Your Opinion: "Fighting In Hockey"

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Hendo67
3/13/09 1:02:14PM
I'm a die hard Hockey fan, and a die hard Bruins fan, however with the recent talks of eliminating Fighting from hockey, i'm questioning where this league will go.

Recently, general managers from all over the NHL had a meeting to discuss the possibility of eliminating fighting, or "staged" fighting in hockey...

"Staged Fight"
Thornton vs Cote (voted fight of the year)

"Retaliation Fight"
Chara vs Koci

Personally, i think it's fine the way it is now. Staged fights are often fought to pump up the team, say if a team is down 2-0...It's trying to shift the momentum.
If there's something that the league should try fixing, it should be fighters fighting after a clean hit. I mean, come on? pretty much people who don't fight, but love to hit will have to give up that element of their game.
If i had a dollar for every fight that happened after a clean hit i'd be a rich man.

I want your take on the matter.
cowcatcher
3/13/09 1:16:26PM
im not a hockey fan at all and only know the guys names that i see on sportscenter and to me as an outsider of sorts, that seems to be the only part of a game that gets really interesting. we have a minor league team in milwaukee and i very rarely have gone to games and thats really the only thing i hope to see when i do go, so im ok with it, the rest of the game is nap time for me.(sorry playground hockey fans)
IriShame
3/13/09 1:28:14PM
It seems the NHL is doing it's best to make sure nobody watches it's product. Removing fights from hockey would be a mistake of epic proportions. I think they should still let them fight in the NBA. Remember when being tough in the NBA meant something? Kareem didn't score all those points just on skill (although he had loads of it). When he was backing you down in the paint and you commited a hard foul to stop an important bucket Kareem would sock you in the face. You didn't **** with Kareem. Now it's a sport filled with Nancy ticky tack fouls that stops the action on every other play. Don't do the same to hockey.
king_katool
3/13/09 1:36:57PM
Next it will no hitting/checking, then you wont be able touch the other guys stick with your stick, then you wont be allowed to shot the puck really hard, im a huge hockey fan but the future isnt looking bright
grappler0000
3/13/09 1:39:45PM
I'm not really much of a hockey fan, but hockey without fighting is like fishing without drinking.
Shawn91111
3/13/09 1:46:18PM
No more punching. Trying to triangle choke someone with your skates on is much more impressive
DJDark41
3/13/09 2:37:58PM
Fighting is fine. If you want to go out there, challenge a guy to a fight and try to spark your team, thats fine. But, if he doesn't want to fight, don't go running around throwing cheap/late/dirty hits, to try and entice someone into a fight, and DO NOT go after a non fighter. And I hate retaliation fights. If someone lays out your best player with a perfectly clean hit, its fine for you to get mad, but he did NOTHING wrong, so you have no right to go after him and start a fight. Instead, play a clean, physical game, and throw big clean hits back.
cmill21
3/13/09 2:51:44PM
I'm shocked that our game has started to go down hill ever since we got the basketball guy as the comish. Bettman's a damn idiot.
EvenFlow
3/13/09 3:08:23PM
If your gonna fight in hockey make it look good and beat ass, I never understood the grabbing of the shirts, ripping them off there heads etc. but at least go for broke if you're gonna spend 5 minutes possibly even more not playing. Fights now a days are not even close to how it used to be, I know it was even worse before my time but when I started watching in the early 90s and the brutality and leiniency of fighting has gone down more dramatically in the last 10 years than any era in the sports history. I played from 7 years old up until 2 years ago when I reinjured my lower back, I only got in one fight and it was the last game of the worst damn team I was ever on so it didnt matter.

As for these bullshit fighting rules since the league shut down 5 years ago, wtf would you even do that? fighting is part of the games history, if you take that out you lose fanbase imo. That might sound bad but hockey is not only a competitive sport, its a combat sport as well, what with the fighting, checking etc and if you take that out its like your changing the rules and facets of the game in which you have no right changing. Rules are made by the people who arnt playing, its ironic but ultimatly why fighting has changed over the years and has even become a taboo of sort which comes with any combative sport.

