OFFICIAL: Sid "The Kid" vs. Alex "The Great"

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Boo_Radley21
1/14/09 6:24:01PM
I noticed every time a hockey discussion comes up here theres always a few people who get into the big argument and the thread turns into who is better...so it's time to put it to the test...maybe not who is better, but we can at least figure out who is the favourite on this site.

For me, it's Ovy.

EDIT: sorry boys i accidently hit something and the poll didnt come up.
DJDark41
1/14/09 6:29:01PM
ALEX FTW! And IMO, Malkin is better then Crosby. And so are a few more players, but lets keep it on topic, eh?
cmill21
1/14/09 6:44:52PM
Fantasy league, Ovechkin, if I was a GM, Crosby 100%.
DCRage
1/14/09 6:49:22PM
Ovechkin of course. Anyone who says Crosby risks a Capital ban. (Although I hear there seems to be quite the Ovechkin vs. Malkin rivalry brewing)
higdon10
1/14/09 7:08:57PM
Ovechkin all day. The guy is amazing. But Crosby is no slouch himself.
The_Metal_Maniac
1/14/09 8:55:22PM
Crosby
Hendo67
1/14/09 10:42:21PM
Ovechkin, no one can bring the energy he does, he's a work horse, he takes just as much pride in a big hit than he does in a goal.

Crosby doesn't deserve the C, a captain is supposed to lead a team, not be a whiny little puke.

Top 5 right now, in my opinion.
Alex Ovechkin
Evgeni Malkin
Henrik Zetterberg
Sidney Crosby
Nicklas Lidstrom
postman
1/14/09 10:45:50PM
Im from the burgh so you know im going Sid, but anyone catch Alex jab Geno in the ribs with his stick off the face off in the first? They hate each other.
Aaronno9
1/15/09 4:12:39AM
Crosby.
Shawn91111
1/15/09 8:49:08AM
I know shit all about hockey, but could this debate be like in the NBA who is better Kobe or Lebron....is Sidney and Alex like that to the NHL?
postman
1/15/09 9:57:50AM

Posted by Shawn91111

I know shit all about hockey, but could this debate be like in the NBA who is better Kobe or Lebron....is Sidney and Alex like that to the NHL?



Yeah thats about right.
FlashyG
1/15/09 11:47:53AM
both are awesome but given Crosby has only slightly fewer points and has played in 30 less games than Ov, has a higher +/-, better shooting % and some playoff success I think he has a slight edge at this point in their careers.

On the flip side though, Crosby's higher +/- likely has a lot to do with the quality of his team compared to the Caps, the same could be said about his playoff success.

The best player in the league in my opinion is Niklas Lidstrom though and he has been for some time now.
zephead
1/15/09 4:30:32PM
Ovy. He hits, he scores goals, he assists, he penalty kills. He's turning into Zetterburg or Pavel Daytzuk. Those are the two that are truly the best all-around players in the game. Ovy is starting to take his game to that level. Not there yet, but he's wroking on it.


The Caps laid the beatdown last night. Ovy, his usual physical self. 2 goals and an assist. He hit Crosby, Malkin, Orprik it doesn't matter. I loved after he rocked Crosby that Cooke came in to try and help. That's the difference. Ovy gets hit, he just comes after you that much harder. No one on the Caps "comes to his aid."

Ovy can play the "cute" game like Crosby or the physical game. I think that is what will seperate him from everybody else, the physical play. How many plaers in the history of the NHL, had the physical game to go along with the offensive game that Ovy has?
lochie
1/15/09 4:43:48PM

Posted by Shawn91111

I know shit all about hockey, but could this debate be like in the NBA who is better Kobe or Lebron....is Sidney and Alex like that to the NHL?



