Is Michael Bisping Becoming a Fan Favorite?

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POLL: Is Michael Bisping Becoming a Fan Favorite?
Yes! 30% (17)
No! 54% (30)
Don King is a Fan Favorite! 16% (9)
Bythar
9/24/12 8:46:02AM
I dislike his disrespectful attitude and I always will, but I respect his skills.
prozacnation1978
9/24/12 10:00:29AM
I will never like the guy
LightsOUT23
9/24/12 11:13:00AM
No love for Bisping ...

Its obvious to me that probably 90% of this site has minimal appeal for Bisping or what he represents in the UFC. Dana White said it best, Bisping always turns up to fight and has improved dramatically since his loss to Dan Henderson.

Hendo is the only fighter to have stopped him and judging by what Hendo has gone on to do since that fight should only lift Bisping's profile even more knowing that the only ko loss he has had is to one of the greatest of all time. His fight with Evans was a split decision loss, His fight against Wandy was controversial not to mention his fight with Sonnen who even Sonnen himself thought Bisping won the fight. Bisping's UFC record of 13-4 really is not too bad considering he has never hand picked an opponent or ducked anyone on short notice.

There are a few fighters in the UFC today who have, some of which are holding titles.

As for this top 10 talk, there is no top 10 in the UFC. Even Dana White holds no regard for rankings.
If Bisping is such a low tier fighter, then how did Chael Sonnen get his rematch with Silva after beating Brian Stann and narrowly escaping a decision to Bisping? If Bisping is not top level competition, then Chael Sonnen should never have got his rematch.

As for other challengers for Anderson Silva in the past, Thales Leites, Patrick Cote, Damien Maia - who did these guys beat to get their shot ?? ...

Cote - split decision over Ricardo Almeida got his shot at Silva after beating Kendal Grove. Where is Kendal grove now ??

Maia - UD against Dan Miller after getting ko'd by Nate Marquardt.

Thales Leites - Only beat Nate Marquardt due to the points system of illegal knees. Then Thales stops Drew McFedries to get his crack at the middleweight Gold.

Travis Lutter - Don't even get me started ....

BigBadAl
9/24/12 12:14:05PM

Posted by LightsOUT23

No love for Bisping ...

Its obvious to me that probably 90% of this site has minimal appeal for Bisping or what he represents in the UFC. Dana White said it best, Bisping always turns up to fight and has improved dramatically since his loss to Dan Henderson.

Hendo is the only fighter to have stopped him and judging by what Hendo has gone on to do since that fight should only lift Bisping's profile even more knowing that the only ko loss he has had is to one of the greatest of all time. His fight with Evans was a split decision loss, His fight against Wandy was controversial not to mention his fight with Sonnen who even Sonnen himself thought Bisping won the fight. Bisping's UFC record of 13-4 really is not too bad considering he has never hand picked an opponent or ducked anyone on short notice.

There are a few fighters in the UFC today who have, some of which are holding titles.

As for this top 10 talk, there is no top 10 in the UFC. Even Dana White holds no regard for rankings.
If Bisping is such a low tier fighter, then how did Chael Sonnen get his rematch with Silva after beating Brian Stann and narrowly escaping a decision to Bisping? If Bisping is not top level competition, then Chael Sonnen should never have got his rematch.

As for other challengers for Anderson Silva in the past, Thales Leites, Patrick Cote, Damien Maia - who did these guys beat to get their shot ?? ...

Cote - split decision over Ricardo Almeida got his shot at Silva after beating Kendal Grove. Where is Kendal grove now ??

Maia - UD against Dan Miller after getting ko'd by Nate Marquardt.

Thales Leites - Only beat Nate Marquardt due to the points system of illegal knees. Then Thales stops Drew McFedries to get his crack at the middleweight Gold.

Travis Lutter - Don't even get me started ....




Great post. When you look at that list there is no reason for Bisping not to get a shot.
bjj1605
9/24/12 1:59:42PM

Posted by LightsOUT23


As for this top 10 talk, there is no top 10 in the UFC. Even Dana White holds no regard for rankings.
If Bisping is such a low tier fighter, then how did Chael Sonnen get his rematch with Silva after beating Brian Stann and narrowly escaping a decision to Bisping? If Bisping is not top level competition, then Chael Sonnen should never have got his rematch.

As for other challengers for Anderson Silva in the past, Thales Leites, Patrick Cote, Damien Maia - who did these guys beat to get their shot ?? ...

