Jones Files Formal Appeal Over Hamill DQ

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jae_1833
12/15/09 7:18:01PM
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Somehow I feel that this case may actually impact the entire sport of MMA. They have several good points....we'll see.

In the complaint, Ryan Ciotoli and Gary Marino of BombSquad Sports Management called the criteria used to determine whether or not Hamill could continue “flawed,” citing Mazzagatti’s decision to ask Hamill, a legally deaf athlete whose vision had been impaired by blood, “Are you done?” The complaint also claims that proper protocol was not followed, since none of the ringside physicians assessed Hamill’s condition prior to the stoppage.

“If the referee believed that the injury was due to a foul, Mr. Hamill should have been given the appropriate amount of time to recover,” the complaint reads. “At minimum, Mr. Hamill should have had [the] opportunity to clearly understand what was being asked of him and given the ability to respond.”
RhythmAndStyle
12/15/09 7:23:11PM
i do hope that Bones gets the NC..since everything his is sayin is true..once again pointin out that the UFC needs to follow NSCA rules or whoever rule they follow..i think it's different in every state..not like the NFL and make up as you go along(aka the Tom Brady rule)..and everyone sayin that there's no way Jones is gonna get it turned over..think again..i'm pretty damn sure that in the next month or so..it's gonna be over-turned to a NC...
warglory
12/15/09 8:03:58PM
This won't get overturned, nor should it. Jones used an illegal maneuver multiple times, and is responsible for the cuts inflicted which ultimately ended the fight. If there was some debate over the legality of Jones' actions, then I'd completely agree with the idea of challenging, but its absurd and wrong to believe that Jones is above the rules.
submissionartist1
12/15/09 8:33:59PM
The fight should be a no contest the fight should have been stopped hamill not being awarded the win but the fight would be a draw because the initial stopage was for the strike, the condition of hamill would be seen by the ref after .
grappler0000
12/15/09 9:22:43PM

Posted by warglory

This won't get overturned, nor should it. Jones used an illegal maneuver multiple times, and is responsible for the cuts inflicted which ultimately ended the fight. If there was some debate over the legality of Jones' actions, then I'd completely agree with the idea of challenging, but its absurd and wrong to believe that Jones is above the rules.



I don't believe it will be overturned, but there is plenty of reason to challenge it. First of all, the cut was there before the illegal elbows. I've watched it at various speeds a dozen times...and the illegal blows for sure didn't cause it. There are many other questions I'd like to hear answers to as well, but I don't think it will matter in the end.
MisterFreeze
12/16/09 7:46:47PM

Posted by warglory

This won't get overturned, nor should it. Jones used an illegal maneuver multiple times, and is responsible for the cuts inflicted which ultimately ended the fight. If there was some debate over the legality of Jones' actions, then I'd completely agree with the idea of challenging, but its absurd and wrong to believe that Jones is above the rules.




You clearly don't understand the situation. Hamill couldn't continue due to his separated shoulder, not because of the illegal strikes. Hamill himself said the illegal elbows felt no different than the others he was hit with. This fight is definitely a No-Contest.
warglory
12/16/09 8:12:05PM

Posted by MisterFreeze


Posted by warglory

This won't get overturned, nor should it. Jones used an illegal maneuver multiple times, and is responsible for the cuts inflicted which ultimately ended the fight. If there was some debate over the legality of Jones' actions, then I'd completely agree with the idea of challenging, but its absurd and wrong to believe that Jones is above the rules.




You clearly don't understand the situation. Hamill couldn't continue due to his separated shoulder, not because of the illegal strikes. Hamill himself said the illegal elbows felt no different than the others he was hit with. This fight is definitely a No-Contest.