Lebron love that kid

its fake but dunno its still awesome

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MbqxJx_ups
urbman
1/15/09 7:01:44PM
Obviously we're speaking of two great players,Right now, I think I'd have to say Ovechkin.My reasoning being there are alot more quality centers in the league.But I think quality left wings are alot harder to come by, right now in the NHL.
The_Metal_Maniac
1/15/09 8:25:04PM
Alex is a top three talent, but I will never say he's better than Sidney. His team is performing miles ahead of the pens right now so he will garner more attention. He hits, and is a goal scorer, but he is considered a power forward. His primary job is to score. I will always agree that Alex is the better goal scorer, I think he's Malkin, Heatly, and Ilya's counterpart. However when it comes to the game of hockey Sidney is the best. The resentment people show Sidney is because of the attention he garnishes from the NHL. It's not his fault he's the poster boy. That's all I'm saying about this, I'm a Pens fan. So that's my reasoning, you can not convince a fan of a player or team to change their opinion. If the Penguins were to right the ship which it looks like their cashing it in right now, but if they were to make the playoffs. I think a series between the Caps and Pens would actually be better than the cup. It's rare that you have four of the top ten young players in a game.
cmill21
1/15/09 8:46:18PM
I honestly don't like either of them, but Crosby is a big team guy, took less money so his team could sign more guys, he can hit and get hit, better career +/-, and he can play in any and all situations. Also your talking a top center vs a winger, so Crosby also gives you draws, and centers are ussually tougher to find. They're both going to get points, pretty much garenteed 100 per for each so again if your building an actual team to try and win a cup with, I think your crazy to go with Ovechkin over Crosby.
zephead
1/15/09 10:15:44PM

Posted by cmill21

I honestly don't like either of them, but Crosby is a big team guy, took less money so his team could sign more guys, he can hit and get hit, better career +/-, and he can play in any and all situations. Also your talking a top center vs a winger, so Crosby also gives you draws, and centers are ussually tougher to find. They're both going to get points, pretty much garenteed 100 per for each so again if your building an actual team to try and win a cup with, I think your crazy to go with Ovechkin over Crosby.




Crosby can hit????? He has 44 hits this year. Ovy has 142. Last year Crosby had 50. Ovy had 220. The year before, Crosby had 55, Ovy had 184. As for the hit department, not even close.

As for faceoffs, Crosby is not good. This year he is winning 49%. Year before, 51%. The year before 49% and before that, 45%. That is not in the top 20.

+/- for career, Crosby is a +31 to Ovy's +24. Ovy has 4 shorthanded goals in his career, Crosby none. Crosby has 14 game winning goals to Ovy's 29. Crosby has great vision and can make great passes, Ovy can kill you in so many different ways. Ovy takes control of games alot more then Crosby can and Ovy can do it in different ways
nastshabast
1/15/09 10:19:42PM
IMO they are both sick for different reasons but I think you have to include Malkin in the conversation because you could say any of the three and I wouldn't disagree.
nastshabast
1/15/09 10:23:22PM

Posted by zephead


Posted by cmill21

I honestly don't like either of them, but Crosby is a big team guy, took less money so his team could sign more guys, he can hit and get hit, better career +/-, and he can play in any and all situations. Also your talking a top center vs a winger, so Crosby also gives you draws, and centers are ussually tougher to find. They're both going to get points, pretty much garenteed 100 per for each so again if your building an actual team to try and win a cup with, I think your crazy to go with Ovechkin over Crosby.




Crosby can hit????? He has 44 hits this year. Ovy has 142. Last year Crosby had 50. Ovy had 220. The year before, Crosby had 55, Ovy had 184. As for the hit department, not even close.

As for faceoffs, Crosby is not good. This year he is winning 49%. Year before, 51%. The year before 49% and before that, 45%. That is not in the top 20.

+/- for career, Crosby is a +31 to Ovy's +24. Ovy has 4 shorthanded goals in his career, Crosby none. Crosby has 14 game winning goals to Ovy's 29. Crosby has great vision and can make great passes, Ovy can kill you in so many different ways. Ovy takes control of games alot more then Crosby can and Ovy can do it in different ways



I'd bet Crosby has 10+ shorthanded assists and 30+ game winning assists. Plus Ovechkin is a winger, they generally have more hits than Centers.
cmill21
1/16/09 12:18:33AM

Posted by zephead


Crosby can hit????? He has 44 hits this year. Ovy has 142. Last year Crosby had 50. Ovy had 220. The year before, Crosby had 55, Ovy had 184. As for the hit department, not even close.