Cote - split decision over Ricardo Almeida got his shot at Silva after beating Kendal Grove. Where is Kendal grove now ??

Maia - UD against Dan Miller after getting ko'd by Nate Marquardt.

Thales Leites - Only beat Nate Marquardt due to the points system of illegal knees. Then Thales stops Drew McFedries to get his crack at the middleweight Gold.

Travis Lutter - Don't even get me started ....




You've got a point to an extent. However, it's always hard to look back and decide if a guy earned a shot.

The Top 10 and the upper levels of a division change constantly. Maia beat Sonnen, Quarry, MacDonald, Herman, Jensen, and Miller. Today, only one of those guys would be a top ten (Sonnen), but that is still more top ten wins than Bisping has (which is zero.)

Leites beat Pete Sell, Ryan Jensen, Nate Marquardt, and Drew McFedries. Marquardt is the best guy on that list but again, this record is more impressive than Bisping's.

Cote beat Scott Smith, Kendall Grove, Drew McFedries, and Ricardo Almeida. Almeida is probably his best win on here, but again, better than any win on Bisping's record.

The only one where you MAY have a point is with Travis Lutter but even then he beat Patrick Cote before he got a shot (and this was a special circumstance because of the TUF Comeback show.)

At MW Bisping has beaten Charles McCarthy, Jason Day, Chris Leben, Denis Kang, Dan Miller, Akiyama, Jorge River, Jason Miller, and now Brian Stann. I think the best wins on here are Leben and Stann (both stylistically favorable to Bisping.)

The most remarkable thing about that list is how unremarkable it is. His 3 highest ranked opponents (Hendo, Wandy, and Sonnen) have all beaten him. Admittedly, the fights against Sonnen and Wandy were close losses. But that isn't an argument for a title shot, it's an argument for Bisping being a gatekeeper.

If he wants to earn his shot he needs to beat either Franklin/Le (I included this because Rich Franlin is a former champ and a tough fight for anyone), Weidman/Boetsch/, or Okami/Belcher.

Bisping has a lot of wins but most of them are against very low ranked opponents and few of them have been extremely impressive. His most impressive performance to date was his loss to Chael Sonnen.
Theoutlaw08
9/24/12 2:04:12PM
Hate him, will always hate him. Will never enjoy anything he does. I can respect how he fights, but I will always hate him.

grappler0000
9/24/12 2:34:31PM
Trust me when I tell you this...disliking Bisping makes one want a Bisping/Anderson fight way more than any of his fans could possibly imagine. Don't let anyone tell you differently.
ghandikush
9/24/12 2:44:36PM
Silva beat franklin to hell twice, submitted and rocked Hendo in his prime, brutally knocked out prime Marquardt, knocked out Okami toward the end of his prime, finished Sonnen twice, brutally knocked out Forrest coming right off his title loss, flash knocked out Vitor....

Those are all pretty enduring names in the sport and feel free to tell me about Bispings brutal finish of Chainsaw McCarthy but I just dont think it compares. He beat ONE enduring name I can think of, ONE, and that was Hammil.......

Edit- MAYBE Brian Stann will endure, MAYBE
LightsOUT23
9/24/12 3:00:13PM

Posted by bjj1605



You've got a point to an extent. However, it's always hard to look back and decide if a guy earned a shot.

The Top 10 and the upper levels of a division change constantly. Maia beat Sonnen, Quarry, MacDonald, Herman, Jensen, and Miller. Today, only one of those guys would be a top ten (Sonnen), but that is still more top ten wins than Bisping has (which is zero.)

Leites beat Pete Sell, Ryan Jensen, Nate Marquardt, and Drew McFedries. Marquardt is the best guy on that list but again, this record is more impressive than Bisping's.

Cote beat Scott Smith, Kendall Grove, Drew McFedries, and Ricardo Almeida. Almeida is probably his best win on here, but again, better than any win on Bisping's record.

The only one where you MAY have a point is with Travis Lutter but even then he beat Patrick Cote before he got a shot (and this was a special circumstance because of the TUF Comeback show.)

At MW Bisping has beaten Charles McCarthy, Jason Day, Chris Leben, Denis Kang, Dan Miller, Akiyama, Jorge River, Jason Miller, and now Brian Stann. I think the best wins on here are Leben and Stann (both stylistically favorable to Bisping.)

