Phelps' Record Breaking Moment

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BlueSkiesBurn
8/1/12 1:49:29AM

Posted by FlashyG


Posted by BlueSkiesBurn


Posted by FlashyG

I personally think there is a FAR bigger difference between hurdles and sprinting than there is between the breast stroke and the butterfly.

There are tons of swimmers who take part in more than one stroke and I can't think of a single hurdler who also competes in the 100, 200 or 400m races.

If there was an event where a sprinter had to run with his arms by his/her sides I would gladly include it in the running races and I'd still exclude the hurdles.

The complete lunacy to that idea is pretty much how I feel about giving medals out for doing different strokes in a swimming pool.




I can understand why you personally feel that way, but as a former swimmer, let me just say that butterfly and freestyle are WAY different. Totally different muscles, totally different physics, totally different approaches. It's like saying that Aussie Rules Football and Rugby are the same. They are, but they're really not.




I may have sucked at them but I competed in the freestyle and the back-stroke in high-school...I found I sucked equally at both, and the same swimmers normally won at every meet in every stroke.

I also sucked at the 100 and 200m yet I couldn't clear a single hurdle if you gave me and endless # of attempts.



I had the totally opposite experience with track. When I was running cross country, they had me run in 400m competitions and do the long jump. I thought that was normal.

The people who dominated at my swim club varied by event. Like, 100m champs were usually contenders at 200m, but that didn't necessarily mean they were the top guy. They were usually damn good, but that didn't mean they always won.
BlueSkiesBurn
8/1/12 1:51:48AM

Posted by Boo_Radley21

Enjoy it while it lasts, Americans...
Once that water freezes over the ball is in our court



Bro, I am a huge fan of the Winter games and I am actually a certified curling instructor, but people do not care about the Winter games like they do the Summer Olympics.

The Winter Olympics is the Strikeforce to the Summer Olympics' UFC.
FlashyG
8/1/12 2:11:11AM

Posted by BlueSkiesBurn


Posted by Boo_Radley21

Enjoy it while it lasts, Americans...
Once that water freezes over the ball is in our court



Bro, I am a huge fan of the Winter games and I am actually a certified curling instructor, but people do not care about the Winter games like they do the Summer Olympics.

The Winter Olympics is the Strikeforce to the Summer Olympics' UFC.



Only because the majority of the worlds population live in warmer climates.

In Canada, its completely the opposite and I imagine you'd find the same response as you get closer to the poles.

There is also a TON more events at the Summer games.

Unrelated Question(s) - Why do you need to throw out some ridiculous "qualification" when you speak on a topic? How does being a "certified curling instructor" matter in the context of this discussion? It seems like you just wanted a chance to self promote. Its an internet message board not a job interview, we don't need your resume to evaluate your opinion on a subject. You're smart enough to let your words stand on their own.
BlueSkiesBurn
8/1/12 2:38:12AM

Posted by FlashyG
Only because the majority of the worlds population live in warmer climates.

In Canada, its completely the opposite and I imagine you'd find the same response as you get closer to the poles.

There is also a TON more events at the Summer games.

Unrelated Question(s) - Why do you need to throw out some ridiculous "qualification" when you speak on a topic? How does being a "certified curling instructor" matter in the context of this discussion? It seems like you just wanted a chance to self promote. Its an internet message board not a job interview, we don't need your resume to evaluate your opinion on a subject. You're smart enough to let your words stand on their own.



I actually didn't throw it out there for that reason. I threw it out there because how much can a southern California guy be "into" curling. If I tell a Canadian that I'm "into" curling, they'll probably laugh at the notion.

Inasmuch as I am sure a typical American would laugh if the common Brit tried to talk about the NFL with them.

You said it yourself, Canadians are much more dedicated about Winter sports than warmer climates. Especially California. So, I said "certified instructor" as a means to illustrate that I had more than a casual, passing interest in the sport when talking to an individual from a country where the sport was ubiquitous.

I think you were a little harsh with the judgement. Seems kind of pointless to ask a question when you've already formed the answer in your head, no?
FlashyG
8/1/12 2:47:56AM

Posted by BlueSkiesBurn


Posted by FlashyG
Only because the majority of the worlds population live in warmer climates.

In Canada, its completely the opposite and I imagine you'd find the same response as you get closer to the poles.

There is also a TON more events at the Summer games.

Unrelated Question(s) - Why do you need to throw out some ridiculous "qualification" when you speak on a topic? How does being a "certified curling instructor" matter in the context of this discussion? It seems like you just wanted a chance to self promote. Its an internet message board not a job interview, we don't need your resume to evaluate your opinion on a subject. You're smart enough to let your words stand on their own.



I actually didn't throw it out there for that reason. I threw it out there because how much can a southern California guy be "into" curling. If I tell a Canadian that I'm "into" curling, they'll probably laugh at the notion.

Inasmuch as I am sure a typical American would laugh if the common Brit tried to talk about the NFL with them.