Hockey would NOT be any more popular without fighting.
FlashyG
3/13/09 3:08:56PM
The thing that bugs me about this whole debate is that it's pointless, the NHL can ban fighting all it wants but when an athlete feels he's been wronged in a professional sport, hes going to resort to his fists, just the same way the Pacers did in Auburn Hills a few years ago, and countless batters who've charged the mound.

Don Sanderson, the guy who died in a fight earlier this year was the catalyst for this movement but nobody seems to mention the fact that fighting was already banned in the league he was playing in. If that ban, didn't prevent the fight let alone the death maybe we're approching this issue the wrong way.

I think the only change that needs to be made is to break up any fight immediately when a helmet comes off, its the impact with the ice that caused Don's death not the fight itself.

As far as its importance to the game goes though, If fighting was truly an important part of the game, the Red Wings would be great at it.
dannyfrank
3/13/09 4:09:01PM
i love the fights. i was at a local game once and the biggest fight i had ever seen broke out on the ice. just about every person was fighting someone else out there (i think i even saw a ref duking it out)

i love hockey, but i think it just wouldnt be the same without fights
Boo_Radley21
3/13/09 6:25:36PM
Never get rid of it. That's a damn foolish move.
warglory
3/13/09 6:26:48PM
I can't believe how many people find it okay to allow fighting in hockey. I think its ******* ludicrous. No other sport, and I mean ZERO organized non-combat sports, the world over INCLUDING soccer, allow open combat. If you can name one I'd love to see it. Yeah sure, it's technically illegal in hockey too (I think?), but when refs stand there allowing two guys to wail on each other for a couple of minutes when literally no skill is involved beyond endurance (how many hits can you land vs. how many hits you can absorb), it becomes a seriously irresponsible and reprehensible issue. I take it you guys like to watch Felony Fights as well? Two morons beating the hell out of each other?

I know, some of you are thinking that I am being way too uptight about this, but hockey, despite its violent nature with checking, etc, is still an organized sport that should be played with respect. I am not a father, but I sure as hell wouldn't want to expose my kid to a non-combat sport that openly allowed two guys to maul each other for the primitive school yard idea of "saving face" and then try to justify it later when I told him that fighting in school wasn't the answer. These are grown men with huge salaries, I think they can keep their attitude in line and play the damn game the way it was supposed to be played.

To those of you who said they are fans of the game, but say they wouldn't like it as much if they eliminated hockey, that's really sad to be perfectly honest. What happened to enjoying a sport? Fighting in hockey has nothing to do with the sport, nothing, I don't care how long it has been there.

Sorry, this topic kind of struck a nerve with me because it always shocks me how many hockey fans watch hockey for the fights. It's like watching NASCAR to see cars blow up. It's ridiculous.

higdon10
3/13/09 7:19:42PM
Let 'em fight. The NHL must really want to continue losing viewers.
zephead
3/13/09 8:33:40PM
I have been a fan of hockey since the early 80's. I am a season ticket holder for the Caps. Foghting has been a part of hockey since the begging of the sport. It is part of the game. Since Gary Betman has become the commsh, he has just about destroyed the sport. There is no flow to the game now because of all the ticky tacky crap that is called.

The sport is fast, it is violent and having enforcers and toughguys allow the players to police the game. Say for the sake of arguement the Caps are playing Philly, Riley Cote takes a run at Ovy and cheapshots him. Ovy gets hurt, Cote gets two minutes for roughing. Now, with Cote knowing that if he cheapshots Ovy, he has Brashears to answer to, that changes his mind. That is why fighting is neccesary. The players have to be able to olice the game. But Bettman thinks the refs can. And anybody on here that is a hockey, can see just how bad the NHL refs are. The worst in sports.

Keep fighting, get rid of the instigator rule and allow the players to police it.

EvenFlow
3/13/09 8:47:51PM

Posted by warglory

Sorry, this topic kind of struck a nerve with me because it always shocks me how many hockey fans watch hockey for the fights. It's like watching NASCAR to see cars blow up. It's ridiculous.




