Should James Toney really be that big of an underdog come Saturday night?

MMAPlayground.com » MMA General » UFC Forum » Should James Toney really be that big of an underdog come Saturday night?
POLL: Is Toney being taken too lightly?
Yes. James Toney has a bigger chance of winning than most think 40% (21)
No. Toney is getting smashed one way or another 56% (29)
I actually pick Toney to win 2% (1)
Undecided 2% (1)
mrsmiley
8/26/10 5:57:08PM


The more I question this fight the more I notice myself giving Toney more of a window of opprotunity to pull off an upset. The biggest reason why I give Toney a larger chance than most seem to be is the fact that Randy's fighting style just seems to be the best matched against Toney, in that Couture loves the clinch. A phase of combat James Toney probably has a decent shot of winning this bout in.

Couture has also made the comment he plans on kicking the hell out of Toneys lead leg. I'm not saying this is a bad idea because any boxer feeling the impact of that kick for the first time in a mma fight will certainly take notice but how many times could Randy expect to pull these kicks off before James unwinds on him?

Keep in mind I still pick Couture to win this fight based on the fact he has much,much,more experince and his wrestling will put James Toney at a severe handicap, but does anyone else think that the boxing champion is being brushed aside too easily?
I see Randy taking it but I wouldn't be suprised if he buckles a time or two if he stays on his feet too long.
SmileR
8/26/10 6:12:35PM
I don't think he is. Toney is a 1 dimensional fighter in modern MMA. I seriously doubt he's had enough experience and training to keep the fight on the feet where he wants it.
He wont be able to keep it standing and once its on the floor or against the cage there is little to nothing that Toney can do that Randy wont be better at and ready for.
People forget Randy has boxed his entire life and that is a long, long, long time now. I don't want anyone to get me wrong and think I'm saying Randy stands a chance against Toney boxing but its not like Toney brings anything that will blow Randy's mind.
What I'm trying to say is its harder for Toney to land shots when Randy knows how to block them and then how to capitalize on the openings they leave.

Randy is a huge favorite for a reason and this fight will show why boxers are no longer the most dangerous men on the planet.
BlueSkiesBurn
8/26/10 6:30:46PM
There's a real simple answer to this question...yes.

As SmileR stated Toney isn't going to overwhelm Randy in the stand up game. Sure, his boxing is better, but not to the point where Randy won't be able to overcome and change the plan on Toney. I'm pretty sure that everyone will agree that there's only two ways Toney wins this fight...in theory.

A.) He catches Couture coming in

B.) Couture does the stupidest thing ever and decides to stand and trade with Toney rather than take him down and pound him out.
TheGodfather1024
8/26/10 6:38:52PM
If this was years ago i would say no chance but randy's chin is suspect ;)
DCRage
8/26/10 7:23:58PM
I think a lot of these people haven't seen Ray Mercer-Tim Sylvia. I believe and hope Randy will win but obviously Toney has, pun intended, a real puncher's chance. As Mercer demonstrated, one dead-on shot is all it takes.
If nothing else, the odds are so one-sided that, at the very least, taking a small flier on Toney in case the upset happens is not a bad idea. He's still being listed at +450 on some books-put $20 on him and if he wins you just made $90.
BlueSkiesBurn
8/26/10 7:48:11PM

Posted by DCRage

I think a lot of these people haven't seen Ray Mercer-Tim Sylvia. I believe and hope Randy will win but obviously Toney has, pun intended, a real puncher's chance. As Mercer demonstrated, one dead-on shot is all it takes.
If nothing else, the odds are so one-sided that, at the very least, taking a small flier on Toney in case the upset happens is not a bad idea. He's still being listed at +450 on some books-put $20 on him and if he wins you just made $90.



Seriously, did you just compare the mental abilities and skill set of Tim Sylvia to Randy Couture?