Dude, leave your patronizing attitude at the door. It wasn't Hammill's decision whether or not to continue the fight. It was ended because of multiple illegal elbows that could have very well aided in the severity of the cus he received. Yes, there was one opened up before the illegal elbows were landed, but he had cuts on both sides of his face, right near his eyes. Because of the nature of the illegal blows, and the location of the cuts being detrimental to his vision (they would have called the fight whether the elbows were illegal or not had the ref not ended it by TKO imo), its a no brainer that Jon Jones be disqualified. It wasn't an accidental low blow that ended the fight, it was an illegal blow thrown multiple times. No contests are reserved for accidental injuries, Jones' actions very much could have done in Hammill, and I don't think anyone has the right to nitpick this. If Jones wanted a clean victory, he should have reeled himself in. He doesn't deserve a NC.
Jesse_Canadian_MMA
12/16/09 10:02:21PM

Posted by warglory


Posted by MisterFreeze


Posted by warglory

This won't get overturned, nor should it. Jones used an illegal maneuver multiple times, and is responsible for the cuts inflicted which ultimately ended the fight. If there was some debate over the legality of Jones' actions, then I'd completely agree with the idea of challenging, but its absurd and wrong to believe that Jones is above the rules.




You clearly don't understand the situation. Hamill couldn't continue due to his separated shoulder, not because of the illegal strikes. Hamill himself said the illegal elbows felt no different than the others he was hit with. This fight is definitely a No-Contest.



Dude, leave your patronizing attitude at the door. It wasn't Hammill's decision whether or not to continue the fight. It was ended because of multiple illegal elbows that could have very well aided in the severity of the cus he received. Yes, there was one opened up before the illegal elbows were landed, but he had cuts on both sides of his face, right near his eyes. Because of the nature of the illegal blows, and the location of the cuts being detrimental to his vision (they would have called the fight whether the elbows were illegal or not had the ref not ended it by TKO imo), its a no brainer that Jon Jones be disqualified. It wasn't an accidental low blow that ended the fight, it was an illegal blow thrown multiple times. No contests are reserved for accidental injuries, Jones' actions very much could have done in Hammill, and I don't think anyone has the right to nitpick this. If Jones wanted a clean victory, he should have reeled himself in. He doesn't deserve a NC.



when Rogan asked if he hurt his shoulder, Hamil said he couldn't defend cause of his dislocated shoulder.
I f Hamil didnt have the dislocated shoulder he woulda continued through those cuts, if he was given 5 minutes and didn't have a dislocated shoulder he woulda fought on but in this case couldn't cause of his shoulder, completely legal toss to the mat that did him in, not the 85 legal elbows and not the 4 illegal ones, this fight was over 3 minutes in and Hamil was dust, the least they can do is rule it a no contest, the least...
MisterFreeze
12/16/09 10:35:59PM

Posted by warglory


Posted by MisterFreeze


Posted by warglory

This won't get overturned, nor should it. Jones used an illegal maneuver multiple times, and is responsible for the cuts inflicted which ultimately ended the fight. If there was some debate over the legality of Jones' actions, then I'd completely agree with the idea of challenging, but its absurd and wrong to believe that Jones is above the rules.




You clearly don't understand the situation. Hamill couldn't continue due to his separated shoulder, not because of the illegal strikes. Hamill himself said the illegal elbows felt no different than the others he was hit with. This fight is definitely a No-Contest.



Dude, leave your patronizing attitude at the door. It wasn't Hammill's decision whether or not to continue the fight. It was ended because of multiple illegal elbows that could have very well aided in the severity of the cus he received. Yes, there was one opened up before the illegal elbows were landed, but he had cuts on both sides of his face, right near his eyes. Because of the nature of the illegal blows, and the location of the cuts being detrimental to his vision (they would have called the fight whether the elbows were illegal or not had the ref not ended it by TKO imo), its a no brainer that Jon Jones be disqualified. It wasn't an accidental low blow that ended the fight, it was an illegal blow thrown multiple times. No contests are reserved for accidental injuries, Jones' actions very much could have done in Hammill, and I don't think anyone has the right to nitpick this. If Jones wanted a clean victory, he should have reeled himself in. He doesn't deserve a NC.




