Mike Swick vs. Dan Hardy To Determine #1 Contender For GSP

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DCRage
9/28/09 8:57:12AM
On Sunday Mike Swick announced his next opponent won't be Matt Hughes or Georges St. Pierre. It's Dan Hardy. No specific date is set for the matchup but it could happen at UFC 105 in England on November 14. The winner will next face GSP for the UFC Welterweight Championship.

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DCRage
9/28/09 8:58:01AM
For those wondering about Dong-Hyun Kim, who was supposed to face Hardy at 105, he may be injured.
emfleek
9/28/09 9:25:27AM
Hmmm...I see Swick winning, unfortunately. I'll still root for Dan, though.
Rush
9/28/09 9:25:55AM
This kind of suggests that they had Swick in mind all along for the next title shot.
Nightmare27
9/28/09 9:37:27AM
This has the makings of a good fight but not so sure that Hardy deserves a #1 contender spot. If Marcus Davis had gotten the split decision would he be in this position? I doubt it. Granted him and Swick have already fought, it just seems a bit early for Hardy to get his chance.
MiniMan
9/28/09 9:39:45AM
Hardy has a good shot at winning this... I at this point would pick him, You would say a SD/UD but he could crack Swick and put him out. Same goes the other way with Swick, He could win too.

Good Fight anyways.....
emfleek
9/28/09 9:45:05AM

Posted by Nightmare27

This has the makings of a good fight but not so sure that Hardy deserves a #1 contender spot. If Marcus Davis had gotten the split decision would he be in this position? I doubt it. Granted him and Swick have already fought, it just seems a bit early for Hardy to get his chance.



The fight is going to take place in Manchester, England. Of course they'd have a local in the main event.

He's 3-0 in the UFC. I really have no problem with it. Then again, I'm also a Hardy fan.

bjj1605
9/28/09 10:46:16AM
I don't think either one of these guys should be fighting for a title. Whatever though. It was the best they could scrap together. WW is starting to get a little stale...
emfleek
9/28/09 10:51:01AM

Posted by bjj1605

I don't think either one of these guys should be fighting for a title. Whatever though. It was the best they could scrap together. WW is starting to get a little stale...



I can see the argument for Swick (9-1 in the UFC) being a lot stronger than the argument for Hardy. BUT...like I said in a previous post, the fight is in England so of course they're going to have a local fighter in the main event. IMO, Swick is the next best option outside of those who have already lost to GSP (or lost their last fight).

Who would you suggest?
SamPan
9/28/09 11:01:01AM
Semtex - Hardy
prozacnation1978
9/28/09 11:08:53AM
kim is not injured he is getting the shaft
my guess is he may sill fight on card right now they have 4 fights for main card
kim could take on say paul daley for 5th fight

i like the match i think swick wants it more than hardy
and swick will probably eek out a decision
Lay_N_Pray
9/28/09 11:46:55AM
Hardy getting a shot at the title would be a joke.

I thoroughly believe he would have lost to "Stun Gun," but I suppose if he beats Swick, that would bring a good amount of legitimacy to getting a shot at the title.

I would say Swick is definitely the next in line though, and the most deserving at this point. UFC should take a look at Dan Hornbuckle though, that kid could cause some problems in the division.
bjj1605
9/28/09 11:50:05AM
I would suggest giving Mike Swick a top ten fighter. There are guys for him to fight that would show he's a contender for the belt. I wouldn't mind seeing Fitch or Kos fight him but they aren't willing to. IMO he should be fighting someone like Matt Hughes, Karo Parisyan, or Thiago Alves. Beating Ben Saunders and then Dan Hardy doesn't make you the #1 Contender. The UFC really needs to pursue Jake Shields and Nick Diaz. Welter Weight is getting stale and no one is really shining through right now.

New fighters would make the division more exciting, obviously. I'd hate to see an undersized GSP move up in weight just because the UFC can't produce challengers any more.

Ps. They can always say "if swick beats so and so he gets the shot, if so and so beats swick they still need a couple fights to get back to the titlte". That way you wouldn't have an untested fighter (like dan hardy) or a guy with question marks (like matt hughes or karo parisyan) fighting for a title. Not that matt will ever fight Georges again anyway.
Boo_Radley21
9/28/09 11:57:43AM
Don't think Hardy is deserving yet, but Swick will win and St. Pierre will rape either of them.
tomp6581
9/28/09 12:01:33PM

Posted by Boo_Radley21

Don't think Hardy is deserving yet, but Swick will win and St. Pierre will rape either of them.




