Fixed Fights

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johny_rotten
5/2/07 4:51:49PM
A while back when Mark Hominick defeated Yves Edwards as an 6-1 underdog MMA weekly brought up the question "are MMA fights fixed?" If I recall Yves was only making 10k for his fight, but if he put that on Mark to win he would have made 60k. With the current state of "upsets" going down in MMA does anyone suspect foul play? With no real governing body, and the fact that 95% of these events happen in Vegas it is really hard to dismiss this question. MMA weekly also brought up the point that there are lines on all fights on any given UFC card. In boxing there is only usually lines on the top 1-2 fights. The theory there would be the guys in the main event are making enough money to trust they won't throw a fight. While they prelim fighters are making so little it would be very hard to overlook throwing the fight, and cashing in.
nubby
5/2/07 4:54:47PM
If this were the case I would probably stop watching MMA.
hook_tothe_body
5/2/07 4:56:53PM
You never know. You bring up a good point. Fighters that would make more money by throwing a fight, I can see the temptation.

But I don't think fighters throw fights. In the end, the better record you have, the better preformences you have, the more big time fights you get, the more money you make.
scoozna
5/2/07 5:01:31PM

Posted by nubby

If this were the case I would probably stop watching MMA.



I second that...but I'm going to choose to believe that it is untrue.
Lay_N_Pray
5/2/07 5:23:11PM
I would also stop watching, but I would say that doesnt happen.

All disciplines in MMA teach respect, honor, and tradition...all that good stuff. So I think these guys being some of the best in these disciplines would have more self-respect then to stoop that low.

I would say this doesnt happen in the UFC, Pride, or any other 'major' company
Kisame
5/2/07 6:37:52PM
nah I cant see anyone doing that.


First you have to work your ass off to get to that 10k and if you win you will soon be making way more than throwing a fight and risking your whole career for a few extra bucks


Keep winning and sponsors will pay you that 50k extra plus more not including ur fight salary and win bonuses.
Fanboy 1988
5/2/07 6:51:01PM
I saw the payouts for UFC 70 and I was shocked how much Elvis made, according to what I read they paid him 8,000 plus an extra 30,000 for fight of the night bonus... Not saying it was fixed but they paid him a good chunck even though he lost.
Kisame
5/2/07 7:01:32PM

I saw the payouts for UFC 70 and I was shocked how much Elvis made, according to what I read they paid him 8,000 plus an extra 30,000 for fight of the night bonus... Not saying it was fixed but they paid him a good chunck even though he lost.


both fighters get the fight of the night bonus.


and it was fight of the night....


Unless u going werdum -arvolski aka diego vs kos II the non-attacking continues

kongo vs silva the body surfer




The only real nominee was napao vs CC but it was one way domination even more than Bisping-Elvis.
Stickan
5/2/07 7:10:21PM
I wonder if Yves thought getting fractured ribs was worth it. Those body shots were thrown with bad intentions.
shawneth
5/2/07 7:58:35PM
All you people are sayin shit like "Fighters dont throw fights".... but are you forgetting about how that would happen in boxing. Its what killed boxing. Im not saying that its happening in MMA but dont be shocked if you find out otherwise. That Tim Sylvia/Couture fight was alittle fishy.
johny_rotten
5/2/07 8:16:32PM
There are a lot of fights that are very fishy. I am not saying any of these fighters threw the fight, but take a close look at the upsets. Jens Pulver got KOed to 9-1 dog. Jens has been competing in combative sports for years, and never has been KOed by one shot. Mirko Cro Cop has been a pro kickboxer/mma fighter for what 5-8 years, and has only been KOed twice in his life both against huge underdogs. Yves Edwards has been in there with multiple Abu Dhabi champs, and never tapped, but Mark Hominick, a pro kick boxer, taps him out.

Like I said I am not saying any of these guys did this, but if you look at them you have to wonder. Throw in the fact that the majority of them get less than 10k to fight, and have to live and support their family on that money. You can teach anyone integrity all you want, but if his kid is starving a man will put food on the table. On the other end the top payed guys make what 250k a fight. How do you think that stands up to what De La Hoya is going to make in his next fight, and UFC gets more PPV buys then boxing. It is basically the formula that created the Black Sox scandal. An owner, who was very spiteful, was raking in the dough while he was paying the players fractions of what was being brought in. That doesn't sound like anyone who has made a name for him self in mma does it?
richieb19
5/2/07 9:21:34PM

Posted by nubby

If this were the case I would probably stop watching MMA.

