Fox TV UFC Producers Told Joe Rogan To Tone It Down

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bjj1605
3/24/12 4:17:38PM

Posted by grappler0000


Posted by scpd400

Rogan could quit or get fired he would not be missed. He is not an unbiased announcer. I don't like him at all. He should call the fight and not trash the fighter. IMO



Out of curiosity, who do you feel he has trashed?



I was going to ask the same thing.

I don't think I've ever heard him trash a fighter.
Bubbles
3/24/12 6:46:45PM
clearly its Rampage
Bubbles
3/24/12 6:47:28PM

Posted by bjj1605
Is it just because you picked Okami, you thought you were on your way to a solid 9 points, and then Boetsch spoiled you plans??



a perfect pick is 11 points
grappler0000
3/24/12 7:51:49PM

Posted by bjj1605


Posted by grappler0000


Posted by scpd400

Rogan could quit or get fired he would not be missed. He is not an unbiased announcer. I don't like him at all. He should call the fight and not trash the fighter. IMO



Out of curiosity, who do you feel he has trashed?



I was going to ask the same thing.

I don't think I've ever heard him trash a fighter.



Yeah, it's one thing to think he is biased, but he is always very complimentary of fighters. I've never heard him trash a fighter, so I'm curious to hear what he has done.
KungFuMaster
3/24/12 10:37:08PM
@Grappler and BJJ - I don't know what spcd400 meant when he wrote what he wrote but in his defense, Rogan does undermine a lot of fighters.

When Rogan is excessively praising one fighter, what is he doing essentially? He is undermining the other fighter. It is not a direct form of trashing but it is or can be a form of indirect trashing. All the while, Goldberg is reading between the lines and knows Rogan is nuthugging too much which is why Goldberg steps in on many occasions to say this, " But as you and I know, Joe, anything can happen in a fight." Immediately following Goldberg's comment, there always seem to be a pause or a sense of reality check on Rogan's part.

Which brings me to my last point - And that is why Rogan and Goldberg are, IMO, the best commentating team. Rogan is the mad man who thinks he knows everything and steers wildly but his partner in crime is always there to steer them back on track.....and then it starts all over again.
grappler0000
3/24/12 11:50:36PM

Posted by KungFuMaster

@Grappler and BJJ - I don't know what spcd400 meant when he wrote what he wrote but in his defense, Rogan does undermine a lot of fighters.

When Rogan is excessively praising one fighter, what is he doing essentially? He is undermining the other fighter. It is not a direct form of trashing but it is or can be a form of indirect trashing. All the while, Goldberg is reading between the lines and knows Rogan is nuthugging too much which is why Goldberg steps in on many occasions to say this, " But as you and I know, Joe, anything can happen in a fight." Immediately following Goldberg's comment, there always seem to be a pause or a sense of reality check on Rogan's part.

Which brings me to my last point - And that is why Rogan and Goldberg are, IMO, the best commentating team. Rogan is the mad man who thinks he knows everything and steers wildly but his partner in crime is always there to steer them back on track.....and then it starts all over again.



You lost me at being biased is essentially the same as trashing. I won't argue about bias, because that is something that is human nature, but also something that is obviously a bit subjective. There is no fine line between that and trashing though. I'd be interested to hear what someone has considered trashing by Joe. I mean, without changing the meaning of the word, I just don't see it. As always though, I am open to someone giving examples. But to say that those two are equal would also imply that all commentators trash fighters. And I don't agree with that whatsoever.

On a sidenote, I think you are giving Goldy way too much credit.
KungFuMaster
3/25/12 1:22:17AM

Posted by grappler0000


Posted by KungFuMaster

@Grappler and BJJ - I don't know what spcd400 meant when he wrote what he wrote but in his defense, Rogan does undermine a lot of fighters.

When Rogan is excessively praising one fighter, what is he doing essentially? He is undermining the other fighter. It is not a direct form of trashing but it is or can be a form of indirect trashing. All the while, Goldberg is reading between the lines and knows Rogan is nuthugging too much which is why Goldberg steps in on many occasions to say this, " But as you and I know, Joe, anything can happen in a fight." Immediately following Goldberg's comment, there always seem to be a pause or a sense of reality check on Rogan's part.

Which brings me to my last point - And that is why Rogan and Goldberg are, IMO, the best commentating team. Rogan is the mad man who thinks he knows everything and steers wildly but his partner in crime is always there to steer them back on track.....and then it starts all over again.