Mayhem13
9/28/09 12:42:29PM
Is Couture vs Vera still happening on that card?

Should be an exciting competitive fight...doubt either guy can hang with St.Pierre though
Jackelope
9/28/09 12:46:10PM

Posted by bjj1605

The UFC really needs to pursue Jake Shields and Nick Diaz. Welter Weight is getting stale and no one is really shining through right now.



Do you really think Nick Diaz would provide a better challenge than Mike Swick? I dunno, I'm not high on this Diaz love like everyone else seems to be. We already know Nick Diaz has a giant weakness for fighters who can smother his range and avoid subs. That is what GSP does best.

I get how Mike Swick doesn't seem like much of a challenge to GSP, but he's as good or better than most of the other competition out there. Jake Shields? Compared to GSP's standup Shields can hardly box his way out of a wet paper bag. Also- we all know GSP isn't going to be out wrestled by Jake Shields.

So they want Swick for No. 1 contender? I don't have a problem with that. He's got some of the quickest hands at 170, he's durable, and he's game. So far the only chink in GSP's armor seems to be his standup, so why not line up two guys who have pretty good standup with some KO power for a number 1 contender's match?
Rush
9/28/09 1:35:00PM

Posted by Jackelope


Posted by bjj1605

The UFC really needs to pursue Jake Shields and Nick Diaz. Welter Weight is getting stale and no one is really shining through right now.



Do you really think Nick Diaz would provide a better challenge than Mike Swick? I dunno, I'm not high on this Diaz love like everyone else seems to be. We already know Nick Diaz has a giant weakness for fighters who can smother his range and avoid subs. That is what GSP does best.

I get how Mike Swick doesn't seem like much of a challenge to GSP, but he's as good or better than most of the other competition out there. Jake Shields? Compared to GSP's standup Shields can hardly box his way out of a wet paper bag. Also- we all know GSP isn't going to be out wrestled by Jake Shields.

So they want Swick for No. 1 contender? I don't have a problem with that. He's got some of the quickest hands at 170, he's durable, and he's game. So far the only chink in GSP's armor seems to be his standup, so why not line up two guys who have pretty good standup with some KO power for a number 1 contender's match?





Well said as usual.
DCRage
9/28/09 1:40:01PM
This is a good matchup, but obviously Hardy has home-field advantage. Therefore, if it's a close fight, Swick had better finish Hardy or the judges won't give it to him.
ace_of_god
9/28/09 2:16:27PM
if this fight goes to dicision we might see another bisping-hamil
bjj1605
9/28/09 2:52:57PM

Posted by Jackelope


Posted by bjj1605

The UFC really needs to pursue Jake Shields and Nick Diaz. Welter Weight is getting stale and no one is really shining through right now.



Do you really think Nick Diaz would provide a better challenge than Mike Swick? I dunno, I'm not high on this Diaz love like everyone else seems to be. We already know Nick Diaz has a giant weakness for fighters who can smother his range and avoid subs. That is what GSP does best.

I get how Mike Swick doesn't seem like much of a challenge to GSP, but he's as good or better than most of the other competition out there. Jake Shields? Compared to GSP's standup Shields can hardly box his way out of a wet paper bag. Also- we all know GSP isn't going to be out wrestled by Jake Shields.

So they want Swick for No. 1 contender? I don't have a problem with that. He's got some of the quickest hands at 170, he's durable, and he's game. So far the only chink in GSP's armor seems to be his standup, so why not line up two guys who have pretty good standup with some KO power for a number 1 contender's match?



I'm not saying shields or diaz would be a better challenger for GSP. I'm suggesting that they would be better challenges for Mike Swick. I agree that swick is the best contender right now, that doesn't mean he's a good contender. He's too unproven for my taste and I don't feel that beating Dan Hardy (which he absolutely will, IMO not even a close fight) will prove anything we don't already know.

I'm not questioning Swicks legitimacy I'm challenging that Dan Hardy is a good fight for him. Swick is 9-1 in the UFC. HIs opponents are

Alex Schoenauer, Gideon Ray, Steve, Vigneault, Joe Riggs,

David Loiseau, Yushin Okami(Loss), Josh Burkman,

Marcus Davis, Jonathan Goulet, Ben Saunders,
There are some decent names on that list (Okami, Marcus Davis, Riggs, Loiseau) but none of them are top contenders except Okami, whom he lost to. Riggs and Loiseau used to be, but aren't any more. Marcus davis was on his way, but didn't make it. All of his fights against tough opponents have gone to a decision with the exception of Riggs. He still has to prove (IMO) that he has any sort of a shot at beating Georges St. Pierre. Beating Dan Hard, even if he runs through him, will not convince me anymore that he can threaten George for the title.
DCRage
9/28/09 4:37:42PM
Hardy has now confirmed the Swick fight on his website, and also that Kim is off due to injury.
Jackelope
9/28/09 4:42:27PM

Posted by bjj1605


Posted by Jackelope


Posted by bjj1605

The UFC really needs to pursue Jake Shields and Nick Diaz. Welter Weight is getting stale and no one is really shining through right now.



