pro bowl rosters

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cowcatcher
12/18/07 8:10:16PM
i cant argue with a ton of the picks, but the fact that only 4 packers and 7 vikings are on it blows my mind. also the cowboys had 11, dont get me wrong, they are a very good team, but they have the same record as the pack. team records usually have a ton to do with this so how in the hell are there only 4 packers, guys like greg jennings, chad clifton, nick barnett, and charles woodson were left off while patrick willis gets the nod and although he leads the league in tackles(on a horrible team whose offense cant stay on the field) he has 1 sack and ZERO interceptions. obviously im biased and guys that have been there before more often than not get the nod, but having a big name at your position doesnt equal a pro bowl type year. at least the pro bowl is the most pathetic all star game in american sports, i just would have liked to see some more of the guys from a 12-2 team get individual recognition.

EDIT: on a sode note i think its great that sean taylor got onto the roster despite his passing, its a nice send off to a quality player taken too soon.
CantAndleDaRiddum
12/18/07 8:22:32PM
Cowboys got all the bigger names, U got the star as your AV so from one fellow cowboy to another i know u already know this
plus if u take records away, and oput the cowboys roster up next to green bay, would anyone even know half greenbays roster?
greenbay is better team, cowboys have better athletes
u agree?
cowcatcher
12/18/07 8:28:43PM
actually im a packer fan, but i lost an av bet when the boys beat the packers. i dont know that ken hamlin is the most deserving safety and were he still with seattle im guessing he wouldnt have made the roster, and leonard davis has been a huge bust since being drafted by arizona, but once again being on the boys roster got him a trip to honolulu. i think both teams are fairly evenly matched when at full strength, but you are right that dallas has more big names, the packers are one of the youngest teams in the nfl even with old man favre at the helm.
CantAndleDaRiddum
12/18/07 8:47:25PM
oh u r a packer fan, sorry for assuming
i am a cowboy fan but favre is my fav player ever, im from mississippi so i grew up with dad talkin bout how great he is at southern miss and i got an autograph football of his that i cherish....if cowboys dont make it to superbowl i will be upset, but if its packers that get there instead it will take the sting out a lil
cowcatcher
12/18/07 8:50:22PM
i just hope that if the pack doesnt get to the big gmae, whoever does takes out the pats. i was a fan of danny white of the cowboys as a kid, but that was because we had the same first name, i liked marino for that reason too.
CantAndleDaRiddum
12/18/07 9:00:37PM
i got a question for ya

think the pack or cowboys could beat the colts in the super bowl?

i think colts stand a great chance of coming out of the afc and hurting the pats feelings, if they dont, green bay, dallas, and if jacksonville played a GREAT game, i could see them beating new england, no one else though
new england is too good
and as a cowboy fan, i do not want them to play the colts, peyton would eat us alive, yall got a good enough defense to give them problems
cowcatcher
12/18/07 9:06:34PM
the colts d is banged up a bit so i can see either one of our teams beating them, but they are still the nfl champs until beaten in the playoffs so they are a tough test for anyone. harrison coming back at 100% is going to make them look that much better now that gonzales has established himself as another option at WR a la brandon stokely. as a fan id rather see the nfc win it just because it makes the pack look better if they lose to the eventual champs, but id still be a little sour about anyone beating them.
CantAndleDaRiddum
12/18/07 9:29:59PM
i completely agree about wanting to see nfc winning, if we can get terry glenn back 100% by playoff time, our offense would be scary
emfleek
12/18/07 11:10:50PM
GO COLTS!
CantAndleDaRiddum
12/19/07 6:19:10AM
just noticed Sean Taylor made it, believe he is 1st player to ever make pro bowl while passing away before the pro bowl.....just testament to how good he really was......tragic...
DCRage
12/19/07 7:49:12AM
Props to the fans for voting Sean in, the way he was playing he almost certainly would've earned the spot anyway. And congrats to AP on being voted the RB starter for the NFC, a great way to top off an incredible rookie campaign.
rameydl8
12/19/07 9:10:50AM
I think the pack shouldve had a few more people on like Nick Barnett and woodson..and i believe Kabeer baja-biamila wouldve made it if he would have played every game this season...but i guess theres nothin we can do about it....so i guess we'll just have to watch brett favre throw about 50 td's this game and love....lol
pv3Hpv3p
12/19/07 10:55:44AM
Well, if it makes you feel better, Sharper got nominated and he used to be a Packer... No? Well, I tried...