As for faceoffs, Crosby is not good. This year he is winning 49%. Year before, 51%. The year before 49% and before that, 45%. That is not in the top 20.

+/- for career, Crosby is a +31 to Ovy's +24. Ovy has 4 shorthanded goals in his career, Crosby none. Crosby has 14 game winning goals to Ovy's 29. Crosby has great vision and can make great passes, Ovy can kill you in so many different ways. Ovy takes control of games alot more then Crosby can and Ovy can do it in different ways



As a C crosby has alot more defensive resposibilities then Ovechkin, he shoulden't be hitting a pinching D man, he has to help out down low and in front. I know you don't like Crosby and are a huge Caps fan but the positions are very different, and I think 60-70% of GM's picked Crosby in a poll like this for the reasons I've stated. I'm not saying either is more important to their current team or Ovechkin's below in skill, it's just simple hockey, center's are more important. Also yeah Crosby can hit, no he doesn't fly into corners like Alex, but thats also another reason I'd take Sid, he will have a longer career, mark my words.
zephead
1/16/09 6:31:18PM

Posted by cmill21


Posted by zephead


Crosby can hit????? He has 44 hits this year. Ovy has 142. Last year Crosby had 50. Ovy had 220. The year before, Crosby had 55, Ovy had 184. As for the hit department, not even close.

As for faceoffs, Crosby is not good. This year he is winning 49%. Year before, 51%. The year before 49% and before that, 45%. That is not in the top 20.

+/- for career, Crosby is a +31 to Ovy's +24. Ovy has 4 shorthanded goals in his career, Crosby none. Crosby has 14 game winning goals to Ovy's 29. Crosby has great vision and can make great passes, Ovy can kill you in so many different ways. Ovy takes control of games alot more then Crosby can and Ovy can do it in different ways



As a C crosby has alot more defensive resposibilities then Ovechkin, he shoulden't be hitting a pinching D man, he has to help out down low and in front. I know you don't like Crosby and are a huge Caps fan but the positions are very different, and I think 60-70% of GM's picked Crosby in a poll like this for the reasons I've stated. I'm not saying either is more important to their current team or Ovechkin's below in skill, it's just simple hockey, center's are more important. Also yeah Crosby can hit, no he doesn't fly into corners like Alex, but thats also another reason I'd take Sid, he will have a longer career, mark my words.




Defensive responsibility doesn't come with you wearing the "C". Just ask Gretzky, Mario, Jagr, etc. It has to do with what kind of system your team plays. Neither Crosby or Ovy are known as relentless forecheckers. The Caps use a system where the center forechecks, the wings will play at the blueline and the D-men will play at their own blueline. The Caps are a very aggresive team and like to put pressure on a team trying to leave their zone.

In hockey, centers are more of forecheckers then players playing in front of the net. Just watch the Pens and all the breakaways that Malkin and Crosby get, that tells you they are not in deep in their own zone.

Yes, you build a team from goalie to center first. That I understand. But when the voting comes out for MVP, it is chosen for the player that is the Most Valuable player to their team. If the Caps would lose Ovy for 29 games, they would be screwed. The Pens kept on rolling because Malkin carried that team when Crosby was out. IMO, Malkin means more to the Pens then Crosby does. Crosby has been so hyoped by the league, it isn't funny. 90% of the NHL commercial are about Sid and I think it is wrong. To me, the 4 best players in the league are Zetterburg, Datszuk, Malkin and Ovy. What do they all have in common, none of them are Canadian. So I think there is a bias against them. After all it is a "Canadian" game.

As for a longer career, I don't know. Sid is hurt again, while Ovy and his "reckless" style has yet to miss games because of an injury. What people seem to forget about Ovy is, how well he sees the ice. He sees the hits coming and usually the player that tries to make contact first, ends up on the ice

Yes GM's picked Crosby, but the players pick Ovy. That to me means a whole lot more then the GM for the Maple Leafs, Coyotes, Predators, Thrashers, Panthers, Wild, Islanders, Blues etc. etc. Those teams don't have a realistic shot at anything because of their GMs.
nastshabast
1/16/09 6:52:20PM

Posted by zephead


Posted by cmill21


Posted by zephead


Crosby can hit????? He has 44 hits this year. Ovy has 142. Last year Crosby had 50. Ovy had 220. The year before, Crosby had 55, Ovy had 184. As for the hit department, not even close.