Do you really think Nick Diaz would provide a better challenge than Mike Swick? I dunno, I'm not high on this Diaz love like everyone else seems to be. We already know Nick Diaz has a giant weakness for fighters who can smother his range and avoid subs. That is what GSP does best.

I get how Mike Swick doesn't seem like much of a challenge to GSP, but he's as good or better than most of the other competition out there. Jake Shields? Compared to GSP's standup Shields can hardly box his way out of a wet paper bag. Also- we all know GSP isn't going to be out wrestled by Jake Shields.

So they want Swick for No. 1 contender? I don't have a problem with that. He's got some of the quickest hands at 170, he's durable, and he's game. So far the only chink in GSP's armor seems to be his standup, so why not line up two guys who have pretty good standup with some KO power for a number 1 contender's match?



I'm not saying shields or diaz would be a better challenger for GSP. I'm suggesting that they would be better challenges for Mike Swick. I agree that swick is the best contender right now, that doesn't mean he's a good contender. He's too unproven for my taste and I don't feel that beating Dan Hardy (which he absolutely will, IMO not even a close fight) will prove anything we don't already know.

I'm not questioning Swicks legitimacy I'm challenging that Dan Hardy is a good fight for him. Swick is 9-1 in the UFC. HIs opponents are

Alex Schoenauer, Gideon Ray, Steve, Vigneault, Joe Riggs,

David Loiseau, Yushin Okami(Loss), Josh Burkman,

Marcus Davis, Jonathan Goulet, Ben Saunders,
There are some decent names on that list (Okami, Marcus Davis, Riggs, Loiseau) but none of them are top contenders except Okami, whom he lost to. Riggs and Loiseau used to be, but aren't any more. Marcus davis was on his way, but didn't make it. All of his fights against tough opponents have gone to a decision with the exception of Riggs. He still has to prove (IMO) that he has any sort of a shot at beating Georges St. Pierre. Beating Dan Hard, even if he runs through him, will not convince me anymore that he can threaten George for the title.



I get what you're saying from that point of view. I think Swick could beat both of those guys, too.

At the same time, though... it's just the way it has worked out. Kampmann vs. Swick was supposed to happen, which I feel was a legitimately good matchup, but obviously things got in the way of that. I don't have a problem with Hardy stepping in considering he's looked pretty good as of late, and the UFC needs personnel for the UK card. As much as we don't want to believe it, this stuff does play a factor. Call it the politics of the fight game if you will, but at least they're not throwing in some random nameless UK fighter. Hardy has worked himself into a respectable position on the ladder.. I'm cool with it.
hotrodttt
9/28/09 9:24:52PM
Hardy gets outclassed so bad in this Fight, Swick is 10x better than Hardy in everything. I think Swick ko's him tbh or takes a really 1 sided decision.
lohmann
9/29/09 12:47:18AM
Swick's lucky that he is teammates with Koscheck and Fitch, otherwise he would probably have to get through one of them en route to a showdown for the title.

I like this matchup, even if the winner has little chance of dethroning Georges St. Pierre. Another sign of how dominant the current champions in the UFC are in their weight classes when Mike Swick and Dan Hardy are the two hottest fighters in line for GSP.
BigBadAl
9/29/09 8:48:51AM

Posted by DCRage

This is a good matchup, but obviously Hardy has home-field advantage. Therefore, if it's a close fight, Swick had better finish Hardy or the judges won't give it to him.



Why is it that every time a UK fighter is fighting in the UK the term "home field adventage" is always mentioned? There are poor judging decisions all round the world. The only decision in the UK that was considered by most (including myself) to be scandalous is the Bisping v Hamill fight and the judges that gave the fight to Bisping were American. The UK judge gave the fight to Hamill. I have never been presented with any decent evidence that "home field advantage" exists anywhere in the UFC let alone just in the UK only as some of you seem to think.

It is a bit insulting for anyone in the UK to keep hearing about UK fighters getting preferential treatment in the UK. It comes across as the UK cheats or the fighters in the UK are not good enough to win decisions on their own merit.