The most remarkable thing about that list is how unremarkable it is. His 3 highest ranked opponents (Hendo, Wandy, and Sonnen) have all beaten him. Admittedly, the fights against Sonnen and Wandy were close losses. But that isn't an argument for a title shot, it's an argument for Bisping being a gatekeeper.

If he wants to earn his shot he needs to beat either Franklin/Le (I included this because Rich Franlin is a former champ and a tough fight for anyone), Weidman/Boetsch/, or Okami/Belcher.

Bisping has a lot of wins but most of them are against very low ranked opponents and few of them have been extremely impressive. His most impressive performance to date was his loss to Chael Sonnen.



I disagree,

Maia was ko'd by Marquardt, then after one UD win over Dan miller who was not considered a top 10 fighter earn't him his title shot at Silva.

Thales Leites won a split decision over Marquardt due to illegal knees. If those knees were not delivered by Marquardt, Leites would have lost all 3 rounds. And Ryan Jenson, Floyd sword, Pete Sell and Drew Mcfedries are not at all top 10 MW's of that time.

As for Cote, he beat Almedia via split decision. Ricardo came into the UFC from fighting nobodies in Japan to beat Rob Yundt before his fight with Cote.
Again, Scott smith, Jason Day, Drew Mcfedries and Kendal Grove were not names worthy of challenging for the MW title, let alone Ricardo Almedia.

Travis Lutter, well he won the lottery to get his shot. Enough said about that.

At Middleweight, Bisping has beaten Akiyama (who beat Belcher in his UFC debut) Chris Leben, Denis Kang, Jason Miller and now Brian Stann who are all bigger names than the above that the likes of Cote, Leites & Maia beat before getting their title shots. Lets not forget that Bisping has only been stopped once in 17 UFC bouts with more recently taking Sonnen the distance in a close fight that even Sonnen thought he'd lost.

Rich Franklin is not a title contender, He fought once this year against Wanderlei and won a decision, last year he lost to Forrest Griffin. As for Gung Le, He's 1-1 in the UFC. And the 1 win he has is over Cote. These guys are legends, but not title contender names.

If Akiyama, Chris Leben, Denis Kang, Jason Miller and Brian Stann are weaker opposition than the likes of Scott smith, drew Mcfedries, Dan Miller or Kendal Grove then i would agree with you that Bisping does not deserve his title shot.

..... But i do not agree, Without a doubt in my mind, Bisping has fought the tougher opposition than the above fighters who got their shots at the point of their title fights with Silva.

Okami vs Belcher is already set, Weidman vs Boetsch is already set, Silva needs a new opponent ... Why not Bisping ???

I rest my case.


moob
9/24/12 3:05:36PM

Posted by ghandikush

Silva beat franklin to hell twice, submitted and rocked Hendo in his prime, brutally knocked out prime Marquardt, knocked out Okami toward the end of his prime, finished Sonnen twice, brutally knocked out Forrest coming right off his title loss, flash knocked out Vitor....

Those are all pretty enduring names in the sport and feel free to tell me about Bispings brutal finish of Chainsaw McCarthy but I just dont think it compares. He beat ONE enduring name I can think of, ONE, and that was Hammil.......

Edit- MAYBE Brian Stann will endure, MAYBE



We're not talking about the legitamacy of those Silva has fought, although there is some relevance as there are a decent list of names you've omitted who have a significantly lower pedigree.

Amongst the names he's beaten, I'd say Leben, Stann and Hamill stand out, but I feel its not as black and white as that, as he's done pretty well against the upper echelons which deserves credit IMO.
State_Champ
9/24/12 3:08:11PM
EDIT- Bisping is becoming more popular, imo.
LightsOUT23
9/24/12 3:08:41PM

Posted by ghandikush

Silva beat franklin to hell twice, submitted and rocked Hendo in his prime, brutally knocked out prime Marquardt, knocked out Okami toward the end of his prime, finished Sonnen twice, brutally knocked out Forrest coming right off his title loss, flash knocked out Vitor....

Those are all pretty enduring names in the sport and feel free to tell me about Bispings brutal finish of Chainsaw McCarthy but I just dont think it compares. He beat ONE enduring name I can think of, ONE, and that was Hammil.......

Edit- MAYBE Brian Stann will endure, MAYBE



LOL

Did you not see Dennis Kang's face ? Chris Leben's Face? Mayhem's Face? Akiyama's face? Chael Sonnen's face? Brian Stann's face?