I guess when it comes to the Vikings... Kevin and Pat Williams should have been probowler for the past 3 or 4 years... Kevin has been, but this is the first time Pat Williams has been voted in as a probowl starter... If he doesn't deserve it, I don't know who does...

Birk is one of the best centers in the league... He's one of the few remaining centers that can pull effectively and for christ's sake he's a Harvard grad!

AP... Well, I don't really need to say anything about that... AP's the shit... Probowl, rookie of the year, offensive player of the year, MVP... Just give the kid some stock in the NFL or something cause he already owns
ohiostate1016
12/19/07 1:50:44PM
The only thing that bothers me is that Joseph Addai got in over Fred Taylor. I know that Addai has more TDs than Taylor, but Taylor has more yards. If nothing else, they could have given the spot to Taylor based on his career. It is a shame that he has never made a Pro Bowl. He's one of the most underrated RBs to ever play the game.

And I'm a Browns fan, by the way. Congrats to Braylon Edwards and Josh Cribbs. I could argue for Derek Anderson, Jamal Lewis, and Kellen Winslow, and I'm also surprised that none of our offensive linemen made it. I thought that at least one of them would have made it. Oh well, at least we are headed to the playoffs!
emfleek
12/19/07 2:07:50PM

Posted by ohiostate1016

The only thing that bothers me is that Joseph Addai got in over Fred Taylor. I know that Addai has more TDs than Taylor, but Taylor has more yards. If nothing else, they could have given the spot to Taylor based on his career. It is a shame that he has never made a Pro Bowl. He's one of the most underrated RBs to ever play the game.

And I'm a Browns fan, by the way. Congrats to Braylon Edwards and Josh Cribbs. I could argue for Derek Anderson, Jamal Lewis, and Kellen Winslow, and I'm also surprised that none of our offensive linemen made it. I thought that at least one of them would have made it. Oh well, at least we are headed to the playoffs!



I understand where you're coming from in regards to Addai/Taylor, but keep in mind, Taylor has played 14 games and Addai's played 13. Had Addai played that 14th game, the yardage would more than likely be close to the same.

Addai has 7 more TD's than Taylor...that's the trump card in this situation.

That, and the fact that the fans do the voting. It's really a popularity contest.

It IS a shame that Taylor's never made the Pro Bowl, though.
cowcatcher
12/19/07 2:14:02PM
the fans only count for 1/3 of the voting, 1/3 is the coaches, and 1/3 is the players. a lot of players dont keep up with stats like the die hard fans out there(and there are a ton of them) so a lot of times guys get in on reputation and based on what team they play for.
emfleek
12/19/07 2:19:46PM

Posted by cowcatcher

the fans only count for 1/3 of the voting, 1/3 is the coaches, and 1/3 is the players. a lot of players dont keep up with stats like the die hard fans out there(and there are a ton of them) so a lot of times guys get in on reputation and based on what team they play for.



Damn. I need to turn in my Man Card for that one.

I was confusing the Pro Bowl with the MLB All-Star game.

My apologies.

