GSP ranked #1 WW in the world by MMAweekly and Sherdog
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GSP ranked #1 WW in the world by MMAweekly and Sherdog
DevonFoxy
1/5/08 10:55:06PM
Posted by Tailgunner
Posted by DevonFoxy
Fact of the matter is I really feel GSP's stand up is not nearly as good as people believe and Serra has better hands on him no matter what the reach.
Goes to the ground i think gsp has the advantage in GnP not jits but he can prolly GnP him to a win or lay on him trying to finish him and go to a UD.
I.
How do people come up with this nonsense...
GSP has 5 TKOS and 3 Subs
Serra has 2 TKOS and 1 Sub.
How can anyone think Serra has better hands or ground game than GSP??
The facts are clear GSP is better in EVERY regards and if he didn't lose to Serra we wouldn't even be discussing this.
Well one reason i believe this "nonsense" is because Matt Serra has knocked out GSP Doesn't matter if it would happen again facts are facts.
The reason Serra has a better ground game is because Serra is a BJJ Black Belt and I believe GSP is only a brown belt. Where they both train/trained under Renzo Gracie I would consider Matt to have the advantage on the ground as well so all this
nonsense kind of has some merit to it friend.
tuvok500
1/5/08 10:59:35PM
Posted by Tailgunner
Posted by grappler0000
Posted by NatedawgThaM
Wow, he gets completely killed by Matt Serra and then all of the sudden a win over a past his prime, lost his step, Matt Hughes and that launches him into P4P status?
So, what should happen with Rampage until he avenges the losses to Silva and Shogun? A. Silva doesn't have a squeaky clean record either...so what are you suggesting?
Exactly anyone with a logical thought process would realise that one win or one loss does not add up to the total sum of wins or losses in a fighters career.
Take another look at the theory some of you are proposing, say the New England patriots would have lost to the Miami dolphins would you say the Dolphins should be ranked above the Pats because of one win??
No you wouldn't because each teams record defines where they get ranked, just like in MMA!!!!
Its not that difficult if you really try and use logic to understand how a "ranking" system works.
Serra doesn't belong in the top five IMHO and in the opinions of most MMA fighters.
Next year at this time you won't even read about Matt Serra on ANY mma forum.
MMA is not football man ...
The fighters are not schedule to fight 16 fights like in a round robin against 16 fighters and at the end of the year you have a ranking base on the result of every fights !! lol
it is 1 fights at the time, you lose you go down, you win you go up, you beat the champ , you are the champ, you lose 2 in a row you are in trouble, no matter if you were 15-0 between 2000 and 2006 !!!
why the text look like a quote ??
Tailgunner
1/5/08 11:04:02PM
Posted by DevonFoxy
Posted by Tailgunner
First of all Serra DID not knock GSP out pal......He hit GSP in the back of the head 3 times and then attacked him while he had him dazed, for all this BS talk of Serras suppossed heavy hands why could't Serra knock out GSP after hitting him directly in the head about 30 times????
The ref stopped the fight, its called a TKO friend!!! NOT A KO!!!
And if Serras BJJ is SO MUCH better than GSP's then why does GSP have more Sub finish's than Serra??
Sorry but Serras luck has run out and everyone here will see how outclassed Serra really is!!
Just for the record a knockout is what Gonzaga did to Crocop, sh*t Shonie Carters spinning backfist was MORE of a true knockout than what Serra did to GSP.
Go watch the fight again and come back and call it a KO.
DevonFoxy
1/5/08 11:14:52PM
I wasn't attacking you by any means and KO/TKO I meant that he lost after standing with Serra so i apologize but i feel you knew what i meant.
I am by no means pulling for Serra either but the facts are facts. Just because a guy doesn't submit some one doesn't and one guy does doesn't mean the other person has better jits.
Serra is a black belt and GSP is a brown belt and they are under the same BJJ practitioner.
Matt Serra TKO'ed GSP
Those are facts my friend and thats all i was saying i understand GSP is your favorite fighter but to deny that Matt Serra has a better ground game then GSP is pretty laughable IMO and you seem to be blinded by the GSP band wagon.
I am by no means pulling for Serra either but the facts are facts. Just because a guy doesn't submit some one doesn't and one guy does doesn't mean the other person has better jits.
Serra is a black belt and GSP is a brown belt and they are under the same BJJ practitioner.