You lost me at being biased is essentially the same as trashing. I won't argue about bias, because that is something that is human nature, but also something that is obviously a bit subjective. There is no fine line between that and trashing though. I'd be interested to hear what someone has considered trashing by Joe. I mean, without changing the meaning of the word, I just don't see it. As always though, I am open to someone giving examples. But to say that those two are equal would also imply that all commentators trash fighters. And I don't agree with that whatsoever.

On a sidenote, I think you are giving Goldy way too much credit.



I didn't say being biased is the same as trashing. I said and I quote, " When Rogan is excessively praising one fighter, he is essentially undermining the other fighter."
grappler0000
3/25/12 1:43:57AM

Posted by KungFuMaster

I didn't say being biased is the same as trashing. I said and I quote, " When Rogan is excessively praising one fighter, he is essentially undermining the other fighter."



Which you went on to say and I quote, "is or can be a form of indirect trashing".
KungFuMaster
3/25/12 1:17:02PM

Posted by grappler0000


Posted by KungFuMaster

I didn't say being biased is the same as trashing. I said and I quote, " When Rogan is excessively praising one fighter, he is essentially undermining the other fighter."



Which you went on to say and I quote, "is or can be a form of indirect trashing".



Yes, I did say that - but never saying they were the same.

Let us assume you have been moderating this site for years now. If we were to talk about all the moderators of this site and I keep hugging cowcatcher's nuts without saying anything else about any of the other moderators, how would that make you feel?
grappler0000
3/25/12 2:31:32PM

Posted by KungFuMaster


Posted by grappler0000


Posted by KungFuMaster

I didn't say being biased is the same as trashing. I said and I quote, " When Rogan is excessively praising one fighter, he is essentially undermining the other fighter."



Which you went on to say and I quote, "is or can be a form of indirect trashing".



Yes, I did say that - but never saying they were the same.



Actually, that is what was said.

You said that by Rogan praising one fighter, he is undermining the other. And then said that by undermining the one fighter, it is or can be a form of trashing. Therefore there's a transitive relation between being biased and trashing fighters...according to you. This isn't rocket surgery, my friend. It's logic 101.
KungFuMaster
3/25/12 2:59:01PM

Posted by grappler0000


Posted by KungFuMaster


Posted by grappler0000


Posted by KungFuMaster

I didn't say being biased is the same as trashing. I said and I quote, " When Rogan is excessively praising one fighter, he is essentially undermining the other fighter."



Which you went on to say and I quote, "is or can be a form of indirect trashing".



Yes, I did say that - but never saying they were the same.



Actually, that is what was said.

You said that by Rogan praising one fighter, he is undermining the other. And then said that by undermining the one fighter, it is or can be a form of trashing. Therefore there's a transitive relation between being biased and trashing fighters...according to you. This isn't rocket surgery, my friend. It's logic 101.



Yes, there is definitely a relationship between being biased and trashing which I tried to convey to you. So what's the problem here? Are you not agreeing that being biased can translate to trashing?

In the scenario about the moderators, if I excessively praise cowcatcher and if I was the only one allowed to comment about the moderators, the rest of you would, at the very least, feel I do not like you. Am I right?

KungFuMaster - 2

Grappler - 0

grappler0000
3/25/12 3:25:27PM

Posted by KungFuMaster

Yes, there is definitely a relationship between being biased and trashing which I tried to convey to you. So what's the problem here? Are you not agreeing that being biased can translate to trashing?

In the scenario about the moderators, if I excessively praise cowcatcher and if I was the only one allowed to comment about the moderators, the rest of you would, at the very least, feel I do not like you. Am I right?



Without changing the definition of 'trashing', no. Trashing is most certainly not the same as not complementing. Are you kidding me? I praise the PG all the time and say it's the best MMA website on the net. So, by your reasoning, I have trashed every other MMA website out there. If that makes sense to you, there's no point in me continuing the conversation.
KungFuMaster
3/25/12 3:35:50PM
Praising one entity does not always translate to insulting the others. If that makes sense to you, then we can conclude our discussion.
grappler0000
3/25/12 4:05:56PM

Posted by KungFuMaster

Praising one entity does not always translate to insulting the others. If that makes sense to you, then we can conclude our discussion.



I agree with the above statement. An insult can be implied/inferred though. Trashing cannot. That's the key difference.
bjj1605
3/25/12 4:39:30PM
I've got to agree with Grappler.