I dont believe anyone here said they watch for the fights and it sure isnt why I watch hockey but the cars blowing up would be my only interest in watching a car race around the track 500 times.
Hendo67
3/13/09 9:42:52PM

Posted by EvenFlow


Posted by warglory

Sorry, this topic kind of struck a nerve with me because it always shocks me how many hockey fans watch hockey for the fights. It's like watching NASCAR to see cars blow up. It's ridiculous.




I dont believe anyone here said they watch for the fights and it sure isnt why I watch hockey but the cars blowing up would be my only interest in watching a car race around the track 500 times.



Agreed 200%.

I have never heard a true hockey fan say they watch hockey for the fighting, if they did...they're complete idiots.
DCRage
3/13/09 11:03:18PM
While I enjoy the fights it's not the only reason I watch hockey. That being said, don't get rid of fighting. It's just getting a bad rap because of recent incidents (namely one Sidney Crosby introducing certain elements of old-school MMA) and the Sanderson death. It's like a lot of people say, it's how the NHL polices itself on-ice in a ways, this (Sanderson) was just a total freak occurrence and this is a somewhat understandable overreaction that's gotten a little out of hand.
Jackelope
3/14/09 1:04:14AM
Hockey fans and hockey players in huge numbers are going to be against any rule that would ban fighting. Just look at the stickers you see- "Give Blood. Play Hockey." It's a tough sport. Probably the toughest sport out there outside of MMA, and even then MMA guys fight every couple of months. Hockey players are playing several games a week beating the living hell out of their bodies. People are always talking Rugby and Football, but name me a hockey player who isn't missing teeth or hasn't had 3, 4, 5 or even more concussions. It's part of the game to hit, get hit, and throw a couple blows every now and again.

People cry too much about this kind of stuff. This game has been going on for YEARS and YEARS, and now you want to change it or call it barbaric? How about giving the players a say since they're the ones who it will effect? Everyone is so busy accusing and looking over the other guys shoulder. How about taking care of your own business and letting these guys handle theirs? Sports agents, commissioners, and owners are generally (guess what)- LAWYERS! They're the same people ruining everything in this world, and you want to give them their way? These are the people that made that lady rich by suing McDonald's for pouring hot coffee on herself.

I'm not even a hockey player, and I never have been. Hell, I'm not even a fan of hockey. I guarantee you, though, that almost every hockey player will agree with me. They're extremely tough guys. Let em go out there and prove it- it's what they want to do and it is a part of the game they love.
DJDark41
3/14/09 12:51:08PM
Time for my yearly super-rant...



Posted by warglory

No other sport, and I mean ZERO organized non-combat sports, the world over INCLUDING soccer, allow open combat.



Thats because, in other sports, THERE IS NO PHYSICAL CONTACT ALLOWED. Sure, in football you hit people, BUT THAT IS HOW YOU STOP THE PLAY! In hockey, you can choose to be good with your stick and pokecheck the puck, or use your size and lay them the f*ck out. In football, you have no option but to hit the guy. The whole point of fighting in hockey, is to give players a way to police themselves. If you want to run around throwing big hits on the star players, thats fine, you can do that. But, you have to be prepared to have the other teams enforcer(Donald Brashear, Colton Orr, etc) come after you.


Posted by warglory

but when refs stand there allowing two guys to wail on each other for a couple of minutes when literally no skill is involved beyond endurance (how many hits can you land vs. how many hits you can absorb), it becomes a seriously irresponsible and reprehensible issue. I take it you guys like to watch Felony Fights as well? Two morons beating the hell out of each other?



This, just shows how stupid you truly are when it comes to hockey. THESE ARE NOT PROFESSIONAL FIGHTERS! They are out there, to stand up for their teammates and protect the skilled players. And how dare you call them morons. Those so called "morons" play THE TOUGHEST ROLE, IN THE TOUGHEST TEAM SPORT ON EARTH.



Posted by warglory

still an organized sport that should be played with respect. I am not a father, but I sure as hell wouldn't want to expose my kid to a non-combat sport that openly allowed two guys to maul each other for the primitive school yard idea of "saving face" and then try to justify it later when I told him that fighting in school wasn't the answer. These are grown men with huge salaries, I think they can keep their attitude in line and play the damn game the way it was supposed to be played.