Bisping may not possess natural one punch KO power, but he does leave a mark now and again... Take a look for yourself sometime !!
bigrand826
9/24/12 4:05:40PM

Posted by LightsOUT23


Posted by bjj1605



You've got a point to an extent. However, it's always hard to look back and decide if a guy earned a shot.

The Top 10 and the upper levels of a division change constantly. Maia beat Sonnen, Quarry, MacDonald, Herman, Jensen, and Miller. Today, only one of those guys would be a top ten (Sonnen), but that is still more top ten wins than Bisping has (which is zero.)

Leites beat Pete Sell, Ryan Jensen, Nate Marquardt, and Drew McFedries. Marquardt is the best guy on that list but again, this record is more impressive than Bisping's.

Cote beat Scott Smith, Kendall Grove, Drew McFedries, and Ricardo Almeida. Almeida is probably his best win on here, but again, better than any win on Bisping's record.

The only one where you MAY have a point is with Travis Lutter but even then he beat Patrick Cote before he got a shot (and this was a special circumstance because of the TUF Comeback show.)

At MW Bisping has beaten Charles McCarthy, Jason Day, Chris Leben, Denis Kang, Dan Miller, Akiyama, Jorge River, Jason Miller, and now Brian Stann. I think the best wins on here are Leben and Stann (both stylistically favorable to Bisping.)

The most remarkable thing about that list is how unremarkable it is. His 3 highest ranked opponents (Hendo, Wandy, and Sonnen) have all beaten him. Admittedly, the fights against Sonnen and Wandy were close losses. But that isn't an argument for a title shot, it's an argument for Bisping being a gatekeeper.

If he wants to earn his shot he needs to beat either Franklin/Le (I included this because Rich Franlin is a former champ and a tough fight for anyone), Weidman/Boetsch/, or Okami/Belcher.

Bisping has a lot of wins but most of them are against very low ranked opponents and few of them have been extremely impressive. His most impressive performance to date was his loss to Chael Sonnen.




I disagree,

Maia was ko'd by Marquardt, then after one UD win over Dan miller who was not considered a top 10 fighter earn't him his title shot at Silva.

Thales Leites won a split decision over Marquardt due to illegal knees. If those knees were not delivered by Marquardt, Leites would have lost all 3 rounds. And Ryan Jenson, Floyd sword, Pete Sell and Drew Mcfedries are not at all top 10 MW's of that time.

As for Cote, he beat Almedia via split decision. Ricardo came into the UFC from fighting nobodies in Japan to beat Rob Yundt before his fight with Cote.
Again, Scott smith, Jason Day, Drew Mcfedries and Kendal Grove were not names worthy of challenging for the MW title, let alone Ricardo Almedia.

Travis Lutter, well he won the lottery to get his shot. Enough said about that.

At Middleweight, Bisping has beaten Akiyama (who beat Belcher in his UFC debut) Chris Leben, Denis Kang, Jason Miller and now Brian Stann who are all bigger names than the above that the likes of Cote, Leites & Maia beat before getting their title shots. Lets not forget that Bisping has only been stopped once in 17 UFC bouts with more recently taking Sonnen the distance in a close fight that even Sonnen thought he'd lost.

Rich Franklin is not a title contender, He fought once this year against Wanderlei and won a decision, last year he lost to Forrest Griffin. As for Gung Le, He's 1-1 in the UFC. And the 1 win he has is over Cote. These guys are legends, but not title contender names.

If Akiyama, Chris Leben, Denis Kang, Jason Miller and Brian Stann are weaker opposition than the likes of Scott smith, drew Mcfedries, Dan Miller or Kendal Grove then i would agree with you that Bisping does not deserve his title shot.

..... But i do not agree, Without a doubt in my mind, Bisping has fought the tougher opposition than the above fighters who got their shots at the point of their title fights with Silva.

Okami vs Belcher is already set, Weidman vs Boetsch is already set, Silva needs a new opponent ... Why not Bisping ???

I rest my case.





I don't hate Bisping. He's a heck of a fighter, but he still needs to beat a top 10. If you think Stann is top 10, that's fine. I disagree, but I won't argue.

