Mousasi: UFC Never Made Offer

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Sinister
9/6/09 1:33:27PM
"In terms of long-term potential, few mixed martial artists carry the value of Gegard Mousasi, a multi-lingual 24-year-old with talent to spare. Currently under contract to Strikeforce and Dream, he denies the UFC made a pitch for his services following the collapse of Affliction’s fight promotion wing in July."

LINK
xdanish020
9/6/09 2:15:02PM
If that's the case, it's probably because they didn't want to deal with his management.
Jesse_Canadian_MMA
9/6/09 3:35:37PM

Posted by xdanish020

If that's the case, it's probably because they didn't want to deal with his management.



no doubt but that sucks now another great fighter wont ever get to the ufc, although I'm sure M-1 stipulations in regards to Mousasi and negotiating wont be as ridiculous
GrandMaster313
9/6/09 3:52:54PM
Somebody dropped the ball
king_katool
9/6/09 4:14:51PM
this translates to me as "my management never tells me anything and makes me do what is best for them" i hope M-1 dies i hate that company
george112
9/6/09 5:24:11PM

Posted by king_katool

this translates to me as "my management never tells me anything and makes me do what is best for them" i hope M-1 dies i hate that company



do you know that for sure???

yes i dont agree with everything M-1 does.but to accuse his management is another thing.and to attack the company.

what it boils down to is people are taking sides.youve obviously taken the side of the UFC.

you, me, and everyone else here will never know for sure what really transpired
joshryanshepherd
9/6/09 5:50:42PM

Posted by george112


Posted by king_katool

this translates to me as "my management never tells me anything and makes me do what is best for them" i hope M-1 dies i hate that company



do you know that for sure???

yes i dont agree with everything M-1 does.but to accuse his management is another thing.and to attack the company.

what it boils down to is people are taking sides.youve obviously taken the side of the UFC.

you, me, and everyone else here will never know for sure what really transpired



chill man, its sounds like his guess is pretty close to what may have actually happened. if the UFC made him an offer he still would have turned it down, thats M1 fighters for ya!
duggy
9/6/09 6:33:44PM
didnt m1 tell mousasi that ufc offered 40k/40k?

http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2009/8/6/980383/joe-silva-talks-gegard-mousasis
Aether
9/7/09 12:08:34AM
I thought that this was already common knowledge, and that the REASON they never made an offer is because his management team told him they made a worse offer than strikeforce, railroading him into signing with them before the UFC ever spoke to them.

This is shadiness by M-1, not the UFC dropping the ball. Yes, Gegard has talent, but the UFC has the platform to allow him to showcase that talent. Gegard needs the UFC far more than the UFC needs Gegard.

M-1 Global needs to die as a promoter and management team. These guys are like Gary Shaw times 20, except instead of Kimbo, they have some of the best fighters in the world, giving them serious bargaining chips. I really hope these guys realize what is going on and dump these clowns as soon as their contracts are up. If anyone RE-signs with M-1 at this point they're either oblivious, part of their schemes, or something really shady is going on behind the scenes that we don't know about.
Sinister
9/7/09 12:31:30AM

Posted by Jesse_Canadian_MMA


Posted by xdanish020

If that's the case, it's probably because they didn't want to deal with his management.



no doubt but that sucks now another great fighter wont ever get to the ufc, although I'm sure M-1 stipulations in regards to Mousasi and negotiating wont be as ridiculous



Thats what I was thinking. M-1 isn't doing helping the sport.
dmfp
9/7/09 8:04:25AM

Posted by king_katool

this translates to me as "my management never tells me anything and makes me do what is best for them" i hope M-1 dies i hate that company



True..
EliasG
9/7/09 11:12:51AM
Actually this is you guys not liking a management team and making a judgement call based on zero facts. That's fine. Just call it what it is--A guess. We are about as close to these negotiations and the facts of the case as we are to the reasons for Jessica Simpson's break up with Romo. You don't know.

What you DO know is that a guy MUCH closer to the real life breathing situation said he was never made an offer. What you DO know is that a UFC spokesperson "claimed" that M-1 management "made a claim about a UFC offer. " If Gegard felt that he had been lied to wouldn't he have said it in this article? Silva slept on Gegard and admitted it in http://www.mmaplayground.com/forums/topic34924-1.html when he said, "We assumed...." after the Affliction joint. They never came with an offer, Gegard never said he was offered anything which discredits the claim that Silva made---Gegard called HIM to find about an offer. Gegard never said that happened---although it is in the interest of UFC to say that it did happen. After all, their whole goal right now is to discredit any and all things about M-1 so that they can get their hands on Fedor (who they call a joke) and now Gegard Mousasi who wasn't even on their radar screen.