Matt Serra TKO'ed GSP
Those are facts my friend and thats all i was saying i understand GSP is your favorite fighter but to deny that Matt Serra has a better ground game then GSP is pretty laughable IMO and you seem to be blinded by the GSP band wagon.
jay98107
1/5/08 11:23:30PM
Why on earth does this topic have so many responses? Serras #1 ranking was nonsense in the first place. Firstly, In the past 4 years he had beaten Lytle questionably, Menjivar, and Curran. None of these guys were top 10 WW at the time of the fights, and Serra had also been completely dominated by Parisyan. Then a punchers chance come true against GSP vaults him from top 15 to #1 in one fell swoop. The reason it was done was obviously because Serra had beaten the #1, and the "to be the best you have to beat the best" mentality was used. However, how could Serra be put above Parisyan although he lost? Sure it was two years prior, but if that type of logic is going to be used you may as well do it across the board regardless of timing. This argument may not make sense as its pretty hard to present it in text form, but in the end the point im trying to make is that one victory does not erase whats happened in the past, especially if it was from one punch. I won't call it a fluke because that takes a lot away from Serra and has a negative connotation, and Serra won that fight fair and square. Id just like to hear the Serra should be #1 arguments when he starts beating other fighters in the top 10.
Tailgunner
1/5/08 11:31:03PM
Posted by DevonFoxy
I wasn't attacking you by any means and KO/TKO I meant that he lost after standing with Serra so i apologize but i feel you knew what i meant.
I am by no means pulling for Serra either but the facts are facts. Just because a guy doesn't submit some one doesn't and one guy does doesn't mean the other person has better jits.
Serra is a black belt and GSP is a brown belt and they are under the same BJJ practitioner.
Matt Serra TKO'ed GSP
Those are facts my friend and thats all i was saying i understand GSP is your favorite fighter but to deny that Matt Serra has a better ground game then GSP is pretty laughable IMO and you seem to be blinded by the GSP band wagon.
No apology need we just have a different view of these things, its all good. But just because one martial artist has a black belt and one has a brown belt doesn't
mean squat in an MMA fight.
Also the fact that GSP has more sub victories than Serra speaks louder than any belt system. Alot of martial art practioners don't always attain their black belts when their level of fighting and knowledge would say otherwise.
Belts don't mean jacksh*t in the REAL world of MMA, they may indicate someone trained LONGER but they don't always mean one fighter is better than another.
Look at the Chase beebe fight against Rani Yahya, Chase dominated an Abu Dhabi champion, a BJJ black belt with more wins and International credentials than Serra, yet Chase beat him on the ground.
Like I said belts don't mean much in an MMA fight.
I
Porch28
1/5/08 11:36:53PM
Truth hurts and until GSP beats Serra, Serra is better!!!!! Too many people want him to be great maybe he won't be he didn't even defend his title where as Hughes did 9 times. Those are the facts!!!!!
jay98107
1/5/08 11:38:51PM
Posted by Porch28
Truth hurts and until GSP beats Serra, Serra is better!!!!! Too many people want him to be great maybe he won't be he didn't even defend his title where as Hughes did 9 times. Those are the facts!!!!!
Truth hurts and until Serra beats Parisyan, Parisyan is better!!!!! Too many people think that one victory completely makes your ranking as opposed to winning time and time again like Hughes did, defending his title nine times in the process. Those are the facts!!!!!
Tailgunner
1/6/08 12:00:33AM
Posted by Porch28
Truth hurts and until GSP beats Serra, Serra is better!!!!! Too many people want him to be great maybe he won't be he didn't even defend his title where as Hughes did 9 times. Those are the facts!!!!!
Well according to your logic GSP is better than Serra cause GSP beat BJ Penn and Karo and they both beat Serra.
Oh and Shonie Carter must be better than GSP cause he beat Serra, and Wandy is better than Chuck cause he beat Rampage and on and on..........
Seriously I can't effing wait until April when Serra gets mauled and all the serranuthuggers fade away into obscurity just as fast as Serra does.
jay98107
1/6/08 12:20:16AM
Posted by Tailgunner
Posted by Porch28
Truth hurts and until GSP beats Serra, Serra is better!!!!! Too many people want him to be great maybe he won't be he didn't even defend his title where as Hughes did 9 times. Those are the facts!!!!!
Well according to your logic GSP is better than Serra cause GSP beat BJ Penn and Karo and they both beat Serra.
Oh and Shonie Carter must be better than GSP cause he beat Serra, and Wandy is better than Chuck cause he beat Rampage and on and on..........
Seriously I can't effing wait until April when Serra gets mauled and all the serranuthuggers fade away into obscurity just as fast as Serra does.