I'm sorry to break it to you but theres been plenty of fixed fights and payed-off judges and it's never gonna change no matter the sport... I understand what you mean and where youre coming from, all I can say is remember what the sport is about, and remain a fan because of that alone...
Zvonimir
5/2/07 9:37:33PM
Fixed fights: See any fight with Nobuhiko Takada.
teamquestnorth
5/2/07 11:52:10PM
there been some fixed fights in the ufc like don frye mark hall and anthony macias vs oleg taktarov but those were ten second ankle locks. the upsets that are happening this year are full blown ko's. The fighters who arent making much, "undercard fighters" lets say make 3000 a fight. How much do you think the ufc or certain sharks would be willing to pay them to take a fall? 5 or 10 grand? I dont know about you guys but i wouldnt want to get ktfo on tv in front of 15000 people unless i was getting ATLEAST 50-100,000 dollars.
richieb19
5/2/07 11:56:40PM

Posted by greshamfighter

there been some fixed fights in the ufc like don frye mark hall and anthony macias vs oleg taktarov but those were ten second ankle locks. the upsets that are happening this year are full blown ko's. The fighters who arent making much, "undercard fighters" lets say make 3000 a fight. How much do you think the ufc or certain sharks would be willing to pay them to take a fall? 5 or 10 grand? I dont know about you guys but i wouldnt want to get ktfo on tv in front of 15000 people unless i was getting ATLEAST 50-100,000 dollars.

I call source on Oleg/MadDog
teamquestnorth
5/2/07 11:59:50PM
read "no holds barred" by clyde gentry or watch ufc 6 clash of the titans and jim brown and the other commentators were openly calling it out and they had the same manager.
richieb19
5/3/07 12:09:54AM

Posted by greshamfighter

read "no holds barred" by clyde gentry or watch ufc 6 clash of the titans and jim brown and the other commentators were openly calling it out and they had the same manager.

Thanks I'll get the book.... and rewatch the event, I just recently watched UFC 7 and read beyond the lions den and there seem to be no underones of any works with Oleg... but again, I'll look into it... thanks...
BadSanta
5/3/07 12:51:44AM
There are varying level of degrees of "corruption" in contact sports. It ranges from outright fixes to uneven matchups. I think that the UFC is guilty of the latter but there is absolutely no evidence to prove that any fighters are taking deliberate dives.
rcg916
5/3/07 2:18:10AM
How far is standing up a fighter to achieve a certain situation that benefits your advertising purposes from actually fixing a fight?

I mean, they arent telling people to take dives, but there are obvious injunctions in place to affect the outcome of some fights... Even if it is a subtile (lol) stand up to get Mirko the highlight KO... Wow, that backfired.
johny_rotten
5/3/07 2:53:57AM

Posted by greshamfighter

there been some fixed fights in the ufc like don frye mark hall and anthony macias vs oleg taktarov but those were ten second ankle locks. the upsets that are happening this year are full blown ko's. The fighters who arent making much, "undercard fighters" lets say make 3000 a fight. How much do you think the ufc or certain sharks would be willing to pay them to take a fall? 5 or 10 grand? I dont know about you guys but i wouldnt want to get ktfo on tv in front of 15000 people unless i was getting ATLEAST 50-100,000 dollars.



Say they only get 10k to throw a fight, depending on the bout that could be high or really low. Then you have the guy being a major favorite, so he is probably making at least 10k. You take 20k, and place it on the other guy to win at lets say 6-1 as was the case with Yves, and you just cleared 120k. That is some serious dough for a guy that usually needs 4 fights in the UFC just to make middle class on the social ladder.
hippysmacker
5/3/07 5:33:59AM
I personally don't believe most of the fixed claims in ni holds barred. Good read though. In the old pancrase and a lot of early Japanese orgs. their were a lot of rumors. However, now that the major orgs. aren't connected with Pro wrestling I think it's not happening. Add the major regulations that have been added, and I say no. I think that kind of thing has not happened in a long time , in any major show. Sure, almost anything is possible, but it's so big now that if anything looked really fishy people( especially gamblers) would be screaming to high heaven about it. Also Frye denied it, and when a guy gets beaq real quick it's possible he's trying to save face. To the thread starter could please post a link to this story. I would like to read it. I admit I'm not a big fan of MMAweekly's so called journalism, but I'm kind of surprised I don't remember such an inflammatory article. I check about 10 MMA sites a day multiple times, and I'm bummed I missed the boat on this one.
cowcatcher
5/3/07 5:41:29AM

Posted by hippysmacker

I personally don't believe most of the fixed claims in ni holds barred. Good read though. In the old pancrase and a lot of early Japanese orgs. their were a lot of rumors. However, now that the major orgs. aren't connected with Pro wrestling I think it's not happening. Add the major regulations that have been added, and I say no. I think that kind of thing has not happened in a long time , in any major show. Sure, almost anything is possible, but it's so big now that if anything looked really fishy people( especially gamblers) would be screaming to high heaven about it. Also Frye denied it, and when a guy gets beaq real quick it's possible he's trying to save face.



i completely agree, MMA is not boxing, there arent nearly as many hands in the major orgs cookie jars
Rush
5/3/07 9:44:00AM

Posted by richieb19
.