I'm so embarrassed.
cowcatcher
12/19/07 3:53:43PM
its the holiday season so youre forgiven
hippysmacker
12/19/07 4:41:58PM

Posted by cowcatcher

i cant argue with a ton of the picks, but the fact that only 4 packers and 7 vikings are on it blows my mind. also the cowboys had 11, dont get me wrong, they are a very good team, but they have the same record as the pack. team records usually have a ton to do with this so how in the hell are there only 4 packers, guys like greg jennings, chad clifton, nick barnett, and charles woodson were left off while patrick willis gets the nod and although he leads the league in tackles(on a horrible team whose offense cant stay on the field) he has 1 sack and ZERO interceptions. obviously im biased and guys that have been there before more often than not get the nod, but having a big name at your position doesnt equal a pro bowl type year. at least the pro bowl is the most pathetic all star game in american sports, i just would have liked to see some more of the guys from a 12-2 team get individual recognition.

EDIT: on a sode note i think its great that sean taylor got onto the roster despite his passing, its a nice send off to a quality player taken too soon.




Where to start Cow(boy)catcher :) First - I agree that being on high profile and winning teams helps your chances of making the pro bowl. 2nd- I'm glad you admit your biased, because we disagree. Whether anyone believes me or not, I don't consider myself biased ,and will let Dallas have it when I feel they deserve it. I am aware most fans are biased towards there team, but I think my perspective as a football coach gives me a more detached way of watching the game. I always Tivo Dallas games ,and watch them 3 to 4 times. I usually re watch all the games the NFL network replays a few times as well. Lets address your points. Greg Jennings- Donald Driver made it instead based on his seniority . You generally have to be good for a couple of years straight , unless you have such a incredible year ( like Adrian Peterson) that it can't be denied. While both had good years, Jennings seemed to make a lot more big plays, and I would personally substitute him for Driver this year, even though I think Don had more catches. Driver is more established ,so he got it instead. I agree with you on Barnett or even Hawk. Hard to pick which one goes though. Hawk is better in coverage, and more athletic. Barnett is a tackling machine. I would have picked either over Willis. I don't discount Willis, he is also a tackling machine, but he makes them farther back from the line than Barnett. Whether that is due to the guys in front of him , or him having slower instincts will be proven out over time. Woodson is till a top 15 corner IMO, but Al Harris made it instead. I actually think Harris is better play to play than Woodson. Charles gambles too much IMO, so while he will make a lot of big plays, he will also give up his share. Chad Clifton is well past his prime IMO. As a former lineman it's where I look first. I think your center is actually your best lineman currently.Wells gets off the ball quick ,and is very good chipping off double teams at the second level. He even anchors pretty well against the bull rush, and stood out when I was re watching the film of that game. He is also very good with his hands , and keeps his center of gravity low. I would rank Wells currently the 5th best center in football behind Birk, Gurode, Saturday, and Hardwick. Bentley was the best before his injury, but he still hasn't made it back. Clifton has performed well since the big injury 4 or 5 years ago , but is more of finesse technician now who can be pushed around, and he doesn't always take enough depth on his jab step against speed rushers. If he were to make the pro bowl this year, it would have been on reputation only , the same way Roy Williams made it last year when he was exposed with deep coverage problems. Leonard Davis is where I disagree with you most. He has in no way been a bust , His first 3 years in the league AZ played him at guard and he was dominant. The only reason I can see him not making the Pro Bowl ,at least 2 out of 3 of those years, is he played on a bad team. Then they moved him to LT, which is what he was drafted to play, even though he didn't have the feet to play on the left side against speed rushers. He was a dominant run blocker there, but only average as a pass blocker on the whole. He was way below average against speed rushers on the left side IMO. At guard for Dallas he has been a force all year long. Only Steve Hutchinson, a healthy Shawn Andrews , and Alan Faneca are currently better at guard. If Dallas can't re-sign Flozell, and they move Davis to LT next year, I think he will have