I get what you're saying, but Randy and Tim are two TOTALLY different fighters and Randy trains and game plans better than Tim Sylvia EVER could. It's not the same thing. Also, Sylvia likes to stand and trade, that's what he does.
Pookie
8/26/10 8:43:26PM

Posted by BlueSkiesBurn


Posted by DCRage

I think a lot of these people haven't seen Ray Mercer-Tim Sylvia. I believe and hope Randy will win but obviously Toney has, pun intended, a real puncher's chance. As Mercer demonstrated, one dead-on shot is all it takes.
If nothing else, the odds are so one-sided that, at the very least, taking a small flier on Toney in case the upset happens is not a bad idea. He's still being listed at +450 on some books-put $20 on him and if he wins you just made $90.



Seriously, did you just compare the mental abilities and skill set of Tim Sylvia to Randy Couture?

I get what you're saying, but Randy and Tim are two TOTALLY different fighters and Randy trains and game plans better than Tim Sylvia EVER could. It's not the same thing. Also, Sylvia likes to stand and trade, that's what he does.



To play devil's advocate, Couture's Twitch Reflex timing is by far and large less than what tim sylvia works with, and Toney is by far and large a faster more accurate puncher than Mercer.

Taylor8766
8/26/10 9:42:29PM
Yes he is being taken way too litely Toney is a boxing champ/legend and has one punch KO power, giving him a very distinc advantage in the stand-up, I also believe that Randy will get smashed if he trys and stands or trys to dirty box Toney.
BustedKnuckle
8/26/10 11:37:28PM

Posted by DCRage

I think a lot of these people haven't seen Ray Mercer-Tim Sylvia. I believe and hope Randy will win but obviously Toney has, pun intended, a real puncher's chance. As Mercer demonstrated, one dead-on shot is all it takes.
If nothing else, the odds are so one-sided that, at the very least, taking a small flier on Toney in case the upset happens is not a bad idea. He's still being listed at +450 on some books-put $20 on him and if he wins you just made $90.



You really aren't comparing "Capitain America" to "Timmmahh!!" are you!!! I mean Randy is the Godfather of the "Gameplan". James is a very dangerous "striker" in close and throwing from the shoulder. I am sure Randy knows he needs to get Toney to the ground without using the clinch. And he has the skill to do so!! Randy by GnP TKo 1st rnd!!!!!!
grappler0000
8/27/10 12:48:40AM

Posted by Pookie


Posted by BlueSkiesBurn


Posted by DCRage

I think a lot of these people haven't seen Ray Mercer-Tim Sylvia. I believe and hope Randy will win but obviously Toney has, pun intended, a real puncher's chance. As Mercer demonstrated, one dead-on shot is all it takes.
If nothing else, the odds are so one-sided that, at the very least, taking a small flier on Toney in case the upset happens is not a bad idea. He's still being listed at +450 on some books-put $20 on him and if he wins you just made $90.



Seriously, did you just compare the mental abilities and skill set of Tim Sylvia to Randy Couture?

I get what you're saying, but Randy and Tim are two TOTALLY different fighters and Randy trains and game plans better than Tim Sylvia EVER could. It's not the same thing. Also, Sylvia likes to stand and trade, that's what he does.



To play devil's advocate, Couture's Twitch Reflex timing is by far and large less than what tim sylvia works with, and Toney is by far and large a faster more accurate puncher than Mercer.




But on the flip side, Big Tim always lets his opponents land the first punch.
BlueSkiesBurn
8/27/10 2:07:49AM

Posted by BustedKnuckle


Posted by DCRage

I think a lot of these people haven't seen Ray Mercer-Tim Sylvia. I believe and hope Randy will win but obviously Toney has, pun intended, a real puncher's chance. As Mercer demonstrated, one dead-on shot is all it takes.
If nothing else, the odds are so one-sided that, at the very least, taking a small flier on Toney in case the upset happens is not a bad idea. He's still being listed at +450 on some books-put $20 on him and if he wins you just made $90.



You really aren't comparing "Capitain America" to "Timmmahh!!" are you!!! I mean Randy is the Godfather of the "Gameplan". James is a very dangerous "striker" in close and throwing from the shoulder. I am sure Randy knows he needs to get Toney to the ground without using the clinch. And he has the skill to do so!! Randy by GnP TKo 1st rnd!!!!!!



co-signed
Chael_Sonnen
8/27/10 11:39:26PM
Toney is getting smashed one way or another.
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