I call source on Oleg/MadDog



Look at Oleg's face after the fight. The fight was not fixed, but I think Macias intentionally lost. They trained together and I think Macias felt that Oleg had a better chance of winning.

Rush
5/3/07 9:49:23AM

Posted by hippysmacker

I personally don't believe most of the fixed claims in ni holds barred. Good read though. In the old pancrase and a lot of early Japanese orgs. their were a lot of rumors. However, now that the major orgs. aren't connected with Pro wrestling I think it's not happening. Add the major regulations that have been added, and I say no. I think that kind of thing has not happened in a long time , in any major show. Sure, almost anything is possible, but it's so big now that if anything looked really fishy people( especially gamblers) would be screaming to high heaven about it. Also Frye denied it, and when a guy gets beaq real quick it's possible he's trying to save face. To the thread starter could please post a link to this story. I would like to read it. I admit I'm not a big fan of MMAweekly's so called journalism, but I'm kind of surprised I don't remember such an inflammatory article. I check about 10 MMA sites a day multiple times, and I'm bummed I missed the boat on this one.




A lot of the Japanese venues had alleged ties to the yakuza, so it wouldn't shock me if there were some fixes. However, it is Japan and they play by the rules a lot more than they do in North America.

I am a cynical person, and it wouldn't shock me if there are instances (in the UFC or other orgs) of, well lets call them favoured fights, where a certain fighter gets a little more slack from judges and refs.

On one hand, the fans of MMA make it clear that they want certain people to win and by a certain means. MMA is a business like any other and the ultimate goal is to make money.

On the other hand, MMA is so new right now, I can't see the companies taking risks at this point. It would only add more controversy and that is undesired.
Manfred
5/3/07 10:50:09AM

Posted by Zvonimir

Fixed fights: See any fight with Nobuhiko Takada.



Correction, see any WIN by Takada. HIs losses weren't worked.
madmarck
5/3/07 3:09:02PM
I am 99.9 % sure that Hominick/ Edwards was not a fixed fight. Why would a bottom tiered paylevel fighter like Yves making only 10k to show risk throwing a fight. If the UFC ever found out he would never be brought back. Not only that his whole image would be destroyed and any value along with it.
shackle
5/3/07 3:15:29PM
Yeah I have thoughts sometimes that a fight maybe fixed... As someone else here said the randy/tim fight seemed a little fishy to me too.

But I try not to think about these things much. I think it's very rare if it does happen. UFC sure didn't want cro cop getting KO'd seeing how much they are paying him. As for the randy/tim fight they trained together maybe randy knew something we didn't I guess. (he was talking how leg sweeps always worked on tim)

I think the sport over all is pretty legit the worst I see happening is judges calling fights wrong. bonnar vs jarden had to be the worst call i've seen. Fighters can avoid the judges though.
teamquestnorth
5/4/07 8:01:41PM

Posted by hippysmacker

I personally don't believe most of the fixed claims in ni holds barred. Good read though. In the old pancrase and a lot of early Japanese orgs. their were a lot of rumors. However, now that the major orgs. aren't connected with Pro wrestling I think it's not happening. Add the major regulations that have been added, and I say no. I think that kind of thing has not happened in a long time , in any major show. Sure, almost anything is possible, but it's so big now that if anything looked really fishy people( especially gamblers) would be screaming to high heaven about it. Also Frye denied it, and when a guy gets beaq real quick it's possible he's trying to save face. To the thread starter could please post a link to this story. I would like to read it. I admit I'm not a big fan of MMAweekly's so called journalism, but I'm kind of surprised I don't remember such an inflammatory article. I check about 10 MMA sites a day multiple times, and I'm bummed I missed the boat on this one.


alright when I first read that I was skeptical too but after watching tapes and looking around on fightfinder mark hall and don frye fought three times. two of the fights nearly went the distance with mark halls "never say die attitude"Frye was never in any real danger but hall just wouldnt go away. Now all of a sudden its 1996 at the ultimate ultimate and mark hall and don frye have the same manager. tank abbot had already made it to the finals. frye had been in an exhausting war with gary goodrige earlier that night. he still needed to get past mark hall to get to tank. So when the fight starts frye gets a ten second ankle submission something he never does in real fights. I dont doubt at all that he denies it. ps im not taking anything away from don frye hes a terific fighter and ive never heard or suspect that theres ever been any other fixes in his career(mma wise).
loller90278
5/5/07 12:27:01PM

Posted by Manfred


Posted by Zvonimir

Fixed fights: See any fight with Nobuhiko Takada.



Correction, see any WIN by Takada. HIs losses weren't worked.



specifcally: mark coleman vs takada
Stickan
5/5/07 1:25:38PM
If I was Yves and was about to throw a fight. Why the hell would I go get submitted by a guy with barely NO ground experience and by a terrible triangle. Wouldn't the guy throwing the fight want it to look legit?? If I was Yves and I was about to threw that fight I would go down to one of Marks body shots a´la Ruediger.
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