There aren't even truthful Serra huggers, they are just converted Hughes huggers who are happy to see GSP lose and have a facade of Serra huggership.
tuvok500
1/6/08 1:13:28AM
Posted by Tailgunner
Posted by Porch28
Truth hurts and until GSP beats Serra, Serra is better!!!!! Too many people want him to be great maybe he won't be he didn't even defend his title where as Hughes did 9 times. Those are the facts!!!!!
Well according to your logic GSP is better than Serra cause GSP beat BJ Penn and Karo and they both beat Serra.
Oh and Shonie Carter must be better than GSP cause he beat Serra, and Wandy is better than Chuck cause he beat Rampage and on and on..........
Seriously I can't effing wait until April when Serra gets mauled and all the serranuthuggers fade away into obscurity just as fast as Serra does.
I am a Serra's haters to tell you the truth, but when it come to the result of a championship fight, i will not go blindly and act like if Serra did not beat GSP just because i love GSP.
The key here is that a fight is a fight, it is not a 4 of 7, if i beat you and you were the champ , i become the champ even if you have beated a lot more top fighters than me.
and the champ is on top of the ranking in any sport that i can think about.
when GSP was the champ , he was ranked #1, when Hughes was the champ he was ranked #1, so Serra is the champ he is #1 in the ranking.
the only argument that you can make is " well, the WW champ of cage rage is better than Serra i think, so i put him in front of Serra , but GSP will stay below Serra because he fight in the same organization and there are not 2 champs per division, even if the interim belt is close to, it is still only an interim belt.
this argument was made a long time ago, with the result that you have guys who refuse to rank a fighter according to his last fight (in opposite to the real world ) and there are others like me who accept the result of any fight and are following a fairplay ranking base on that.
do you know that there are a lot of poeples who have Shogun still ranked ahead of Forrest !!
Funny that it is in fact Forrest who won the fight and who is rank # 1 contender and who will fight Rampage after the TUF 7 series.
so , if Shogun was really still in front of Forrest , he would have the first shot on Rampage !! lol
quezocrema0032
1/6/08 1:44:50AM
IDC what neone says ... i think st pierre is scared of serra abit ... well maybe not scared but sence that KO st pierre has been scared 2 stand wit people ... if ur scared to stand wit hughes and KOS theres a prob so this fight i look for stpierre to take down serra and win a descsion ... but he wont run through serra nor will he stand wit him 
cmill21
1/6/08 2:49:28AM
I cannot agree that one win makes you automatically become a better fighter. Thats what your saying, you guys that have Serra #1 and GSP #2 your saying Serra's a better fighter. He is not. Who does he have wins against that would make him a top 10 besides GSP? No one. I feel the same way for Forrest, GG, Kongo, ect. They need more then one win(all each of them have) to be in the top 5. One impressive win, sure you may crack the top 10, but if you have a nice big win your not a better fighter, you might have been better that night, the other guy could be injured a million different things but to me, the repetative act of kicking ass is waaay more important then when some guy beats you once.
Snowstud0101
1/6/08 3:55:24AM
Hey I think Mr smiley has it right on the nuts!!!!
mrsmiley
1/6/08 6:42:48AM
Thank you!
Porch28
1/6/08 9:18:11AM
Posted by Tailgunner
Posted by Porch28
Truth hurts and until GSP beats Serra, Serra is better!!!!! Too many people want him to be great maybe he won't be he didn't even defend his title where as Hughes did 9 times. Those are the facts!!!!!
Well according to your logic GSP is better than Serra cause GSP beat BJ Penn and Karo and they both beat Serra.
Oh and Shonie Carter must be better than GSP cause he beat Serra, and Wandy is better than Chuck cause he beat Rampage and on and on..........
Seriously I can't effing wait until April when Serra gets mauled and all the serranuthuggers fade away into obscurity just as fast as Serra does.:shoots
That isn't my logic I was saying exactly what your trying to pin on me and that is if rankings meant a damn thing then Serra should not have beat GSP and GSP should never have beat Hughes but they did and that brings me back to my point that RANKINGS DON'T MEAN SQUAT!!!!!!!!! Thats my logic. Don't be mad a me because your boy lost be mad and him. I respect both fighters tremendously and I'm tired of listening to people who don't know anything about MMA(I'm not saying your one of them).Maybe Serra is that good. By the way I'm a Fitch hugger
Darnok
1/6/08 12:54:57PM
I always had GSP at the top. Serra may have fluked out and got the belt but that doesn't make him the best. To be the best you must beat the best and do it more often then the guy who did it once.