I hate that Cote, Maia, Lutter, and Leites got shots at Silva too, but that shouldn't be a reason to push for Bisping to get a shot. Cote and Maia both got their shots due to the scheduled challenger getting injured (Okami and Belfort). Leites got his because Anderson already went through everyone else. Luter got his because he won TUF. None of these situations apply right now. I didn't even like Belfort getting a shot after beating nobody at MW in the UFC, beating Lindland and Terry Martin in Affliction, two guys I don't know in PRIDE, along with a loss to Hendo. But Belfort got it because they didn't want to give Hendo or Marquardt a rematch and no one else made any sense.

Weidman-Boetsch and Belcher-Okami being scheduled is a poor reason as well. Anderson will fight Bonnar, and will likely look for his usual 6 months before his next fight. Weidman-Boetsch will have 3 top 10 wins and should get next, imo. Have Bisping face the Belcher-Okami winner for the next shot. That would give Bisping a top 10 win and a legit claim to a title shot.
bigrand826
9/24/12 4:18:36PM

Posted by moob

Its all about opinion, and frequently the opinion is tainted by bias - it is my opinion that Stann is a top ten MW - that opinion is shared elsewhere on the mma web - http://www.mmaweekly.com/middleweight-division-185-pound-limit-mma-top-10

My points about Vitor were alluding to him fighting Rich 3 years ago, after a period of obscurity whereby he fought in lesser known organisations and lower quality opponents.I know he's a marketable fighter, he's great, and I've followed him since he was a heavyweight- but I don't feel he was due a shot at Jones - certainly not when you use the Bisping criterion being flexibly pinned to each and every reason why he seemingly doesn't deserve a shot.

Anyway, I'll cool it for a while before I cop another ban for sticking up for him, whilst everyone else batters into him ad nauseum.



Yes, ranking are all about opinion. It is just my opinion that Stann isn't top 10, but I won't argue with you that he isn't. He's pretty close in my eyes.

I misunderstood you comment about Vitor. You are right and I really hated that he got a title shot after beating Franklin at 195. But the UFC didn't want to give a rematch and wanted someone new. Nobody that I know of thought Belfort deserved the title shot against Jones either, he just stepped up because Jones needed an opponent. I understand the frustration around some of the title shots that have been given at MW, but those undeserved shots do not make a good case for Bisping getting one, imo. If you had Stann as top 10, then Bisping is on a 1-fight win streak with 1 top 10 win. Meanwhile, you've got Weidman-Boetsch, where the winner will have a longer winstreak than Bisping and 3x the number of top 10 wins.
Cooler
9/24/12 4:20:18PM

Posted by moob


Posted by Cooler


Posted by moob

Dunno how many more contenders he needs to beat to finally get a shot - given some recent match-ups - Belfort being the most recent example.



Bisping hasn't beaten any top 10, that's why.

At least Belfort beat the former champ Franklin to get a shot at Silva.

Another thing is, Bisping would get Hendo'd in the first round by Ando, so it's pointless.

P.S. would you honestly pick Bisping over Belfort? I'd bet the house on Vitor personally.


Yeah, keep hearing that top 10 argument,yawn.

Belfort was in relative obscurity until quite recently in case you've forgotten- christ he beat Rich in 2009, so that had nothing to do with him getting a shot.

Belfort is a light heavyweight so I've no idea where your going with that argument.

As another poster said elsewhere, everyone makes their predictions about x or y guy and what they'd do to Bisping yada yada, fact is he's been around in the top flight for a huge amount of time, has been a solid pro throughout discounting the trash talk - has always fought who was put in front of him - that's all he could do, perhaps the quality of his opponents wasn't that great but whose fault is that?



You keep hearing a logical argument that Mikey hasn't beaten a top name and you don't care. What's his best win....Brian Stann? Dennis Kang?

And actually beating Franklin had everything to do with Vitor getting the shot, he had one good win over a former champ which was more than Bisping has ever done fighting stepping stones and mid tier fighters. It doesn't matter if Vitor wasn't in the UFC before his fight with Franklin, that's irrelevant he still had a better win than any of Bispings. Rich being another guy at 185 that would beat Bisping.

Belfort took a fight at 205 on short notice, it's unclear what weight he will fight in but that again is not relevant because we're talking about worthiness to fight for a title, and don't you think if Bisping and Vitor were offered the title shot against Jones Bisping would've wanted it? but he didn't deserve it because again he didn't beat anyone at 205 while Vitor is the former LHW champ.

Really top flight? you're in delusional land, let me bring you back to reality.

