Lindland's Excuses

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Gogoplata
4/15/07 12:04:30AM
What was up with Lindland and his excuses after the fight, talking about Fedor grabbing onto the ropes and blaming the fact that Fedor landed on top on him grabbing the ropes.

Take a page out of GSP's fight, say the better fighter won, you trained hard, you'll come back strong. Lindland said he heard his arm and elbow pop, snap, and crackle and that it had never done that before.

I was rooting for him at the beginning but afterward he made an ass of himself.
richieb19
4/15/07 12:37:41AM
Sorry but you couldnt be more wrong... Fedor definatly cheated and grabbed the ropes, which gave him a huge advantage cause Lindland has doulbe underhooks...
Gogoplata
4/15/07 1:11:06AM

Posted by richieb19

Sorry but you couldnt be more wrong... Fedor definatly cheated and grabbed the ropes, which gave him a huge advantage cause Lindland has doulbe underhooks...



I understand that Fedor used the ropes to his advantage, I'm not blind. But Lindland doesn't have to act like a baby afterward making excuses. Grabbing onto the ropes is a gut reaction, it's not like Fedor hung onto them for extended periods of time. To blame the loss on that one thing is asinine. Sure, it contributed to the loss but in the end, he had no answer for Fedor passing his guard at will and then let him get an arm.
kerazzle
4/15/07 1:14:52AM

Posted by Gogoplata


Posted by richieb19

Sorry but you couldnt be more wrong... Fedor definatly cheated and grabbed the ropes, which gave him a huge advantage cause Lindland has doulbe underhooks...



I understand that Fedor used the ropes to his advantage, I'm not blind. But Lindland doesn't have to act like a baby afterward making excuses. Grabbing onto the ropes is a gut reaction, it's not like Fedor hung onto them for extended periods of time. To blame the loss on that one thing is asinine. Sure, it contributed to the loss but in the end, he had no answer for Fedor passing his guard at will and then let him get an arm.


Exactly, I mean its not as if Fedor cheated an armbar, He instinctively grabbed the ropes, every fighter does it because its a natural reaction. Maybe Matt should have been ready for having a bigger guy ontop of him.
richieb19
4/15/07 1:15:06AM

Posted by Gogoplata


Posted by richieb19

Sorry but you couldnt be more wrong... Fedor definatly cheated and grabbed the ropes, which gave him a huge advantage cause Lindland has doulbe underhooks...



I understand that Fedor used the ropes to his advantage, I'm not blind. But Lindland doesn't have to act like a baby afterward making excuses. Grabbing onto the ropes is a gut reaction, it's not like Fedor hung onto them for extended periods of time. To blame the loss on that one thing is asinine. Sure, it contributed to the loss but in the end, he had no answer for Fedor passing his guard at will and then let him get an arm.

Wrong, Fedor did hold on to the ropes for an extended period of time, and although you are right about it having no bearing on Fedor passing Lindland's guard, it could have made a difference if Matt, a greco silver gold medalist, would have gotten top control...

Also I didnt see it as Matt making excuses... he just pointed out something that shouldnt of happened...
kerazzle
4/15/07 1:16:00AM
a lot of people at sherdog are bashing Fedor now, it's pretty unbelievable.
Gogoplata
4/15/07 1:24:01AM

Posted by kerazzle

a lot of people at sherdog are bashing Fedor now, it's pretty unbelievable.



Bashing Fedor? Craziness. Crazy what one fight can do to a fanbase.

And Richie, I understand where you're coming from. It probably doesn't come off well after Lindland loses, either, he was clearly upset with himself and what had just happened. Like he said, he was embarassed which is understandable. He's got huge balls to be able to move up two weight classes and then fight the best guy at that weight class.

kerazzle
4/15/07 1:24:54AM

Posted by Gogoplata


Posted by kerazzle

a lot of people at sherdog are bashing Fedor now, it's pretty unbelievable.



Bashing Fedor? Craziness. Crazy what one fight can do to a fanbase.

And Richie, I understand where you're coming from. It probably doesn't come off well after Lindland loses, either, he was clearly upset with himself and what had just happened. Like he said, he was embarassed which is understandable. He's got huge balls to be able to move up two weight classes and then fight the best guy at that weight class.