You said it yourself, Canadians are much more dedicated about Winter sports than warmer climates. Especially California. So, I said "certified instructor" as a means to illustrate that I had more than a casual, passing interest in the sport when talking to an individual from a country where the sport was ubiquitous.

I think you were a little harsh with the judgement. Seems kind of pointless to ask a question when you've already formed the answer in your head, no?



The question was rhetorical.

I personally find that a pretty weak reason to discount someone's opinion. I wouldn't think any less of a good opinion on curling or hockey because it came from an american, just as I'd be annoyed if someone downplayed my opinions on Football or Baseball based on me being Canadian (which you've done to me BTW). Peoples words and opinions should be evaluated on their merits not based on the nationality of the person who spoke or typed them in this instance.

BlueSkiesBurn
8/1/12 3:39:37AM

Posted by FlashyG

The question was rhetorical.

I personally find that a pretty weak reason to discount someone's opinion. I wouldn't think any less of a good opinion on curling or hockey because it came from an american, just as I'd be annoyed if someone downplayed my opinions on Football or Baseball based on me being Canadian (which you've done to me BTW). Peoples words and opinions should be evaluated on their merits not based on the nationality of the person who spoke or typed them in this instance.




I agree with you 100% and wish it actually played out like that. That said, I was trying to address your original question in relation to why I said what I said. The reality is that Americans, British, Canadians etc. are rather possessive of sports they play more prominently in other countries.

I've told several cold weather people that I was a huge fan of curling and they still told me later that they never once thought I was as into as I was. They thought I just really liked to watch it because that's what their experience has taught them about Americans pretending to know everything about sports.

So, I get it. I totally understand it. I'm sure Babalu46 can attest to what it's like to be a die-hard NFL fan in the UK. I'm sure Americans treat him like a Brit who is thinking of "soccer." The rest of the world does the same to America about soccer. We suck at it, it's not as emphasized here in the States, and most Americans know dick-all about international players/matches. Hell, even some Americans have begun to mock other Americans about "loving" soccer.

So, to answer your question, I used that qualifier to state that I was WAY more interested in some Winter games than most of your typical Americans, even I think the Winter Olympics pale in comparison to the Summer.

I honestly wasn't even thinking about it in the sense of bragging. The thought that it could be seen that way had never crossed my mind. I just didn't want to be thought of as a Southern California guy "claiming" to "love" Curling, but really didn't know shit about it.

Really, I just wanted to illustrate that I wasn't totally biased toward the Summer games because there's way more "American" sports. It was just another way to emphasize that I absolutely love the Winter games.
Bubbles
8/1/12 7:45:04AM
come on Josh, we all know all you have to do in Cali to get that license is walk in and say that the object in play is called a rock and they'll give it to you
airkerma
8/1/12 10:33:06AM

Posted by Boo_Radley21

Enjoy it while it lasts, Americans...
Once that water freezes over the ball is in our court


Sorry, but Iceketball is an American sport founded in Minnesota. The Erickson family is unbeatable (HIMYM).
Not taking away from Phelps, but damn I wish he had come in the shape he was in last time. I'm pretty sure he's burned out on the sport, having done the same monotonous, boring, sucky, practice twice a day day in and day out. But how cool would it have been if he had broken that record two days ago if he had golded the IM, golded the 2 fly, golded the 4free relay?
BlueSkiesBurn
8/1/12 12:11:40PM

Posted by Bubbles

come on Josh, we all know all you have to do in Cali to get that license is walk in and say that the object in play is called a rock and they'll give it to you





You know what's funny, even to this day, I still feel like a "fraud." If I were playing something like Hockey or Rugby, I wouldn't feel like I was a fraud. With curling, however, I feel like a team of RCMP officers are going to come and grill me on the sport and its rules if I keep saying I love it. Like a Canadian bullshit detector or something.
Boo_Radley21
8/1/12 3:50:49PM

Posted by airkerma


Posted by Boo_Radley21

Enjoy it while it lasts, Americans...
Once that water freezes over the ball is in our court


Sorry, but Iceketball is an American sport founded in Minnesota. The Erickson family is unbeatable (HIMYM).
Not taking away from Phelps, but damn I wish he had come in the shape he was in last time. I'm pretty sure he's burned out on the sport, having done the same monotonous, boring, sucky, practice twice a day day in and day out. But how cool would it have been if he had broken that record two days ago if he had golded the IM, golded the 2 fly, golded the 4free relay?



That's what they've been telling you down there eh?

Poor_Franklin
8/1/12 5:56:40PM
for what it's worth, an olympic broadcaster said "comparing swimming to track & field is like comparing apples to oranges".

who cares if he is the best. he did something that has never been done before.
warglory
8/1/12 6:30:23PM
I think it's silly to question Phelps' accomplishment. This is a big deal, I don't know why some folks need to trivialize it by comparing it to other events, it just seems unneeded. I think respecting a great athlete on the international stage should be paramount.
KungFuMaster
8/1/12 7:10:59PM
I have been a fan of Phelps the day I was aware of the hype. Unlike MMA, this hype was real and I would even go as far as saying Phelps surpassed the hype.