At Middleweight

Brian Stann, not a top 10, never was
Chael Sonnen, legit top 5 but he lost that one, wasn't that close
Jason Miller, not a top 10, never was, retired 1 fight later, abilities declined
Jorge Rivera, not a top 10, never was, retired 1 fight later, abilities declined
Yoshihiro Akiyama, not a top 10, never was, akiyama was used as a stepping stone for top guys
Dan Miller, not a top 10, never was, stylistically a terrible fight for Miller, late notice
Wanderlei Silva, was not top 10 at the time, abilities declined, mikey still lost
Dennis Kang, not a top 10, never was, was beating bisping badly untill gassing
Dan Henderson, was a top 10 and bisping gets murdered
Chris Leben, not a top 10, never was, bisping jabbed and ran the whole night
Jason Day, not a top 10, never was, complete can who lost 4 of his next 5 fights
Charles McCarthy, not a top 10, never was, complete can who retired after that, declined abilities

At Light Heavyweight

Rashad Evans, was a top 10, close fight, but Rashad won it 29-28
Matt Hamill, was not a top 10, not a close fight, and the brits ate it up when mikey got the bullshit decision
Elvis Sinosic, not a top 10, never was, under .500 record but almost knocked bisping out
Eric Schafer, not a top 10, never was, cut from zuffa twice, but almost tapped bisping
Josh Haynes, not a top 10, never was, complete can



Indeed...top flight competition, mikey really ran the gauntlet huh...
Cooler
9/24/12 4:26:32PM

Posted by moob

Amongst the names he's beaten, I'd say Leben, Stann and Hamill stand out, but I feel its not as black and white as that, as he's done pretty well against the upper echelons which deserves credit IMO.



You've lost all credibility by saying he has a win over Hamill with a straight face.

Do you think we have all forgotten the worst decision of all time?
bigrand826
9/24/12 4:26:42PM

Posted by LightsOUT23

No love for Bisping ...

Its obvious to me that probably 90% of this site has minimal appeal for Bisping or what he represents in the UFC. Dana White said it best, Bisping always turns up to fight and has improved dramatically since his loss to Dan Henderson.

Hendo is the only fighter to have stopped him and judging by what Hendo has gone on to do since that fight should only lift Bisping's profile even more knowing that the only ko loss he has had is to one of the greatest of all time. His fight with Evans was a split decision loss, His fight against Wandy was controversial not to mention his fight with Sonnen who even Sonnen himself thought Bisping won the fight. Bisping's UFC record of 13-4 really is not too bad considering he has never hand picked an opponent or ducked anyone on short notice.

There are a few fighters in the UFC today who have, some of which are holding titles.

As for this top 10 talk, there is no top 10 in the UFC. Even Dana White holds no regard for rankings.
If Bisping is such a low tier fighter, then how did Chael Sonnen get his rematch with Silva after beating Brian Stann and narrowly escaping a decision to Bisping? If Bisping is not top level competition, then Chael Sonnen should never have got his rematch.

As for other challengers for Anderson Silva in the past, Thales Leites, Patrick Cote, Damien Maia - who did these guys beat to get their shot ?? ...

Cote - split decision over Ricardo Almeida got his shot at Silva after beating Kendal Grove. Where is Kendal grove now ??

Maia - UD against Dan Miller after getting ko'd by Nate Marquardt.

Thales Leites - Only beat Nate Marquardt due to the points system of illegal knees. Then Thales stops Drew McFedries to get his crack at the middleweight Gold.

Travis Lutter - Don't even get me started ....




I don't argue that Bisping is a low rated fighter. He's certainly top 10, and might even be top 5 in my book. Still, you've got to beat somebody in the top 10 for me to feel you earned a shot.

I hated all the title shots of those guys you mention, but those were due to circumstance. Cote and Maia got them due to injuries to Okami and Belfort and Lutter got his (but failed to make weight) because he won TUF.

The fact that these guys got undeserved title shots does not mean that Bisping should get one.

Again, I don't hate Bisping. He is right there at the top, but needs to beat a top fighter. I don't see how he jumps the Weidman-Boetsch winner because he beat Stann.
moob
9/24/12 4:47:31PM

Posted by Cooler


Posted by moob

Amongst the names he's beaten, I'd say Leben, Stann and Hamill stand out, but I feel its not as black and white as that, as he's done pretty well against the upper echelons which deserves credit IMO.



You've lost all credibility by saying he has a win over Hamill with a straight face.

Do you think we have all forgotten the worst decision of all time?