Yea there are threads saying hes a cheater and that he can't KO ppl
Trapt1nw0nder
4/15/07 4:48:50AM
I have not seen the fight yet,but if he did hold the ropes the way i see it on my mind,to control position,then its a shame......Fedor cheating against Lindland is like Michael Jordan playing 1 on 1 with a Midget!(even though fighting a MW is cheating enough)....His next fight better be against a top 5 HW or i will lose all my respect for him..

anyone know where i can see the fight?....
Svartorm
4/15/07 4:54:49AM
I haven't seen it either, but being as theres at least discussion on whether it was intentional or not, I can't see it as being malicious. When Gilbert Yvel fought Don Frye, no one said "I don't think Gilbert did that on purpose." It was obvious to everyone watching that he did.

From the discussion I've seen, most people aren't sure if his arm got caught or he hooked it. I haven't seen reference to him holding with his hand at all either. I'm sure I'll see it on Youtube eventually and be able to see what the big deal is about.
kerazzle
4/15/07 5:06:07AM

Posted by Trapt1nw0nder

I have not seen the fight yet,but if he did hold the ropes the way i see it on my mind,to control position,then its a shame......Fedor cheating against Lindland is like Michael Jordan playing 1 on 1 with a Midget!(even though fighting a MW is cheating enough)....His next fight better be against a top 5 HW or i will lose all my respect for him..

anyone know where i can see the fight?....


Well the reason why he fought Lindland is because he is an Olympic Medalist and thats huuuge in Russia. It was pretty much for better advertising in Russia.
pv3Hpv3p
4/15/07 5:20:26AM
I just found this thread on Sherdog and it has some pictures of the "ropegrabbing" incident...

If you go about half way down the page, some one posted a gif of it, and you can see the incident...

To me it doesnt seem that Fedor actually grabbed the ropes, but more just had his hand on them and never really graped... Seemed pretty clean to me... Whadayall think?
calcifer
4/15/07 5:51:48AM
heres the vid of the fight

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1pw27_fedor-emelianenko-vs-matt-lindland

in response to lindland whining about grabbing the ropes...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9f5-6iTD00

yeah...

not to mention the fact that lindland admits to not showering for 2 weeks before his fight to try to get an advantage from smelling bad.

and one last point...

fedor was just trying to save lindland from hurting himself... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZyMnUkCEeI
Mr_Evans
4/15/07 9:09:22AM

Posted by Trapt1nw0nder

... His next fight better be against a top 5 HW or i will lose all my respect for him..



How can you say that? He's finished or dominated every opponent he has ever faced in his MMA career, and all of a sudden people give him no respect? WTF is up with that?

And before anyone brings up the TK-cut stoppage. He dominated TK up until they decided to call it in TK's favor in Japan. Had it been PRIDE and he was the champion, he would have been given the opportunity to continue in the same way in which a dismantled Wanderlei got to against Cro-Cop.

He got the opportunity, as his contract allowed, to fight in his Mother Russia and to top it off, in front of the President of his country. I'd pass up a fight with Barnett or Nog for that situation in a heart beat.

Let us remember PRIDE was in disarray up until a few weeks ago. Im sure like every other fighter, Fedor is eager to see what comes of this 'new' PRIDE. In the meantime, now that this Lindland situation is done for now, I'm sure a rematch will come of this very very minor controversy, he will get back to the business of his PRIDE situation.

Give the man a break.
Kudos
4/15/07 11:44:23AM
I've seen worse cage grabbing in the UFC. So what if Lindland have a top position? Reversal have a lot in MMA. Fedor train in Sambo, they are specialist in reversal. Nog/Hunt/Herring all have top position on Fedor before and couldn't win. Fedor can armbar you from guard or mount.