And if Serra wins this time I will make Serra #1 but until he can prove it wasn't a fluke than I wont.
And if Serra wins this time I will make Serra #1 but until he can prove it wasn't a fluke than I wont.
NatedawgThaM
1/6/08 2:00:52PM
Posted by Tailgunner
Posted by grappler0000
Posted by NatedawgThaM
Wow, he gets completely killed by Matt Serra and then all of the sudden a win over a past his prime, lost his step, Matt Hughes and that launches him into P4P status?
QUOTE]
So, what should happen with Rampage until he avenges the losses to Silva and Shogun? A. Silva doesn't have a squeaky clean record either...so what are you suggesting?
Exactly anyone with a logical thought process would realise that one win or one loss does not add up to the total sum of wins or losses in a fighters career.
Take another look at the theory some of you are proposing, say the New England patriots would have lost to the Miami dolphins would you say the Dolphins should be ranked above the Pats because of one win??
No you wouldn't because each teams record defines where they get ranked, just like in MMA!!!!
Its not that difficult if you really try and use logic to understand how a "ranking" system works.
Serra doesn't belong in the top five IMHO and in the opinions of most MMA fighters.
Next year at this time you won't even read about Matt Serra on ANY mma forum.
There losses were years ago. Im talking recently since recently GSP got named the pound for pound best and he's one of the pound for pound best with the more recent loss and hasn't avenged it yet and I think they should have least made him avenge it first.
We all know he's going to win but I don't think a win over a past his prime Hughes is all that great. A win over Kos who isn't top 5 isn't all that great.
Tailgunner
1/6/08 2:14:35PM
Posted by NatedawgThaM
We all know he's going to win but I don't think a win over a past his prime Hughes is all that great. A win over Kos who isn't top 5 isn't all that great.
Why do people keep saying Hughes is past his prime??? He is only 34 years old and Serra is 33. Chuck is 38, Randy is well into his 40's are they past their prime too??
No I don't think Hughes or Chuck or Randy are past their prime, its just GSP is so much better than the entire WW division that he MAKES Hughes seem washed-up.
Hughes and Serra are basically the same age and when you compare Hughes stellar career to Serras so-so career it is painfully obvious that Hughes is/was/going to continue to be a better fighter than Serra by far.
Considering Hughes and Serra are the same age how can ANYONE claim Serra is better than Hughes??? They can't because Hughes has accomplished more in his career than Serra could ever dream of and thats a fact.
GSP is gonna finish Serra, then Hughes is gonna finish Serra and then we will never hear from Serra again.
shawneth
1/6/08 2:36:53PM
Posted by Tailgunner
Posted by NatedawgThaM
We all know he's going to win but I don't think a win over a past his prime Hughes is all that great. A win over Kos who isn't top 5 isn't all that great.
Why do people keep saying Hughes is past his prime??? He is only 34 years old and Serra is 33. Chuck is 38, Randy is well into his 40's are they past their prime too??
Hughes may be young, but he has had alot of fights in his years and his body must be pretty warn down from it. Lots of people say Wanderlei Silva is past his prime(up for debate though still) and he is still quite young. BUt Wanderlei's body has taken some punishment in its time and it may not function the way it used.
Couture is just an animal and thats why he's still kicking, I Honestly do beleive that Chuck has passed his prime now. With all of the shots that he delivered Wanderlei in their fight and couldnt put him to sleep, one year ago those punches would have knocked Wanderlei out. But i think chuck is getting old and losing KO power.
jiujitsufreak74
1/6/08 3:11:02PM
rankings are all about perspective, that is why everyone disagrees and why they are not reliable. people like me and tuvok believe that the champ at the time has to be number one because he is the current top dog of the best competition and until he is dethroned he is number 1. others base their rankings on their perspective of fighter's skill and they rank GSP ahead of serra abd shogun ahead of forrest etc...everyone will disagree so lets all agree to disagree because this can be argued either way but no one will truly change their opinion
Copenhagen
1/6/08 4:13:25PM
IMO your not a champion until you defend your title and win.
jgtribbett
1/7/08 12:26:23AM
Posted by Tailgunner
GSP has knocked Serra off the number 1 position FINALLY, I wonder where Serra will rank after he loses to GSP and then Hughes?
#3
untile karo and fitch win big fights
therionace
1/7/08 5:35:47PM
Until gsp redeems himself against serra, then serra is the legitimate number one ww. i'm a big gsp fan, but what if serra has his number? I doubt it though. i think gsp will keep it standing and return the ko. then gsp should fight fitch and serra should fight hughes.
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