I've just read your other post on the previous page, and you go on about my credibility?
Worst decision of all time, in your eyes perhaps and for your reasons.

Not gonna argue about this anymore- there are such strong prejudices on here against Bisping, it was predictable where this thread would end up.

Stann was/is rated as top ten by a number of mma sites, but no doubt they're wrong.
Wolfenstein
9/24/12 5:21:10PM
A lot of people are beginning to change their tune on him...the biggest reason I think is that he's really one hell of a promoter and pretty funny to boot--maybe a bit of a poor-mans's Chael Sonnen. Although I actually like his trash talk a little better because he's being himself, and Chael is playing a character.

He may not ever be a knockout artist, but he is a very entertaining fighter to watch, and despite not finishing--you look at his opponents afterwards and he does some pretty serious damage to their face.
Wolfenstein
9/24/12 5:29:29PM






Again, I don't hate Bisping. He is right there at the top, but needs to beat a top fighter. I don't see how he jumps the Weidman-Boetsch winner because he beat Stann.


I can tell you exactly how he leap frogs the Weidman vs Boetsch winner. Bisping is a star, and Weidman and Boetsch are not. They lack charisma and are unknown to most casual fight fans. I think you'd be looking at 150K-200K less PPV buys if you give it to the aforementioned winner before Bisping. If they were leap years ahead of Bisping in the rankings, well maybe the UFC would feel some sort of morale obligation--but they're not that far apart so the money matters more.
bigrand826
9/24/12 6:25:37PM

Posted by Wolfenstein







Again, I don't hate Bisping. He is right there at the top, but needs to beat a top fighter. I don't see how he jumps the Weidman-Boetsch winner because he beat Stann.


I can tell you exactly how he leap frogs the Weidman vs Boetsch winner. Bisping is a star, and Weidman and Boetsch are not. They lack charisma and are unknown to most casual fight fans. I think you'd be looking at 150K-200K less PPV buys if you give it to the aforementioned winner before Bisping. If they were leap years ahead of Bisping in the rankings, well maybe the UFC would feel some sort of morale obligation--but they're not that far apart so the money matters more.


I guess I should have clarified. Yeah, I could see that happening, but I would really disagree with it. I don't see how that is warranted from the sport perspective, but I understand that it does happen and could happen here. I just wouldn't agree with that choice.
ghandikush
9/24/12 6:52:49PM

Posted by moob


Posted by ghandikush

Silva beat franklin to hell twice, submitted and rocked Hendo in his prime, brutally knocked out prime Marquardt, knocked out Okami toward the end of his prime, finished Sonnen twice, brutally knocked out Forrest coming right off his title loss, flash knocked out Vitor....

Those are all pretty enduring names in the sport and feel free to tell me about Bispings brutal finish of Chainsaw McCarthy but I just dont think it compares. He beat ONE enduring name I can think of, ONE, and that was Hammil.......

Edit- MAYBE Brian Stann will endure, MAYBE



We're not talking about the legitamacy of those Silva has fought, although there is some relevance as there are a decent list of names you've omitted who have a significantly lower pedigree.

Amongst the names he's beaten, I'd say Leben, Stann and Hamill stand out, but I feel its not as black and white as that, as he's done pretty well against the upper echelons which deserves credit IMO.



I only half ass read it I guess... For the record the MW division is much more stacked now then ever. Which almost automatically puts B and C level fighters out of discussion for a shot. Keep winning Bisping.
Cooler
9/24/12 7:15:20PM

Posted by moob


Posted by Cooler


Posted by moob

Amongst the names he's beaten, I'd say Leben, Stann and Hamill stand out, but I feel its not as black and white as that, as he's done pretty well against the upper echelons which deserves credit IMO.



You've lost all credibility by saying he has a win over Hamill with a straight face.

Do you think we have all forgotten the worst decision of all time?



I've just read your other post on the previous page, and you go on about my credibility?
Worst decision of all time, in your eyes perhaps and for your reasons.

Not gonna argue about this anymore- there are such strong prejudices on here against Bisping, it was predictable where this thread would end up.

Stann was/is rated as top ten by a number of mma sites, but no doubt they're wrong.



A few sites, but who cares, Stann didn't beat anyone to deserve it.