He absolutely deserves a NC. proper protocol was not followed and the whole ending is surrounded with confusion and misunderstanding. Jon Jones was seconds away from a normal TKO victory. At the very least he deserves a NC overturn.
Giant_Ochai
12/17/09 7:32:22PM
A no contest would be the fairest outcome. Either way Jones' career won't suffer.
mkiv9secsupra
12/17/09 7:59:03PM
A NC would be ridiculous. Hamill was struck with illegal strikes and that fact is indisputable. Whether or not he could continue after that due to another injury after that is irregardless.


“If the referee believed that the injury was due to a foul, Mr. Hamill should have been given the appropriate amount of time to recover,”

No that is incorrect. The ref evaluated the situation and determined that the damage done was irreversible and could very possibly influence the outcome of the fight. Jones should get over himself and realize that he lost because he(knowingly or not) cheated.

You cant kick a guy in the balls then expect to be rewarded with a TKO win.....Jones should realize that as well
mkiv9secsupra
12/17/09 8:02:42PM

Posted by MisterFreeze
proper protocol was not followed and the whole ending is surrounded with confusion and misunderstanding. Jon Jones was seconds away from a normal TKO victory. At the very least he deserves a NC overturn.



what proper protocol wasnt followed? Hamill wasnt able to continue after the ILLEGAL strikes. The 5 minutes he could have given hamill is only after he determines if hamill can physically continue.......

EVERY PROTOCOL WAS FOLLOWED
JimiMak
12/17/09 11:24:52PM

Posted by mkiv9secsupra


Posted by MisterFreeze
proper protocol was not followed and the whole ending is surrounded with confusion and misunderstanding. Jon Jones was seconds away from a normal TKO victory. At the very least he deserves a NC overturn.



what proper protocol wasnt followed? Hamill wasnt able to continue after the ILLEGAL strikes. The 5 minutes he could have given hamill is only after he determines if hamill can physically continue.......

EVERY PROTOCOL WAS FOLLOWED



Thank you. Some ppl just don't get it. You hit someone w/ such obviously illegal strikes and the ref rules him unable to continue. Simple DQ. I don't care what Hammill thought was the problem he wasn't ref. He separated his shoulder and continued defending, at least on a level where ref didn't see it as needing to be stopped. The man in charge didn't stop it over the shoulder he stopped it because of illegal blows that he felt left the other fighter unable to continue. Accept it.
juggernautakira
12/18/09 11:01:11AM
EDIT: Not sure why it didnt quote him, but this is for warglory


I agree with you and give you props for it.

This tattling with the rules reminds me of breaking the law is TRULY breaking the law ONLY if you get caught. To hell with that!

Since we are so accustomed to split hairs here, I have a few strands...
Perhaps Hamill dislocated his shoulder by trying to block a 12-6...?
Adrenaline
12/19/09 2:25:58AM
You have all made great points and I have already stated my opinion in another thread but all I have to say is that a "legally deaf person" is still quite capable of tapping out physically and verbally. People need to stop acting like Hammill is handicapped to the point where he can't make his own logical decisions. He is a professional fighter and as intelligent as anyone. This was to all of you that argue that the fight would not have continued regardless of the illegal strikes because he hurt his shoulder prior to that. Hamill did not tap, nor did he give up....hence he was able or at the least willing to continue. Fighters continue to fight after being injured all of the time and its cheap to use Hamill's disability as an argument that he was "done" or that it was somehow his fault that the fight was not stopped earlier. You wouldn't question another fighter for fighting through and injury, you would call it "heart" and not assume that he was an invalid for continuing to fight.


The bottom line for me is that this is a no win situation really. I understand it from both sides. Jones put on a very impressive performance just to lose it based on a rule that is not all that clear. I also see it from Hammil's side. It would not have been fair to him if the fight was stopped after the commission of a foul and the win was awarded to Jones because like I mentioned, Hamill did not tap or give up. People would have been outraged either way.

Personally I think the ref and the commission did an excellent job. If anything there needs to be a clarification of the process of investigating fouls if anything. I think all parties did a great job in the heat of the moment.

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