Why didn't anyone complain how suck Matt is when someone is on top of him or not trying to get back to the feet? Matt barely did anything on the ground but just holding Fedor down.
roadking95th
4/15/07 1:13:27PM
I am not saying Matt would've won, but grabbing the ropes twice was a huge help to Fedor. The second time Fedor grabbed the ropes Matt had him off of his feet. It was only after Matt set him back down, due to the grabbing of the ropes, did Fedor throw him. I do agree, though, Matt had no answer on the ground with Fedor on top. To say Fedor would've won anyway is ridiculous. We simply won't know that answer now.
dstlvb
4/15/07 1:50:03PM
The first time the ref said something about the ropes Fedor was not grabbing them his elbow was over it. The fact that he was over might have been due to the fact that Matt and Fedor were leaning into the ropes. Matt was trying to sweep the outside leg and naturally leaned to the ropes. The second time Matt had him off his feet his hand was on the rope, how hard he was holding on is open to interputation, but that wasnt the only reason. fedor was also using his legs very well in wrapping them into Matts leg to avoid a takedown. Matt is in there with a much bigger man and a Sambo champion at that. Just because Matt was Silver in Greco doesnt mean he was getting the auto takedown. Looks to me that fedor doesnt really throw Matt as he shifts his weight when Matt tries to throw him to use Matts momentum against him. To lose all respect for a guy over something like this is kinda rediculous

Watched it agian when Matt has him leaning back and going down Fefors hand is on the ropes not grabbing it. Fedor twists and uses his weight to get position
skiba97
4/15/07 1:53:53PM
Matt had fedor off his feet looking for the slam, and fedor clearly grabbed the ropes, stopping matt from taking him down and taking matt down in the process, which lead to the sub. Personally i still think fedor would of won even if matt had got the take down, but you still cant justify what he did, it was cheating. Also, did anybody see how fedor got the cut? was it off that first big punch matt threw? it seemed pretty bad.
Juggernaut
4/15/07 2:08:36PM
it was clear that Fedor knew he was going down and he definately did not want that to happen at all.yeah, Fedor fought some guys in the past that had top position on him but none of them were the caliber of a wrestler Lindland is. and the fact that Lindland is only 185 and picked Fedor up wasily shows he has alot of power to him. holding the ropes has everything to do with who ends up on top and has the dominate position. and also, as it was mentioned earlier, Lindland is an olympic gold mealist and that is a really REALLY BIG deal in Russia so maybe, just maybe, Fedor gave Matt alot of respect in that matter.
VanellaL47
4/15/07 2:10:03PM
Yeah that left straight that Linland threw right off the bat. It sounded like it connected pretty nice.
Mr_Evans
4/15/07 2:10:08PM

Posted by skiba97

Matt had fedor off his feet looking for the slam, and fedor clearly grabbed the ropes, stopping matt from taking him down and taking matt down in the process, which lead to the sub. Personally i still think fedor would of won even if matt had got the take down, but you still cant justify what he did, it was cheating. Also, did anybody see how fedor got the cut? was it off that first big punch matt threw? it seemed pretty bad.



I'm not seeing that anyone is justifying what he did in terms of the natural instinct to reach for something to keep balance.

The big debate is that of whether it was cheating or not on Fedor's behalf. I think to be called a cheater there has to be intent to do so. I honestly believe that Fedor did not purposely set out to use ropes to his advantage in any capactiy. As we have seen many times, Chuck vs Randy, Arlovski vs Pe De Pano, Tim vs Assuerio Silva, natural human instincts set in when a human loses balance.

Intent makes a cheater a cheater, and Fedor is no cheater.
skiba97
4/15/07 2:38:00PM
I dont no how you can say there was no intent. Matt had him off his feet for a good 10 seconds or so, then as he went for the slam that was when fedor grabbed the ropes... its pretty obvious if a wrestler picks you up like that, there going to slam you, So when matt picked fedor up in the first place, how come his reactions didnt make him grab the ropes then? I do agree with you though, grabbing the ropes, cage, whatever, is pretty trivial nowdays and while its cheating it happens all the time. I guess the only reason its getting made a deal of here is becouse fedor is the best pound for pound fighter in the world, and matt was heavey underdog, so thats why people are getting pissed at what fedor did.
Juggernaut
4/15/07 3:07:11PM

Posted by skiba97

I dont no how you can say there was no intent. Matt had him off his feet for a good 10 seconds or so, then as he went for the slam that was when fedor grabbed the ropes... its pretty obvious if a wrestler picks you up like that, there going to slam you, So when matt picked fedor up in the first place, how come his reactions didnt make him grab the ropes then? I do agree with you though, grabbing the ropes, cage, whatever, is pretty trivial nowdays and while its cheating it happens all the time. I guess the only reason its getting made a deal of here is becouse fedor is the best pound for pound fighter in the world, and matt was heavey underdog, so thats why people are getting pissed at what fedor did.