If someone is praising one person and ignoring the other, it might be irritating....but that doesn't mean he's trashing the other person.

Take your example.

Someone praises cowcatcher and only cowcatcher. That might hurt emfleek's feelings. But does that mean you are "trashing" emfleek?

Absolutely not.
Bubbles
3/25/12 5:51:03PM
sorry KFM, but you are wrong
KungFuMaster
3/25/12 7:09:23PM

Posted by Bubbles

sorry KFM, but you are wrong



That's really going to convince me.
KungFuMaster
3/25/12 7:30:37PM

Posted by bjj1605

I've got to agree with Grappler.

If someone is praising one person and ignoring the other, it might be irritating....but that doesn't mean he's trashing the other person.

Take your example.

Someone praises cowcatcher and only cowcatcher. That might hurt emfleek's feelings. But does that mean you are "trashing" emfleek?

Absolutely not.



If someone praises cowcatcher and only cowcatcher, it does not necessarily mean he or she is trashing emfleek. On the other hand, it does not necessarily mean he or she is not trashing emfleek either.

This argument is pointless because you two are refusing to admit the fact that in certain circumstances, a person can be trashed even if nothing is said about him. I don't have to necessarily say anything bad about a person to offend him.

Let's make this more intimate.

If you and grappler were fighting and I am the commentator and I consistently, and excessively praise grappler throughout the fight, how would you feel? I'm not verbally trashing you but you will definitely think I am a jerk, will you not?
Shawn91111
3/25/12 7:37:17PM

Posted by KungFuMaster


Posted by bjj1605

I've got to agree with Grappler.

If someone is praising one person and ignoring the other, it might be irritating....but that doesn't mean he's trashing the other person.

Take your example.

Someone praises cowcatcher and only cowcatcher. That might hurt emfleek's feelings. But does that mean you are "trashing" emfleek?

Absolutely not.



If someone praises cowcatcher and only cowcatcher, it does not necessarily mean he or she is trashing emfleek. On the other hand, it does not necessarily mean he or she is not trashing emfleek either.

This argument is pointless because you two are refusing to admit the fact that in certain circumstances, a person can be trashed even if nothing is said about him. I don't have to necessarily say anything bad about a person to offend him.

Let's make this more intimate.

If you and grappler were fighting and I am the commentator and I consistently, and excessively praise grappler throughout the fight, how would you feel? I'm not verbally trashing you but you will definitely think I am a jerk, will you not?



Yes
KungFuMaster
3/25/12 7:54:08PM

Posted by Shawn91111


Posted by KungFuMaster


Posted by bjj1605

I've got to agree with Grappler.

If someone is praising one person and ignoring the other, it might be irritating....but that doesn't mean he's trashing the other person.

Take your example.

Someone praises cowcatcher and only cowcatcher. That might hurt emfleek's feelings. But does that mean you are "trashing" emfleek?

Absolutely not.



If someone praises cowcatcher and only cowcatcher, it does not necessarily mean he or she is trashing emfleek. On the other hand, it does not necessarily mean he or she is not trashing emfleek either.

This argument is pointless because you two are refusing to admit the fact that in certain circumstances, a person can be trashed even if nothing is said about him. I don't have to necessarily say anything bad about a person to offend him.

Let's make this more intimate.

If you and grappler were fighting and I am the commentator and I consistently, and excessively praise grappler throughout the fight, how would you feel? I'm not verbally trashing you but you will definitely think I am a jerk, will you not?



Yes



Let's make a poll to see who is the bigger jerk.
bjj1605
3/25/12 7:55:28PM

Posted by KungFuMaster


Posted by bjj1605

I've got to agree with Grappler.

If someone is praising one person and ignoring the other, it might be irritating....but that doesn't mean he's trashing the other person.

Take your example.

Someone praises cowcatcher and only cowcatcher. That might hurt emfleek's feelings. But does that mean you are "trashing" emfleek?

Absolutely not.



If someone praises cowcatcher and only cowcatcher, it does not necessarily mean he or she is trashing emfleek. On the other hand, it does not necessarily mean he or she is not trashing emfleek either.

This argument is pointless because you two are refusing to admit the fact that in certain circumstances, a person can be trashed even if nothing is said about him. I don't have to necessarily say anything bad about a person to offend him.

Let's make this more intimate.

If you and grappler were fighting and I am the commentator and I consistently, and excessively praise grappler throughout the fight, how would you feel? I'm not verbally trashing you but you will definitely think I am a jerk, will you not?