As for faceoffs, Crosby is not good. This year he is winning 49%. Year before, 51%. The year before 49% and before that, 45%. That is not in the top 20.

+/- for career, Crosby is a +31 to Ovy's +24. Ovy has 4 shorthanded goals in his career, Crosby none. Crosby has 14 game winning goals to Ovy's 29. Crosby has great vision and can make great passes, Ovy can kill you in so many different ways. Ovy takes control of games alot more then Crosby can and Ovy can do it in different ways



As a C crosby has alot more defensive resposibilities then Ovechkin, he shoulden't be hitting a pinching D man, he has to help out down low and in front. I know you don't like Crosby and are a huge Caps fan but the positions are very different, and I think 60-70% of GM's picked Crosby in a poll like this for the reasons I've stated. I'm not saying either is more important to their current team or Ovechkin's below in skill, it's just simple hockey, center's are more important. Also yeah Crosby can hit, no he doesn't fly into corners like Alex, but thats also another reason I'd take Sid, he will have a longer career, mark my words.




Defensive responsibility doesn't come with you wearing the "C". Just ask Gretzky, Mario, Jagr, etc. It has to do with what kind of system your team plays. Neither Crosby or Ovy are known as relentless forecheckers. The Caps use a system where the center forechecks, the wings will play at the blueline and the D-men will play at their own blueline. The Caps are a very aggresive team and like to put pressure on a team trying to leave their zone.

In hockey, centers are more of forecheckers then players playing in front of the net. Just watch the Pens and all the breakaways that Malkin and Crosby get, that tells you they are not in deep in their own zone.

Yes, you build a team from goalie to center first. That I understand. But when the voting comes out for MVP, it is chosen for the player that is the Most Valuable player to their team. If the Caps would lose Ovy for 29 games, they would be screwed. The Pens kept on rolling because Malkin carried that team when Crosby was out. IMO, Malkin means more to the Pens then Crosby does. Crosby has been so hyoped by the league, it isn't funny. 90% of the NHL commercial are about Sid and I think it is wrong. To me, the 4 best players in the league are Zetterburg, Datszuk, Malkin and Ovy. What do they all have in common, none of them are Canadian. So I think there is a bias against them. After all it is a "Canadian" game.

As for a longer career, I don't know. Sid is hurt again, while Ovy and his "reckless" style has yet to miss games because of an injury. What people seem to forget about Ovy is, how well he sees the ice. He sees the hits coming and usually the player that tries to make contact first, ends up on the ice

Yes GM's picked Crosby, but the players pick Ovy. That to me means a whole lot more then the GM for the Maple Leafs, Coyotes, Predators, Thrashers, Panthers, Wild, Islanders, Blues etc. etc. Those teams don't have a realistic shot at anything because of their GMs.



C = Center not captain
DJDark41
1/18/09 1:03:39PM

Posted by cmill21
Also yeah Crosby can hit, no he doesn't fly into corners like Alex, but thats also another reason I'd take Sid, he will have a longer career, mark my words.




Which is why Crosby has missed more games then Ovy? And as far back as I can remember, the only games Ovechkin has missed were to go see his sick relative back in Russia. Maybe if Crosby could learn to skate he wouldn't keep falling and injuring his baby legs.
mk1630
1/18/09 1:38:33PM
Easy = Jarome Iginla
cmill21
1/18/09 6:12:29PM

Posted by DJDark41


Posted by cmill21
Also yeah Crosby can hit, no he doesn't fly into corners like Alex, but thats also another reason I'd take Sid, he will have a longer career, mark my words.




Which is why Crosby has missed more games then Ovy? And as far back as I can remember, the only games Ovechkin has missed were to go see his sick relative back in Russia. Maybe if Crosby could learn to skate he wouldn't keep falling and injuring his baby legs.



Time man, time. Alex will start to have shoulder injuries and concussions as the hits pile up. He throws his body around like a line backer.
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