More ignorance. Fighting is purely out of respect, and the idea that respected and talented players need to be PROTECTED. If you think that a hockey fight is worthy of being considered a mauling, then what the f*ck do you consider MMA to be? Because I've seen more blood in 30 seconds of an MMA fight then I have ever seen in all my years of watching hockey. Grown men, with huge salaries? Yeah right. There are football players who no one even knows the name of that get paid more then the best NHL players. Ovechkin is getting $9 million a year. How many football players do you know that get paid UNDER $9 million a year? They are the lowest paid players in all of the major sports. And they ARE playing it the way the game is supposed to be played. It is supposed to be played, with an action/reaction mindset. If someone wants to hit your top player, fine, go and hit their top player. If you cheapshot someone, be prepared to defend yourself.





Posted by warglory
To those of you who said they are fans of the game, but say they wouldn't like it as much if they eliminated hockey, that's really sad to be perfectly honest. What happened to enjoying a sport? Fighting in hockey has nothing to do with the sport, nothing, I don't care how long it has been there.



Once again, ignorance. Hockey wouldn't be the same without fighting. Fighting is a way of saying, "If you mess with my team, then you're messing with me, and I don't like being messed with." Hockey would actually be WORSE off without fighting, because players like Jarkko Ruutu, Ryan Hollweg, and Darcy Tucker, would be able to run around throwing hits without any care whatsoever as to what happens, and if someone confronts them about it and stands up for their teammate, THEY get in trouble.


Your whole post shows exactly how ignorant you TRULY are, and I find it laughable that you would post with such a lack of knowledge. Next time, try talking about a sport you know about.
Subterfuge
3/14/09 1:21:23PM
Guys fight alot in Lacrosse, and they are not on skates. And I don't think the NBA has ever allowed fighting.
warglory
3/14/09 5:20:54PM

Posted by DJDark41

Time for my yearly super-rant...



Thats because, in other sports, THERE IS NO PHYSICAL CONTACT ALLOWED. Sure, in football you hit people, BUT THAT IS HOW YOU STOP THE PLAY! In hockey, you can choose to be good with your stick and pokecheck the puck, or use your size and lay them the f*ck out. In football, you have no option but to hit the guy. The whole point of fighting in hockey, is to give players a way to police themselves. If you want to run around throwing big hits on the star players, thats fine, you can do that. But, you have to be prepared to have the other teams enforcer(Donald Brashear, Colton Orr, etc) come after you.



Apparently you have never watched a game of Rugby, Australian rules football or lacrosse. These are often very physical and none of these allow organized fighting. And why can't these enforcers just check players back? I am fine with checking because its part of the game, but that is incredibly different then having open combat on ice.




This, just shows how stupid you truly are when it comes to hockey. THESE ARE NOT PROFESSIONAL FIGHTERS! They are out there, to stand up for their teammates and protect the skilled players. And how dare you call them morons. Those so called "morons" play THE TOUGHEST ROLE, IN THE TOUGHEST TEAM SPORT ON EARTH.



Where did I call them morons? Please, point out the quote. And the fact that they are not professional fighters is my whole point, thanks for reinforcing my whole argument. Allowing combat for those who are untrained is dangerous.




More ignorance. Fighting is purely out of respect, and the idea that respected and talented players need to be PROTECTED. If you think that a hockey fight is worthy of being considered a mauling, then what the f*ck do you consider MMA to be?



MMA is a combat sport with professionals who know how to defend themselves. Hockey players grab each others jerseys to force close combat fighting and then they just wail on each other until the refs feel the fight should be broken up or until one of them drops. Not to mention MMA fighters aren't duking it out on ice with skates on. Have you ever hit your head on ice?