And how is that not the worst decision? maybe Jung vs Garcia 1 might've been worse. You're the only one with a nationality bias if you can sit there and claim that is a legit win for Mikey. Nobody gives a fuck that mikey is British, again get over it. I don't even hate Bisping, he has grown on me a little but he is a pampered fighter thats for sure. If he actually ran the gauntlet at 185 and fought guys like Vitor, Belcher, Palhares, Weidman, you can bet he wouldn't have such a good record, I mean look at his record, it's mediocre.
Bubbles
9/24/12 9:15:39PM

Posted by bjj1605

You've got a point to an extent. However, it's always hard to look back and decide if a guy earned a shot.

The Top 10 and the upper levels of a division change constantly. Maia beat Sonnen, Quarry, MacDonald, Herman, Jensen, and Miller. Today, only one of those guys would be a top ten (Sonnen), but that is still more top ten wins than Bisping has (which is zero.)

Leites beat Pete Sell, Ryan Jensen, Nate Marquardt, and Drew McFedries. Marquardt is the best guy on that list but again, this record is more impressive than Bisping's.

Cote beat Scott Smith, Kendall Grove, Drew McFedries, and Ricardo Almeida. Almeida is probably his best win on here, but again, better than any win on Bisping's record.

The only one where you MAY have a point is with Travis Lutter but even then he beat Patrick Cote before he got a shot (and this was a special circumstance because of the TUF Comeback show.)

At MW Bisping has beaten Charles McCarthy, Jason Day, Chris Leben, Denis Kang, Dan Miller, Akiyama, Jorge River, Jason Miller, and now Brian Stann. I think the best wins on here are Leben and Stann (both stylistically favorable to Bisping.)


Dan Miller is a better win than everyone on Leites and Cote's list, except Marquardt, but even that was on a technicality. Under similar logic Hamill beat Jones. Brian Stann > Dan Miler > everyone else
Budgellism
9/24/12 9:36:22PM
Bisping is very talented but fact of the matter is he is on a 1 fight win streak over a top 15 guy and has never in his career beaten a top 5 (or 10 imo) fighter. Star or not, he'd get wrecked by Anderson Silva and he hasn't earned the chance at it yet. Should he beat a top 5-10 guy in his next fight than maybe I'd side with him getting a shot.
george112
9/24/12 9:44:10PM

Posted by Budgellism

Bisping is very talented but fact of the matter is he is on a 1 fight win streak over a top 15 guy and has never in his career beaten a top 5 (or 10 imo) fighter. Star or not, he'd get wrecked by Anderson Silva and he hasn't earned the chance at it yet. Should he beat a top 5-10 guy in his next fight than maybe I'd side with him getting a shot.




Agreed.


Anderson isn't going to be beat by a striker. Bisping is right up Anderson's alley.

Anderson via easy devasting KO
bjj1605
9/25/12 10:02:08AM

Posted by Cooler

Chris Leben, not a top 10, never was, bisping jabbed and ran the whole night



Wasn't he ranked in the top ten prior to losing to Anderson Silva?

I could be wrong. I wish we still had that feature that let you look up rankings by date.
ghandikush
9/25/12 10:16:18AM

Posted by bjj1605


Posted by Cooler

Chris Leben, not a top 10, never was, bisping jabbed and ran the whole night



Wasn't he ranked in the top ten prior to losing to Anderson Silva?

I could be wrong. I wish we still had that feature that let you look up rankings by date.



He was close to, if not, fighting for a number 1 contender. He beat Jorge Rivera, Jorge Santiago, and Patric Cote among others, 5-0 since Ultimate Fighter, and was fighting Anderson Silva on TV.

He was top 15 in the world, top 3-5 in the UFC.

By the time he fought Bisping he was probably number 13-15 in the UFC, guys like Swick, Lutter, and Quarry were all still active and ahead of him in rankings I believe.
Chael_Sonnen
9/25/12 3:07:23PM
He'll be a fan favorite the day Soccer is relevant in America.

He'll be a fan favorite the day Tennis is watched by more than 10 people.

I wonder if BigBadAl is jealous of Bisping's white teeth

For the love of The Queen, just let him fight Weidman ASAP!
prophecy033
9/25/12 3:12:19PM

Posted by Poor_Franklin


Posted by Wallass

All I have to say is that I called him overrated for years but his last two fights have shut me up and although I may not cheer him that I no longer boo him and give him credit where credits due.




Much like Jones, I have no respect for them as people but they can fight. Jones is a beast and Bisping has had some good recent performances although he needs to fight and beat top 10 guys on the regular
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