exactly. Fedor is the best heavy weight in the world, so naturally people are going to make a big deal out of him doing anything that may remotely resemble him "cheating" or showing fear. Poeple expect Fedor to prove that he's #1 with his skills, not resulting to holding ropes to prevent a takedown. although some consider Lindland one of the top pfp guys
dstlvb
4/15/07 5:36:25PM
It must just be me when i look at the slow mo replay and freeze it right before the slam Fedors hand seems to be on the rope, not grabbing it, and certenly not for an extended time like some have said. One time the ref said let go of the ropes he wasnt grabbing it, his arm was on there. Right before the slam you can see Fedors palm open to the side. Linland was a Silver medalist in Greco, and Fedor is a Sambo champion. It looked like Fedor ending up on top had more to do with Fedor shifting his weight on a step.
kerazzle
4/15/07 5:50:25PM

Posted by dstlvb

It must just be me when i look at the slow mo replay and freeze it right before the slam Fedors hand seems to be on the rope, not grabbing it, and certenly not for an extended time like some have said. One time the ref said let go of the ropes he wasnt grabbing it, his arm was on there. Right before the slam you can see Fedors palm open to the side. Linland was a Silver medalist in Greco, and Fedor is a Sambo champion. It looked like Fedor ending up on top had more to do with Fedor shifting his weight on a step.


by puttin his hadn on the rope he was able to get his feet on the ground allowing for the reversal and shift in momentum. Anyways i dont understand why ppl are so outraged. the ropes didnt help him attempt submissions. The ropes didnt keep Lindland on his back. The ropes didnt make him tap out. Yes it helped put Fedor in a better position but even if he was on his back Fedor has submissions and Lindland didnt seem to have much of an answer for Fedors sub skills.
Junior24
4/15/07 5:57:56PM
Rematch in a cage!
kerazzle
4/15/07 6:06:46PM

Posted by Junior24

Rematch in a cage!


lol, I doubt ppl want a rematch of this pointless fight.
skiba97
4/15/07 6:47:14PM

Posted by kerazzle


Posted by dstlvb

It must just be me when i look at the slow mo replay and freeze it right before the slam Fedors hand seems to be on the rope, not grabbing it, and certenly not for an extended time like some have said. One time the ref said let go of the ropes he wasnt grabbing it, his arm was on there. Right before the slam you can see Fedors palm open to the side. Linland was a Silver medalist in Greco, and Fedor is a Sambo champion. It looked like Fedor ending up on top had more to do with Fedor shifting his weight on a step.


by puttin his hadn on the rope he was able to get his feet on the ground allowing for the reversal and shift in momentum. Anyways i dont understand why ppl are so outraged. the ropes didnt help him attempt submissions. The ropes didnt keep Lindland on his back. The ropes didnt make him tap out. Yes it helped put Fedor in a better position but even if he was on his back Fedor has submissions and Lindland didnt seem to have much of an answer for Fedors sub skills.



Yeh, the ropes might not of kept matt on his back, but the ropes helped get him their in the first place, if fedor hadnt grabbed the ropes matt would of most likely took him down. Fedor, imo, would still of won the fight at some point, but it wouldnt of ended how it did with the rope grab.
ButterBalls
4/15/07 7:13:36PM
lets be serious here now guys, Lindland wasn't going to beat Fedor. If Fedor would have walked into the ring and shot him with a .45 I would have still probably just said it was inevitable.
Lay_N_Pray
4/15/07 7:31:05PM
While Fedor did have hold of the ropes it did not stop the TAKEDOWN. Lets think about how the physics of things work.

If someone holds onto a rope while they are elevated, which Fedor was for a little while, the rope will merely try to stop the momentum of the slam.

Lindland was walking around with him in the air for a few seconds, I did not see him trying to violently throw Fedor to the floor, which is what you have to do to get him down. So Matt should have been more aggressive in the slam.

The outcome of the fight was not even close to affected by that incident, if you even want to call it that.

Lindland is gutsy for trying, but Fedor can be beat, there is no doubt about that.
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