Because I've seen more blood in 30 seconds of an MMA fight then I have ever seen in all my years of watching hockey. Grown men, with huge salaries? Yeah right. There are football players who no one even knows the name of that get paid more then the best NHL players. Ovechkin is getting $9 million a year. How many football players do you know that get paid UNDER $9 million a year? They are the lowest paid players in all of the major sports. And they ARE playing it the way the game is supposed to be played. It is supposed to be played, with an action/reaction mindset. If someone wants to hit your top player, fine, go and hit their top player. If you cheapshot someone, be prepared to defend yourself.



You don't think $9million a year is a huge salary? What you are describing is a BS schoolyard mentality. What happens if you walk up to an asshole player and headbutt him in soccer? Oh wait...that did happen, and it made international headlines.



Once again, ignorance. Hockey wouldn't be the same without fighting. Fighting is a way of saying, "If you mess with my team, then you're messing with me, and I don't like being messed with." Hockey would actually be WORSE off without fighting, because players like Jarkko Ruutu, Ryan Hollweg, and Darcy Tucker, would be able to run around throwing hits without any care whatsoever as to what happens, and if someone confronts them about it and stands up for their teammate, THEY get in trouble.



So check them back! Give them a taste of their own medicine! Checking is part of the rule set of hockey, not pounding someone's face in. That's the whole point of blocking/checking in hockey, to allow a teammate to get the puck down the ice.



Your whole post shows exactly how ignorant you TRULY are, and I find it laughable that you would post with such a lack of knowledge. Next time, try talking about a sport you know about.



You throw the word ignorant around like its supposed to mean something. I merely voiced my opinion on fighting in hockey, which has nothing to do with the game itself. Fighting is merely a tradition that has been allowed to continue because its fun to watch, and that's it. College hockey seems to do fine without it, why can't the NHL deal with it?
EvenFlow
3/14/09 6:37:40PM

Posted by warglory

You throw the word ignorant around like its supposed to mean something. I merely voiced my opinion on fighting in hockey, which has nothing to do with the game itself. Fighting is merely a tradition that has been allowed to continue because its fun to watch, and that's it. College hockey seems to do fine without it, why can't the NHL deal with it?



College hockey is not popular nationwide like the NHL, theres your answer.

I dont agree with that other guys decision to bash you, but a lot of us have given reasons to you and everyone else why its a part of the game and it shouldnt be changed for some non-hockey fans who thinks its bad.
Subterfuge
3/14/09 8:36:35PM
Apparently you have never watched a game of Rugby, Australian rules football or lacrosse. These are often very physical and none of these allow organized fighting


Lacrosse allows fighting.
Subterfuge
3/14/09 8:42:23PM
No offense, but Warglory you don't understand the game and DJ Dark you don't either. I find both of your arguments to be filled with ignorance.
DJDark41
3/15/09 11:25:09AM

Posted by warglory

I take it you guys like to watch Felony Fights as well? Two morons beating the hell out of each other?





Well, there's that. Lets begin again.



Posted by warglory

And why can't these enforcers just check players back? I am fine with checking because its part of the game, but that is incredibly different then having open combat on ice




Because, you can't just go around hitting people all willy-nilly. That is the whole reason fighting is in place, is to keep people in line. But guess what... When the enforcer from Team A starts hitting people, then the enforcer from Team B starts hitting the other enforcer, do you know what happens? They go, "Ok, thats how you want it to be? Then lets settle it, me and you, right now." And they fight, and thats the end of it.



Posted by warglory

So check them back! Give them a taste of their own medicine! Checking is part of the rule set of hockey, not pounding someone's face in. That's the whole point of blocking/checking in hockey, to allow a teammate to get the puck down the ice.




Once again, showing you know nothing about hockey. You can't just run around hitting people constantly, if they don't have the puck, you can't hit them. And as any semi-hockey fan would know, enforcers aren't exactly known for their amazing ability to carry the puck and make a play. And no, the point of "checking" is to knock the other player down, take him out of the play and force a turnover. And "blocking," is actually called interference, which is a penalty. If a player doesn't have the puck, you aren't allowed to stop him from skating(aka "blocking" him). This isn't football. You don't make a wall in front of the puck carrier and just knock everyone out of the way and give him a breakaway.