Jerk, yes.

Trashing, no.

Its not one and the same man. You have to see that.
KungFuMaster
3/25/12 7:59:47PM

Posted by bjj1605


Posted by KungFuMaster


Posted by bjj1605

I've got to agree with Grappler.

If someone is praising one person and ignoring the other, it might be irritating....but that doesn't mean he's trashing the other person.

Take your example.

Someone praises cowcatcher and only cowcatcher. That might hurt emfleek's feelings. But does that mean you are "trashing" emfleek?

Absolutely not.



If someone praises cowcatcher and only cowcatcher, it does not necessarily mean he or she is trashing emfleek. On the other hand, it does not necessarily mean he or she is not trashing emfleek either.

This argument is pointless because you two are refusing to admit the fact that in certain circumstances, a person can be trashed even if nothing is said about him. I don't have to necessarily say anything bad about a person to offend him.

Let's make this more intimate.

If you and grappler were fighting and I am the commentator and I consistently, and excessively praise grappler throughout the fight, how would you feel? I'm not verbally trashing you but you will definitely think I am a jerk, will you not?



Jerk, yes.

Trashing, no.

Its not one and the same man. You have to see that.



But would you agree there is a relationship between the two?
KungFuMaster
3/25/12 8:01:37PM

Posted by bjj1605



Its not one and the same man. You have to see that.



I never said it was the same.
Pookie
3/25/12 8:03:59PM
Joe is only Human. Everyone in his position is going to have blind spots in their knowledge/performance.

I'll catch myself saying the things Rogan says either right before or right after, all the time. I think he does fine. I feel as though i know a shit ton about this sport(), but i still don't outperform him even without the pressure of a live audience.
bjj1605
3/25/12 8:06:15PM

Posted by KungFuMaster


But would you agree there is a relationship between the two?



Well this thread has been totally hijacked...

Might as well continue now.

"Relationship" maybe....in that trashing is something negative and ignoring a person can also be negative.

But trashing is a very specific word referring to a very specific action.

I wouldn't agree with anything like what you said in your original post.

It seems to me that you often start with outlandish-way-out-there statements and then back away from them slowly until your position has morphed into something no one could disagree with.

"Relationship" is so far removed from your original "indirect trashing" that I don't see how you can pretend you were arguing the same thing then that you are now.
Bubbles
3/25/12 8:07:22PM

Posted by KungFuMaster


Posted by Bubbles

sorry KFM, but you are wrong



That's really going to convince me.



why should I have to reiterate what grappler and bjj have already said? they have laid out their arguments and points very soundly and I agree with them. I don't have more to add and I don't like to parrot people either.
bjj1605
3/25/12 8:12:54PM

Posted by KungFuMaster


Posted by bjj1605



Its not one and the same man. You have to see that.



I never said it was the same.



Your original words

"When Rogan is excessively praising one fighter, what is he doing essentially? He is undermining the other fighter. It is not a direct form of trashing but it is or can be a form of indirect trashing."

When you say indirect trashing, you're still saying its trashing.

You also say "essentially." I for one believe in using words carefully.

"Essentially" means "in essence" or "at the most basic level." Its like saying "despite appearances."

Whatever, this is a boring conversation and I think everyone is sick of it.

I know you well enough not expect you to concede.
KungFuMaster
3/25/12 8:16:48PM

Posted by bjj1605


Posted by KungFuMaster


But would you agree there is a relationship between the two?



Well this thread has been totally hijacked...

Might as well continue now.

"Relationship" maybe....in that trashing is something negative and ignoring a person can also be negative.

But trashing is a very specific word referring to a very specific action.

I wouldn't agree with anything like what you said in your original post.

It seems to me that you often start with outlandish-way-out-there statements and then back away from them slowly until your position has morphed into something no one could disagree with.

"Relationship" is so far removed from your original "indirect trashing" that I don't see how you can pretend you were arguing the same thing then that you are now.



I am not retracting by any means. My original post was meant to say exactly that..

Do you not think there are levels of trashing? You and grappler are defining the word 'trashing' with absolute meanings and I am trying to convince you there are forms and levels of trashing - severe all the way down to minute....and one way to do so can be done without actually verbalizing it.
cowcatcher
3/26/12 9:55:29AM
This thread got really, really good for awhile, then trailed off.
Kpro
3/26/12 11:05:05AM

Posted by cowcatcher

This thread got really, really good for awhile



So you are saying that all other threads got really really bad for a while?
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