Rock or Cabbage chin. And it is possible to KO him. Not to mention with age the body detrioeates right? I mean look at Tim Sylvia he is 31 and he just got pwned thats old J/k.

Hope Randy wins. He has a good chance of winning, but its a chance not a guarntee. Who knows maybe he will hit Cro Cop with a huge punch like Randleman did. All i know is that if Randy is gonna fight CC he is gonna have to bring in some big strikers to his training camp like Chuck Liddell to help him train.



Agreed. I know Rizzo had great kicks, his defence wasnt great so as a fighter he was overrated. I do think crocops kicks are in a different league though. Remember his first ufc fight, when he kicked whatzisname and the whole arena went silent!
I think Randys only chance is to get him to the fence and take him down.

Wanna wager on the fight?


Ill wager if you take the loser. And yeah Rizzos kicks arent in the league of Cro Cops. But really who's are? I think the fence will work to Randys advantage to take CC down. But i think CC is working on how to use the fence to get up like Chuck does.



good call. CC is alot stronger than chuck also.
brodieros
3/25/07 11:25:31PM
I hope everyone would agree chucks hands are better than Cro Cop. so the main issue in my opinion is the LHK. i think Randy has his number. I think randy has the advantage with the octagon as opposed to the four cornered ring, and of coarse the elbows. Randy should never be underestimated. I think we see Cro Cop walking away from randy like he did continuously in the hunt fight he lost.
mkiv9secsupra
3/26/07 12:59:59AM

Posted by brodieros

I hope everyone would agree chucks hands are better than Cro Cop. so the main issue in my opinion is the LHK. i think Randy has his number. I think randy has the advantage with the octagon as opposed to the four cornered ring, and of coarse the elbows. Randy should never be underestimated. I think we see Cro Cop walking away from randy like he did continuously in the hunt fight he lost.



the octagon isnt going to affect anything in this fight..its going to be a stand up fight all the way. Randy isnt going to be able to use the clinch against CroCop. The fight is going to end as soon as Couture shoots and CC steps out and gives him the left straight from hell. Crocop had to step away from hunt because hunt has such a great chin....Couture doesnt even compare on that level.
Huckit
3/26/07 6:02:41AM
liddell beat couture. crocop has better sprawl and standup than crocop. couture is even older now. coutures only chance is that crocop has never taken on a ground fighter in the cage so the cage might be a problem
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