Posted by warglory

College hockey seems to do fine without it, why can't the NHL deal with it?




This make me laugh actually. In college ice hockey, all players are required to wear full face protection. So if you want to be an idiot and punch a guy in the helmet/face cage, then by my guest and break your hand punching a guy in his equipment. Not only will you get suspended/ejected, but you'll probably sit out longer nursing your hand-related injuries.





And Subterfuge, you seem like a rational person, so lets talk. What did I say that makes you believe I do not understand hockey?
warglory
3/15/09 12:08:55PM

Posted by EvenFlow


Posted by warglory

You throw the word ignorant around like its supposed to mean something. I merely voiced my opinion on fighting in hockey, which has nothing to do with the game itself. Fighting is merely a tradition that has been allowed to continue because its fun to watch, and that's it. College hockey seems to do fine without it, why can't the NHL deal with it?



College hockey is not popular nationwide like the NHL, theres your answer.

I dont agree with that other guys decision to bash you, but a lot of us have given reasons to you and everyone else why its a part of the game and it shouldnt be changed for some non-hockey fans who thinks its bad.



They have their opinion, and I have mine. I am really not a fan of hockey so maybe my opinion shouldn't matter, but it's still how I feel.
warglory
3/15/09 12:10:24PM

Posted by Subterfuge

Apparently you have never watched a game of Rugby, Australian rules football or lacrosse. These are often very physical and none of these allow organized fighting


Lacrosse allows fighting.



I checked this out and I stand corrected. I honestly didn't realize professional lacrosse allowed fighting. This is interesting.
warglory
3/15/09 12:11:44PM

Posted by Subterfuge

No offense, but Warglory you don't understand the game and DJ Dark you don't either. I find both of your arguments to be filled with ignorance.



What did I say that represented my ignorance? With the fact that I don't "appreciate" fighting like hockey fans do?
warglory
3/15/09 12:24:28PM

Posted by DJDark41

Well, there's that. Lets begin again.



Uh huh. And again, where did I call hockey players morons in that statement of mine? Read that statement again very carefully.




Because, you can't just go around hitting people all willy-nilly. That is the whole reason fighting is in place, is to keep people in line. But guess what... When the enforcer from Team A starts hitting people, then the enforcer from Team B starts hitting the other enforcer, do you know what happens? They go, "Ok, thats how you want it to be? Then lets settle it, me and you, right now." And they fight, and thats the end of it.



That's how it is because that's what is allowed. I bet if rules started being enforced these fights would disappear overnight. Fights start because they know they can get away with it.




Once again, showing you know nothing about hockey. You can't just run around hitting people constantly, if they don't have the puck, you can't hit them. And as any semi-hockey fan would know, enforcers aren't exactly known for their amazing ability to carry the puck and make a play. And no, the point of "checking" is to knock the other player down, take him out of the play and force a turnover. And "blocking," is actually called interference, which is a penalty. If a player doesn't have the puck, you aren't allowed to stop him from skating(aka "blocking" him). This isn't football. You don't make a wall in front of the puck carrier and just knock everyone out of the way and give him a breakaway.



First off, I am admittedly not a fan of hockey, so quit with the "you know nothing about hockey" crap. It adds nothing to the debate. Alright, so then a player with the puck gets checked, where is all of this harassment if checking random players is illegal? You seemed to be explaining to me that fights break out between enforcers in order to put one enforcer in his place, yet if its all over legal checking, then whats the big deal?




This make me laugh actually. In college ice hockey, all players are required to wear full face protection. So if you want to be an idiot and punch a guy in the helmet/face cage, then by my guest and break your hand punching a guy in his equipment. Not only will you get suspended/ejected, but you'll probably sit out longer nursing your hand-related injuries.



Really? It made you laugh, or you're just being cocky? There's no need for the arrogance man, chill. My whole point is that there is a college hockey fanbase without the fighting. Not as big as the NHL? Of course, because people want to see fighting, but if fighting was eliminated, true hockey fans would remain and the bloodthirsty assholes can leave. Simple as that. College hockey shows that you can be a fan of the game without needing to see fights, that's all I am saying here.



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