Good scoop by Strikeforce.
sclasclemski
9/7/09 12:08:21PM

Posted by xdanish020

If that's the case, it's probably because they didn't want to deal with his management.



I concur 100%
EliasG
9/7/09 12:15:02PM
the silly thing is, if you look at the Bloody elbow article it isn't credible at all. The source cited is "Cindy O" an affiliate from Zuffa. In other words, a reporter didn't call Zuffa and Silva and find out what they said, somebody "affiliated with Zuffa" who doesn't have a last name apparently, told a guy on a website that Joe said he didn't offer a contract.

That's worse than the Enquirer. I migth as well write that my friend who has a cousin that works for Zuffa told my friend who told me that Fedor was offered a billion dollars for a fight in the UFC and he turned it down. It simply isn't credible at all. The only reason you would believe this is if you WANT to believe it Gegard himself said, he didnt get an offer and he never mentioned calling Silva or being lied to by M-1 which HE WOULD BELIEVE if he REALLY DID call Joe Silva personally.
Aether
9/7/09 3:54:20PM

Posted by EliasG

Actually this is you guys not liking a management team and making a judgement call based on zero facts. That's fine. Just call it what it is--A guess. We are about as close to these negotiations and the facts of the case as we are to the reasons for Jessica Simpson's break up with Romo. You don't know.

What you DO know is that a guy MUCH closer to the real life breathing situation said he was never made an offer. What you DO know is that a UFC spokesperson "claimed" that M-1 management "made a claim about a UFC offer. " If Gegard felt that he had been lied to wouldn't he have said it in this article? Silva slept on Gegard and admitted it in http://www.mmaplayground.com/forums/topic34924-1.html when he said, "We assumed...." after the Affliction joint. They never came with an offer, Gegard never said he was offered anything which discredits the claim that Silva made---Gegard called HIM to find about an offer. Gegard never said that happened---although it is in the interest of UFC to say that it did happen. After all, their whole goal right now is to discredit any and all things about M-1 so that they can get their hands on Fedor (who they call a joke) and now Gegard Mousasi who wasn't even on their radar screen.

Good scoop by Strikeforce.



Sigh.... Where to start. Let's start with the complete misquote.

"when he said, "We assumed...." after the Affliction joint. They never came with an offer, Gegard never said he was offered anything which discredits the claim that Silva made---Gegard called HIM to find about an offer."

What Silva actually said is not anywhere close to what you wrote. Here is the passage you're "quoting"

""Not only did we not make an offer, but we would’ve assumed his Affliction contract and its terms."

Silva in no way contradicted himself, nor did he say they assumed anything. He said they would have ASSUMED the terms of his contract. In other words they would have honoured the contract he had with Affliction as though it were their own. The fact that both Joe Silva AND Gegard have said that no offer was made by the UFC only reinforces Joe's story. If you read more closely you will see that what was said is that Gegard called the UFC AFTER signing with Strikeforce to find out if what his management told him about a 40/40 offer from the UFC was true, which Joe said it was not.

Joe Silva INTERVIEW

You can see in this interview of Joe Silva by a reporter that the whole thing about the quotes being as reliable as a tabloid magazine is not remotely true, and that he talks even further about the fact that Apy Echteld called him to clarify the issue of the 40/40 claim, saying that he was told by someone that this is what the UFC would be offering.

As to you saying "If Gegard felt that he had been lied to wouldn't he have said it in this article? " No? Most likely not.... People don't generally go on video slandering the people they are currently under contract with. If you're going to use that kind of logic, this would be a far more convincing argument:

"When asked about allegations that his management had misled him about the value of the UFC offer, Mousasi declined comment. "

Why would he decline to comment if his answer was going to be "no, I wasn't lied to" That's like someone pleading the fifth in court. Maybe you didn't officially say it, but by refusing to answer, you're essentially saying it's true. He was also clearly struggling to answer the last question diplomatically before settling on "There was never an offer from the UFC" which reinforces everything else already said, and indicates that there is some conflict he's trying to stay clear of.

Your post is the one based on assumptions and zero facts. Most other people's posts are based on direct quotes across about a half a dozen articles from Silva, Mousasi, and Apy Echteld, as well as the previous debacle with Fedor and Finkelschtein. You're openly rewording quotes to suit your argument and then telling other people they're making assumptions. You are using the article as the basis of your argument, and then turning around and saying that it isn't credible to begin with.