I missed the last few races but I think he has a few more NO? ( did that sounded Europeanish?)

Anyway, I wouldn't want to be THAT American swimmer who bashed Phelps right now. What's his name? Nevermind, it's not important.

War Phelps - Future sports analyst. You heard it here.
aussiemma
8/2/12 12:44:06AM
i used to be a competitive swimmer myself and most people wouldn't believe the dedication it takes to do what phelps has done or even to win just one gold medal. 25 plus hrs in the pool a week, plus dryland sessions, weights, physio. getting a feel for the water is very important for swimming, say if he were to take even 2-3 days off in the pool it would take maybe 7-10 days to get back to where you where.

just look how much the guy has dominated. he still has chances in the 100 fly and 200 i.m to do the three in a row.

it is so rare for ANYONE to even be good at 2 different strokes at the high level let alone all of them like phelps. Yeah lochte is getting the better of phelps so far... but he has only medalled in i.m and backstroke in the olympics. phelps has freestyle, bacstroke, butterfly and the i.m.


to argue simply why he is the greatest ''individual'' athlete ever just look and see that he has dominated swimming like no man or woman ever has and like no other in any other individual sport either.
aussiemma
8/2/12 12:57:23AM

Posted by FlashyG


Posted by BlueSkiesBurn

No, and I said that. Synchronized, diving, field events, etc...can all be left out.

HOWEVER, if all strokes are the same to you, then hurdling is the exact same thing as sprinting, but with jumping. No difference. So, you have to add those in.

Freestyle and breast or butterfly are VASTLY different. You HAVE to use your upperbody in the breast and butterfly. You're only allowed a certain type of kick with your legs. They force you to rely almost exclusively on your ability to use your arms to pull your body across the pool.

It's the basic equivalent of telling a sprinter he can only use a certain part of his body during a race. (i.e. he has to leave his arms at his side)



I personally think there is a FAR bigger difference between hurdles and sprinting than there is between the breast stroke and the butterfly.

There are tons of swimmers who take part in more than one stroke and I can't think of a single hurdler who also competes in the 100, 200 or 400m races.

If there was an event where a sprinter had to run with his arms by his/her sides I would gladly include it in the running races and I'd still exclude the hurdles.

The complete lunacy to that idea is pretty much how I feel about giving medals out for doing different strokes in a swimming pool.




the difference between butterfly an breastroke is like chinese and greek.

ok when your swimming what stroke do you use to go fast ? freestyle, what stroke do you use when you go slow ? breastroke
in athletics there is sprinting, long distance, hurdles and even the walking events.
do you see ?
KungFuMaster
8/2/12 2:15:17AM
If anyone knows of a link to the full race between Phelps and La Clos, can you please post it or PM it to me? Thanks
FlashyG
8/2/12 3:03:29AM

Posted by aussiemma

i used to be a competitive swimmer myself and most people wouldn't believe the dedication it takes to do what phelps has done or even to win just one gold medal. 25 plus hrs in the pool a week, plus dryland sessions, weights, physio. getting a feel for the water is very important for swimming, say if he were to take even 2-3 days off in the pool it would take maybe 7-10 days to get back to where you where.

just look how much the guy has dominated. he still has chances in the 100 fly and 200 i.m to do the three in a row.

it is so rare for ANYONE to even be good at 2 different strokes at the high level let alone all of them like phelps. Yeah lochte is getting the better of phelps so far... but he has only medalled in i.m and backstroke in the olympics. phelps has freestyle, bacstroke, butterfly and the i.m.


to argue simply why he is the greatest ''individual'' athlete ever just look and see that he has dominated swimming like no man or woman ever has and like no other in any other individual sport either.



Who said what he did wasn't special? Nobody has even questioned whether he is the greatest swimmer ever, or discounted the amount of work it took for him to dominate his sport.

The argument against him as the greatest Olympian ever is that he has an advantage over most Olympians in that he can take part more events and that others have won more individual medals than him.

If Phelps was equally as dominant as he is at swimming but his sport was wrestling, he'd have a grand total of 3 medals.

There are Olympians who've won their only event as many as 5 years in a row, you can certainly make a case that they dominated their sport even more so than Phelps has dominated swimming.

I think Phelps is among the greatest Olympians ever, and he's unquestionably the most successful or most decorated, but I'm more impressed by athletes who have won golds in completely different sports.

BTW, disagreeing with your opinion doesn't make someone stupid, resorting to personal attacks reflects more on you than it does on those you attempt to attack.

aussiemma
8/2/12 10:47:34AM
look i don't want to continue this any further, but if you look at my previous post you will see the point i was making in return to your post about how you thought only freestyle should be the only contested swimming event and the rest of the strokes shouldn't exist. (which is basically what you said)
sorry for calling what you said dumb.

grappler0000
8/4/12 12:43:43PM
Just happened across this article...talks about the very subject. Not trying to heat things up, but thought it was relevant.



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