GSP Serra Ruling

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POLL: What would you rule the GSP Serra (1) outcome?
TKO 70% (39)
Submission (Strikes) 30% (17)
PaleHorse
3/18/08 12:14:31AM
I had no idea until recently that George St. Pierre was actually tapping when Matt Serra mounted him dropping bombs, not that its a huge deal or anything, but I can't tell if that'd be ruled TKO or Submission (Strikes). I think the ref was going to stop it whether George tapped or not, but I'm not sure if he stopped it because George tapped. There is a fine difference between a fighter not wanting to get hit anymore, and a ref stepping in to stop the fight. What do you guys think?
gartface
3/18/08 12:27:16AM
TKO
Diamondback2
3/18/08 12:30:46AM
i just found out about this too. i watched it a couple times and honestly i think the fight should have been ended a second or two earlier.

found it pretty interesting though.
ufcboss
3/18/08 12:57:49AM
He tapped just after it got stopped. On the live broadcast, The refs leg was in the way so you cant see it clearly.

TKO, As much as it kills me to say, Serra TKO'd GSP.
Kpro
3/18/08 1:06:55AM
It was a TKO.

He tapped after the stoppage.
chubbud22
3/18/08 1:25:31AM
He was pretty much out when he tapped tko
Nightmare27
3/18/08 1:38:10AM
tko
whardin19
3/18/08 7:25:53AM
I think it was a TKO also. He was tapping after the stoppage.
Gipper
3/18/08 8:45:24AM
bottom line gsp got beat up by serra.
CornishMMA
3/18/08 8:56:32AM
For it to be a submission you need to tap 3 TIMES with your hand, i havnt looked at it that closely cos it upsets me, but, i dont think he did that and the ref didnt see him and was stopping it anyway
ToeZup
3/18/08 11:43:22AM
I'm going to go with TKO. Both of these guys feel they have something to prove in this fight. It should be a good one.
stock
3/18/08 12:46:43PM
Well, we know that it was technically a TKO (via ref stoppage) since that how it was ruled. The ref was going to stop the fight before he noticed the tapping.

However, for gambling purposes I feel that submission (via strikes) should be counted the same as a TKO.

I think all fights should be ruled one of the following:

Win via submission/choke hold.
Win via strikes/ref stoppage.
Decision.
JimiMak
3/18/08 5:53:11PM


I wish It was bigger but from this it looks like GSP's arms are not tapping, he gives one quick tap and covers up. Mazzagatti seems, to me, to be reacting to that slap he throws. I always thought it was a sub to strikes. I guess maybe Mazzagatti is the only one who knows (since georges was half out and matt was in finishing mode it's quite possible neither of them know)
mrliquid
3/18/08 6:38:35PM
it was a tko his arms were waving around alot but after the ref stopped it I could kinda see GSP tapping the mat but its a non issue cause the fight was already over Serra was getting off him at that point
grappler0000
3/19/08 12:11:10PM

Posted by JimiMak



I wish It was bigger but from this it looks like GSP's arms are not tapping, he gives one quick tap and covers up. Mazzagatti seems, to me, to be reacting to that slap he throws. I always thought it was a sub to strikes. I guess maybe Mazzagatti is the only one who knows (since georges was half out and matt was in finishing mode it's quite possible neither of them know)



There are better video angles out there that show he was definitely tapping...but it's a moot point, since the ref was stepping in to stop it at that point anyway. It wasn't Mazzagatti, it was actually BJM...and if I remember correctly, he commented in an interview saying that he didn't even realize GSP was tapping.
ultimateweapon
3/19/08 9:05:12PM
TKO or submission GSP got beat really looking forward to the rematch
DevonFoxy
3/19/08 9:32:55PM
I personally would rule it a no contest as Serra hit him in the back of the head which is really what resulted into the knock out. What can you do though i would go with TKO for sure in those options.
I will take any bet thrown out there for this next fight. I mean no disrespect to Matt Serra as he threw the punch and it got him and he followed up and put him away but when people say Serra has better stand up than GSP they really are off the mark. Serra was just throwing his fists at GSP when he rocked him there was no form there was just panic and disbelief from what I saw. I could see Serra winning this fight but I would almost bet the house on GSP. The one thing stopping me is that it is in Canada. I don't think pressure is going to be GSP's friend but i still pick him to win.
JimiMak
3/20/08 4:38:43PM

Posted by DevonFoxy

I personally would rule it a no contest as Serra hit him in the back of the head which is really what resulted into the knock out.



Besides the fact that you give a completely innacurate description of what happened, we've already gone over the whole supposed lucky shot issue a ton of times. What I wanna address here is the idea of intent. If a guy ducks into a punch so it hits him in the back of the head it isn't an illegally thrown blow. BJM has talked a lot about how intent (as viewed at the time by the ref) has a lot to do w/ what we sometimes think are confusing rulings in matches. I know there's a vid, I'll try to find it.
PaleHorse
3/24/08 1:21:55PM

Posted by JimiMak


Posted by DevonFoxy

I personally would rule it a no contest as Serra hit him in the back of the head which is really what resulted into the knock out.