Everything that we've seen from the mouths of M-1 management (finkleshtein and echteld), Fedor, Mousasi, Joe Silva, and Dana all points in the exact same direction. Don't you think that M-1 would have said "we didn't do that" instead of calling Joe Silva to make excuses for why they did it? Don't you find it strange that there is absolutely no contradiction going on in any of their statements? Everyone is saying the same thing, even M-1.

I would be absolutely shocked if Mousasi continued with M-1 after his next 2 fights. I'm sure he knows that it is far, far easier for him to do his 2 fights and keep his mouth shut than to get caught up in a huge debacle where he's fighting against the people who have his fate in their hands. If he wants to get away from M-1 he has 2 options, one is to finish his contract, and the other is to try to separate from them legally, which would take a lot of litigation, and we saw how that worked for Couture.
george112
9/7/09 5:33:43PM

Posted by Aether


Posted by EliasG

Actually this is you guys not liking a management team and making a judgement call based on zero facts. That's fine. Just call it what it is--A guess. We are about as close to these negotiations and the facts of the case as we are to the reasons for Jessica Simpson's break up with Romo. You don't know.

What you DO know is that a guy MUCH closer to the real life breathing situation said he was never made an offer. What you DO know is that a UFC spokesperson "claimed" that M-1 management "made a claim about a UFC offer. " If Gegard felt that he had been lied to wouldn't he have said it in this article? Silva slept on Gegard and admitted it in http://www.mmaplayground.com/forums/topic34924-1.html when he said, "We assumed...." after the Affliction joint. They never came with an offer, Gegard never said he was offered anything which discredits the claim that Silva made---Gegard called HIM to find about an offer. Gegard never said that happened---although it is in the interest of UFC to say that it did happen. After all, their whole goal right now is to discredit any and all things about M-1 so that they can get their hands on Fedor (who they call a joke) and now Gegard Mousasi who wasn't even on their radar screen.

Good scoop by Strikeforce.



Sigh.... Where to start. Let's start with the complete misquote.

"when he said, "We assumed...." after the Affliction joint. They never came with an offer, Gegard never said he was offered anything which discredits the claim that Silva made---Gegard called HIM to find about an offer."

What Silva actually said is not anywhere close to what you wrote. Here is the passage you're "quoting"

""Not only did we not make an offer, but we would’ve assumed his Affliction contract and its terms."

Silva in no way contradicted himself, nor did he say they assumed anything. He said they would have ASSUMED the terms of his contract. In other words they would have honoured the contract he had with Affliction as though it were their own. The fact that both Joe Silva AND Gegard have said that no offer was made by the UFC only reinforces Joe's story. If you read more closely you will see that what was said is that Gegard called the UFC AFTER signing with Strikeforce to find out if what his management told him about a 40/40 offer from the UFC was true, which Joe said it was not.

Joe Silva INTERVIEW

You can see in this interview of Joe Silva by a reporter that the whole thing about the quotes being as reliable as a tabloid magazine is not remotely true, and that he talks even further about the fact that Apy Echteld called him to clarify the issue of the 40/40 claim, saying that he was told by someone that this is what the UFC would be offering.

As to you saying "If Gegard felt that he had been lied to wouldn't he have said it in this article? " No? Most likely not.... People don't generally go on video slandering the people they are currently under contract with. If you're going to use that kind of logic, this would be a far more convincing argument:

"When asked about allegations that his management had misled him about the value of the UFC offer, Mousasi declined comment. "

Why would he decline to comment if his answer was going to be "no, I wasn't lied to" That's like someone pleading the fifth in court. Maybe you didn't officially say it, but by refusing to answer, you're essentially saying it's true. He was also clearly struggling to answer the last question diplomatically before settling on "There was never an offer from the UFC" which reinforces everything else already said, and indicates that there is some conflict he's trying to stay clear of.

Your post is the one based on assumptions and zero facts. Most other people's posts are based on direct quotes across about a half a dozen articles from Silva, Mousasi, and Apy Echteld, as well as the previous debacle with Fedor and Finkelschtein. You're openly rewording quotes to suit your argument and then telling other people they're making assumptions. You are using the article as the basis of your argument, and then turning around and saying that it isn't credible to begin with.

Everything that we've seen from the mouths of M-1 management (finkleshtein and echteld), Fedor, Mousasi, Joe Silva, and Dana all points in the exact same direction. Don't you think that M-1 would have said "we didn't do that" instead of calling Joe Silva to make excuses for why they did it? Don't you find it strange that there is absolutely no contradiction going on in any of their statements? Everyone is saying the same thing, even M-1.