the same problems as before. Thankfully Roy Wiliams didn't get in this year. He is now best suited to be a weak side LB in a tampa 2 cover scheme, and is lost in coverage. It's not really a speed thing anymore, he just gets turned too easily, and it has actually made him tentative when someone catches the ball in front of him. Williams used to light people up when they caught the ball routinely. Now he only does it when coming to give help in zone coverage. Hamlin really covered the deep ball problems we had last year and had some huge plays , and is very deserving to me. He was a alternate for Seattle 2 years ago, so he was already on the cusp IMO. Anyway. Just my opinion of course. By the way, that star sure is shiny
cowcatcher
12/19/07 5:20:15PM
unfortunately i think harris and woodson took votes away from each other, but woodson is a first alternate so he could still end up with a nice vacation. hawk has been very good recently but the in beginning of the year he still was going through some growing pains, whereas barnett is the heart and soul of the D and although he too is a first alternate, should have made the team initially IMO. clifton has become a technique guy, but he is the anchor of that line and a left takle can afford to be a technique guy as long as he has good feet, which clifton does, also hes another first alternate, so im not as pissed as i was yesterday. jennings has 6 times as many TDs as driver but being there before certainly helped DD get in, jennings is an alt too, just not the first. hamlin is a decent safety and its too bad that the whole bar fight happened to him, hes lucky to even be on the field at this point, but i dont see him as better than nick collins(also an alt) but collins missed some time so what can you do. as far as davis goes, my opinion wont change on him, he was a number 2 overall pick that the cardinals let go without compensation.....THE CARDINALS, the most dismal football franchise in the NFL. then the 'boys toss $50 million(something like 20 guaranteed) for him to be an adequate run blocker, ok maybe above average, and a poor pass blocker that constantly needs help with a double. i think hes been overpaid and overhyped since leaving texas, and without that silver and blue on would never have gotten a whisper about the pro bowl. i hope they have plenty of poi in hawaii this year. only about 5 weeks until our teams meet again smacker of the filthy longhairs that smell like an allman brothers tourbus, heres to hoping both teams are healthy(well at least the pack) and a good game to see who gets to make the pats 18-1.
hippysmacker
12/19/07 6:17:45PM
I think we will meet again. Someday when we have the 1rst annual nutthuggers suck get together, I will bring down some tape of Davis for you to watch. Just because AZ wouldn't pay the amount of money Hutchinson, Davis ,and Steinbach( 3 of the 10 best guards in football IMO) got on the open market doesn't mean they weren't worth it. Dallas was one of 5 teams willing to give him that kind of cash to play guard or RT. Because he is from Texas , he actually took less money than Washington offered him, to play at home. When Davis is driving Jolly, Jenkins, Barnett, and Hawk onto their backs I will make a gif of it for you. I only wish I hadn't deleted that last game off my Tivo. Watching Lenny kick ass gave me sweet dreams
zephead
12/19/07 7:32:54PM
How bout dem Iggles
hathcock32
12/20/07 1:01:35AM
Hippy wheres Olin Kruetz on ur list for top 5 centers.
hippysmacker
12/20/07 1:40:05AM
About 8th. He has lost a step . He used to be the 2nd best technician in the game IMO, but he has been bending at the waste a lot this year. When a guy stops bending at the knees, after doing it properly for a long time, it usually means his cartilage is wearing down. Kevin Mawae has been doing the same thing the last 2 years, but the guards he doubles with, are better than Chicagos. Birk is far away the best now to me.
Pitbull09
12/20/07 6:14:13PM
Is anyone suprised that not one Jaguar made the list. I know theyre still a developing team but they could be argued as the 3rd best AFC team with theyre record.

I think Taylor really desrved that 3rd spot on the RB but somehow Joseph Addi got it. Taylor's play this year is amazing for 10 years in the league and its hard to not see him in there.

You could say Addi's stats give him the spot but he has a small part in keeping that Colt's team a winning team and its a lot easier to run when the defense is worried about the pass gains from Manning. Taylor has been the cornerstone for that offense.

I can understand their quarter back didnt make it with the year Brady, Ben, Manning, and Derrick Anderson are having but he did have a nice year for the recievers he was given.