Besides the fact that you give a completely innacurate description of what happened, we've already gone over the whole supposed lucky shot issue a ton of times. What I wanna address here is the idea of intent. If a guy ducks into a punch so it hits him in the back of the head it isn't an illegally thrown blow. BJM has talked a lot about how intent (as viewed at the time by the ref) has a lot to do w/ what we sometimes think are confusing rulings in matches. I know there's a vid, I'll try to find it.



That'd be great if you could link the video, I'm pretty intrigued by this whole situation right now. As for the back of the head thing, no, just no. I keep hearing lucky punch I keep hearing back of the head, Serra won it as fair as a fighter can win a fight, while it may have been disbelief that GSP went down so quickly, one thing you have to remember is that GSP has not been up against a ton of strikers even close to his caliber, so not a whole lot is even known yet about his ability to take a punch, if you watch the BJ fight it seems like if BJ hadn't have gassed and kept his standup at the level it was when GSP was bloodied up, BJ would have finished him. Serra has already stated that the last guy to take it to GSP was BJ, and BJ has definately been the only thing close to a victory over GSP without the victory being flat out (Serra/Hughes). I also hate to bring this up you guys but you look at their lifestyles growing up, Serra grew up in New York, I almost guarantee he was getting into fights as a kid growing up, GSP grew up in Canada... where if you don't make the hockey team apparantly you fight in MMA. (JOKE) If you guys watch the OLD OLD UFC fights, you'll see that Tito Ortiz was pretty dominant too, until Frank Shamrock punched him in the face.
jocka
3/24/08 7:15:22PM

Posted by PaleHorse


Posted by JimiMak


Posted by DevonFoxy

I personally would rule it a no contest as Serra hit him in the back of the head which is really what resulted into the knock out.



Besides the fact that you give a completely innacurate description of what happened, we've already gone over the whole supposed lucky shot issue a ton of times. What I wanna address here is the idea of intent. If a guy ducks into a punch so it hits him in the back of the head it isn't an illegally thrown blow. BJM has talked a lot about how intent (as viewed at the time by the ref) has a lot to do w/ what we sometimes think are confusing rulings in matches. I know there's a vid, I'll try to find it.



That'd be great if you could link the video, I'm pretty intrigued by this whole situation right now. As for the back of the head thing, no, just no. I keep hearing lucky punch I keep hearing back of the head, Serra won it as fair as a fighter can win a fight, while it may have been disbelief that GSP went down so quickly, one thing you have to remember is that GSP has not been up against a ton of strikers even close to his caliber, so not a whole lot is even known yet about his ability to take a punch, if you watch the BJ fight it seems like if BJ hadn't have gassed and kept his standup at the level it was when GSP was bloodied up, BJ would have finished him. Serra has already stated that the last guy to take it to GSP was BJ, and BJ has definately been the only thing close to a victory over GSP without the victory being flat out (Serra/Hughes). I also hate to bring this up you guys but you look at their lifestyles growing up, Serra grew up in New York, I almost guarantee he was getting into fights as a kid growing up, GSP grew up in Canada... where if you don't make the hockey team apparantly you fight in MMA. (JOKE) If you guys watch the OLD OLD UFC fights, you'll see that Tito Ortiz was pretty dominant too, until Frank Shamrock punched him in the face.



lol am not sure what difference it makes that serra grew up in new york and gsp in montreal please explain
Pookie
3/24/08 7:19:25PM
As much of a generalization as it may be... its been re-affirmed by many canadians that canada has basically no crime.
jocka
3/24/08 7:40:21PM
lol thats funny you have to be americain to say something like that am sorry to bust your bubble but there is no place on earth where violence is not present now am not saying that their is more crime/violence in montreal than new york was i was asking is what difference does it make?
Pookie
3/24/08 7:48:01PM

Posted by jocka

lol thats funny you have to be americain to say something like that am sorry to bust your bubble but there is no place on earth where violence is not present now am not saying that their is more crime/violence in montreal than new york was i was asking is what difference does it make?



I know man, but it kind of does make a difference in the mentality you face life with.
Whether that effects you're performance in the cage is up for debate, but yeah... im sure you caught my drift.
bls1919
3/24/08 11:48:02PM
Either way it gets chalked up. GSP got his face smashed by Serra and i loved it. Sorry GSP faithful but he isn't invinceable(sp) the terror fucd him up and is going to submit him in the next fight. Serra by rear naked or armbar 3rd
jocka
3/25/08 7:44:54AM

Posted by Pookie


Posted by jocka

lol thats funny you have to be americain to say something like that am sorry to bust your bubble but there is no place on earth where violence is not present now am not saying that their is more crime/violence in montreal than new york was i was asking is what difference does it make?



I know man, but it kind of does make a difference in the mentality you face life with.
Whether that effects you're performance in the cage is up for debate, but yeah... im sure you caught my drift.



i know exactly what you mean its just the way i understood the other guy is like he was commparing your environement to the way you can take apunch which i though was hilarious
jgtribbett
3/25/08 9:39:23PM

Posted by CornishMMA

For it to be a submission you need to tap 3 TIMES with your hand, i havnt looked at it that closely cos it upsets me, but, i dont think he did that and the ref didnt see him and was stopping it anyway



thats funnny. upsets you.. thats howi've felt about hendo for the last 6months haha
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