Anyway rant over, should be a great fight and a tough one to call. Either will get tooled by GSP anyway imo.
emfleek
9/29/09 8:50:44AM

Posted by BigBadAl

Why is it that every time a UK fighter is fighting in the UK the term "home field adventage" is always mentioned? There are poor judging decisions all round the world. The only decision in the UK that was considered by most (including myself) to be scandalous is the Bisping v Hamill fight and the judges that gave the fight to Bisping were American. The UK judge gave the fight to Hamill. I have never been presented with any decent evidence that "home field advantage" exists anywhere in the UFC let alone just in the UK only as some of you seem to think.

It is a bit insulting for anyone in the UK to keep hearing about UK fighters getting preferential treatment in the UK. It comes across as the UK cheats or the fighters in the UK are not good enough to win decisions on their own merit.

Anyway rant over, should be a great fight and a tough one to call. Either will get tooled by GSP anyway imo.



I actually agree with you, Al. Good post.
Jackelope
9/29/09 9:19:43AM

Posted by BigBadAl


Posted by DCRage

This is a good matchup, but obviously Hardy has home-field advantage. Therefore, if it's a close fight, Swick had better finish Hardy or the judges won't give it to him.



Why is it that every time a UK fighter is fighting in the UK the term "home field adventage" is always mentioned? There are poor judging decisions all round the world. The only decision in the UK that was considered by most (including myself) to be scandalous is the Bisping v Hamill fight and the judges that gave the fight to Bisping were American. The UK judge gave the fight to Hamill. I have never been presented with any decent evidence that "home field advantage" exists anywhere in the UFC let alone just in the UK only as some of you seem to think.

It is a bit insulting for anyone in the UK to keep hearing about UK fighters getting preferential treatment in the UK. It comes across as the UK cheats or the fighters in the UK are not good enough to win decisions on their own merit.

Anyway rant over, should be a great fight and a tough one to call. Either will get tooled by GSP anyway imo.



Anyone who has done some overseas traveling (especially from CA to the UK) would agree that having to go that far out of your own time zone is a disadvantage. That is a time difference that takes weeks to get used to. I'm very, very familiar with that exact time difference since I used to live in Germany and would travel back and forth to AZ constantly. Not to mention the fact that for some fighters having the crowd rooting against you is not exactly a motivating factor.

For those reasons and those reasons alone it is a disadvantage to be fighting overseas. I don't personally believe the judging has anything to deal with it.

emfleek
9/29/09 9:22:20AM

Posted by Jackelope

I don't personally believe the judging has anything to deal with it.




I believe that's what most of the comments have hinted at...not the actual time zone difference.

Horrible judging exists wherever you go.
bjj1605
9/29/09 1:39:07PM

Posted by BigBadAl


Posted by DCRage

This is a good matchup, but obviously Hardy has home-field advantage. Therefore, if it's a close fight, Swick had better finish Hardy or the judges won't give it to him.



Why is it that every time a UK fighter is fighting in the UK the term "home field adventage" is always mentioned? There are poor judging decisions all round the world. The only decision in the UK that was considered by most (including myself) to be scandalous is the Bisping v Hamill fight and the judges that gave the fight to Bisping were American. The UK judge gave the fight to Hamill. I have never been presented with any decent evidence that "home field advantage" exists anywhere in the UFC let alone just in the UK only as some of you seem to think.

It is a bit insulting for anyone in the UK to keep hearing about UK fighters getting preferential treatment in the UK. It comes across as the UK cheats or the fighters in the UK are not good enough to win decisions on their own merit.

Anyway rant over, should be a great fight and a tough one to call. Either will get tooled by GSP anyway imo.



Just like in boxing, home field advantage doesn't have to mean corruption. They always try to have judges from other parts of the world who won't be biased, and the judges themselves do a good job of not favoring one fighter over the other.

The reason home field advantage is a legitimate point of discussion is because of the crowd. And I'm not referring to the effect on the fighters performance (which can be positive or negative). Its on the judges. When Dan Hardy lands a good shot, or scores a take down, the crowd will go wild. When Mike Swick lands a good shot they will likely have little reaction. As much as it sucks this subconsciously affects the judges scoring. They will unintentionally believe that Dan Hardy's actions are more significant than MIke Swick's. In psychology they call this "group think". The same often happens with a biased commentator, he has the affect of convincing the fans that a decision was unjust because one fighter was more heralded than another.

However, this is not just in the UK so you are right in that sense.
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