I would be absolutely shocked if Mousasi continued with M-1 after his next 2 fights. I'm sure he knows that it is far, far easier for him to do his 2 fights and keep his mouth shut than to get caught up in a huge debacle where he's fighting against the people who have his fate in their hands. If he wants to get away from M-1 he has 2 options, one is to finish his contract, and the other is to try to separate from them legally, which would take a lot of litigation, and we saw how that worked for Couture.



yes your points are persuading.but like i said in my previous post about this.we will never really know the truth.
BustedKnuckle
9/7/09 8:34:45PM
Gergard needs to complete his contract to M-1 and be done with those weasels. even if it doesnt brincg him to the UFC.
mma-fanatic
9/8/09 3:09:36AM
It is a shame that we will never see all of these great fighters fight in the same org. It is a small hope that in the future people might see it demeaning to have soooo many different champions all over. I do not agree with the way M-1 manages their fighters but if there is one organization who has the right idea, it is them.
MMA should be an olympic sport! The day countries deem their own champions, and bring them all together to see who the WORLD champion is, is the day mma fans should dream about.
There should not be a strickforce, ufc, dream, m-1, ect......there should be only MMA, same rules, same sport, everywhere. Like soccer!
Bad thing is, we are going backwards....there are so many small orgs. trying to get their foot in the huge door that is mma that who knows when the next Fedor, or Anderson Silva comes along and the world never sees them because of crap like this.
The closest we will get to something like this, is if the ufc bullies as many of these guys out and gets their contracts similar to affliction. And then, maybe, the managers of these fighters won't have any other choice but to go to the ufc.
People like Mousasi will never rise to their full potential with greedy managers (like M-1) and greedy business owners/presidents (like ufc).
But, who am I to say anything,it's just an opinion...I still love the sport and will watch untill the day I die!!
sclasclemski
9/8/09 6:46:05AM
I get annoyed with people complaining about the UFC bullying fighters...perhaps its true...I don't know...I think when they get big enough then the fighters can do exactly what they do in MLB and the NFL..which is Unionize so that they can collectively bargain for minimum wages and health benefits if thats what they are interested in...that would protect the fighters.
EliasG
9/8/09 8:08:17PM
I went back to see the article that was provided in the last thread and the article that was provided in this thread. I didn't go to other articles. I was only commenting on THOSE articles. I never read the article posted in the "Sherdog Forums" and didn't comment on them. The quote attributed to -Silva in the last thread dedicated to this article said it came NOT from Silva but from Cindy O. an affiliate of Zuffa.

I can't and didn't comment on articles that were never posted.

Now I DO think you make a good point about Gegard Mousasi keeping his mouth shut about calling Joe Silva. The problem with that it your statement is UNQUESTIONABLY conjecture. What we do know is that Gegard never said he called. Only Cindy O said that Silva said Gegard called.

Now the second article you referenced---posted in its entirety with no other internet address onto a sherdog forum---said that SIlva HIMSELF said that they never made an offer and Gegard called him because M-1 claimed UFC DID make an offer.

I have no idea of the validity of an article posted on a forum and that I never referenced in my comments. I don't know how I could be asked to. But that's beside the point--the FACTS are that the ONLY party saying that M-1 CLAIMED UFC made an offer---is Cindy O from Zuffa quoting Silva---or if your referenced article is true---Joe Silva. That is still one party. Gegard never said it. M-1 never said it---so my point stands. It's tabloid. UNLESS Silva can produce evidence of that phonecall and substantiate the claim that is APPARENTLY being insinuated--that M-1 lied to Gegard. OR Gegard himself---the other party in the alleged conversation claims that this occured you really have absolutely.......nothing.

You see, my point stands, everything about this is conjecture. An allegation in a round about way is made by either someone 'affiliated' with Zuffa, or as you say Silva himself By insinuation. The insinuation being that since Gegard called UFC and asked about their offer and no offer was made--that Gegard was lied to. This is a titilating insinuation and allegation, except for one problem. It's never been substantiated. Gegard one of the other parties in the talks, has not stated he ever called Silva. In the same way, M-1 has never made a substantiated statement that UFC offered Gegard a contract that they then in turn refused.

The thing is, if this DID happen, then M-1 would be an agent acting in their OWN best interest instead of the interest of their client. That would mean they would be an "agent acting in bad faith" legally nullifying their hold on Gegard Mousasi. The minute you can establish that your agent is acting in bad faith---they legally cease to be your agent.


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