Why is there not a thread about the Ellenberger vs Kampmann stoppage?

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KungFuMaster
6/2/12 3:43:12AM
Ellenberger went down and immediately had both hands up to defend the oncoming barrage. The fight was called the minute the knee landed. The actual stoppage was delayed by approximately a mere second which was the amount of time it took for speedy MazzaRatti to get there. Ellenberger was given no opportunity to DEFEND and RECOVER which is BS because Ellenberger was coherent enough to put up his hands - knowing an onslaught was sure to follow. This means Ellenberger knew where he was. He knew he was in a fight and he knew Kampmann was going to follow him to the ground, all of which demonstrates consciousness, evasive strategy, and most importantly - coherency.

Speedy MazzaRatti needs a governor control.
Pookie
6/2/12 4:06:45AM
First of all, i think everyone here is already aware that Mazzagatti is a sneaky, sneaky bastard. Notice that he had no mustache tonight? That's a sign that the Maz is feeling adventurous, spunky even, and this is a very bad thing. In all honesty, he's simply a wildcard that can't be ignored, and sometimes its best to just make peace with the establishment for the sake of your state of mind.

As to the stoppage, I think it was early. But i also understand why it was stopped, and only half of it has to do with misplaced-mustache sneakiness. Ellenberger ate a solid knee to the chin, a knee to the forehead, and a huge knee on the button. Normally the stache will activate and tickle Maz's nose at the first sign of excitement. This calms him and lets him know that it's important to keep watching. But alas, no stache.

Ellenberger falls, and when he falls, the guy falls like a ton of bricks, and Maz is already rushing in to stop it because he has no nose feelers to keep him aware. At this point, he is a decisive and committed man. Ellenberger throws his hands up, but doesn't do himself any favors by having his head turned away from his opponent. Maz is in rush-mode, and with very little empirical evidence to go off of, and little restraint in general, he stops the fight.

I think the fight would have probably been stopped regardless, but yes. Early stoppage.
aussiemma
6/2/12 4:08:30AM
if you watch it again you will see that ellenberger is clearly out, even after mazzagatti stops it you see ellenberger still out of it with his hands in the same position, but he was clearly out of it dude !
pmoney
6/2/12 4:09:12AM
Gonna have to disagree here KFM. Not on Mazzagati sucking, because he does. Consistently and thoroughly. Same with his brother, same with Kim Winslow. But I think the stoppage tonight was just.

Kampmann has always been a favorite of mine, so I am biased. I have nothing against Ellenberger though, he's a high level, exciting fighter. But all I saw was Jake turtling up. He was already staggering from the right to the forehead that Kampmann landed, and then he ate at least two VERY solid knees to the face/jaw, the last of which dropped him like a sack. Plus Ellenberger has weak cardio, (which is probably why he got dropped in the first place) so if that fight were to go on, I honestly think Kampmann would have just kept the momentum and still finished.

Actually, I think Jake should've shown some class in that in ring interview. He kind of had a bitchy attitude. He got put out with knees much cleaner compared to what he did to Jake Shields, IMO.
aussiemma
6/2/12 4:15:51AM
did you guys see the sam sicilia vs marcello fight ? i think chris tognoni was reffing but it was the latest stoppage i've ever seen in the ufc....marcello took about 8-9 clear shots to the head whilst he was unconsious, im not exaggerating at all, go back and take a look, can't believe no one is talking about this !
KungFuMaster
6/2/12 4:21:46AM

Posted by Pookie

First of all, i think everyone here is already aware that Mazzagatti is a sneaky, sneaky bastard. Notice that he had no mustache tonight? That's a sign that the Maz is feeling adventurous, spunky even, and this is a very bad thing. In all honesty, he's simply a wildcard that can't be ignored, and sometimes its best to just make peace with the establishment for the sake of your state of mind.

As to the stoppage, I think it was early. But i also understand why it was stopped, and only half of it has to do with misplaced-mustache sneakiness. Ellenberger ate a solid knee to the chin, a knee to the forehead, and a huge knee on the button. Normally the stache will activate and tickle Maz's nose at the first sign of excitement. This calms him and lets him know that it's important to keep watching. But alas, no stache.

Ellenberger falls, and when he falls, the guy falls like a ton of bricks, and Maz is already rushing in to stop it because he has no nose feelers to keep him aware. At this point, he is a decisive and committed man. Ellenberger throws his hands up, but doesn't do himself any favors by having his head turned away from his opponent. Maz is in rush-mode, and with very little empirical evidence to go off of, and little restraint in general, he stops the fight.

I think the fight would have probably been stopped regardless, but yes. Early stoppage.



You deserve a prop for this beautifully written post but since MazzaRatti engaged in warp speed tonight - time has reversed itself and my props are no where to be found.
KungFuMaster
6/2/12 4:26:24AM

Posted by pmoney

Gonna have to disagree here KFM. Not on Mazzagati sucking, because he does. Consistently and thoroughly. Same with his brother, same with Kim Winslow. But I think the stoppage tonight was just.

Kampmann has always been a favorite of mine, so I am biased. I have nothing against Ellenberger though, he's a high level, exciting fighter. But all I saw was Jake turtling up. He was already staggering from the right to the forehead that Kampmann landed, and then he ate at least two VERY solid knees to the face/jaw, the last of which dropped him like a sack. Plus Ellenberger has weak cardio, (which is probably why he got dropped in the first place) so if that fight were to go on, I honestly think Kampmann would have just kept the momentum and still finished.

Actually, I think Jake should've shown some class in that in ring interview. He kind of had a bitchy attitude. He got put out with knees much cleaner compared to what he did to Jake Shields, IMO.



Like Pookie said, I too think the fight would have eventually been stopped in favor of Kampmann but it just pisses me off that Speedy MazzaRatti made his decision before Ellenberger hit the ground.
aussiemma
6/2/12 4:31:17AM
how did he make the decision before ellenberger hit the ground ? ellenberger fell to the ground unconsious and mazzagatti called it ? go watch it again man... he was out of it
KungFuMaster
6/2/12 4:31:28AM

Posted by aussiemma

if you watch it again you will see that ellenberger is clearly out, even after mazzagatti stops it you see ellenberger still out of it with his hands in the same position, but he was clearly out of it dude !



He had his hands in defensive mode and kept it there to ensure his safety. When you get rocked, you want to keep defending until you know for sure the coast is clear.
Pookie
6/2/12 4:34:15AM

Posted by KungFuMaster
...it just pisses me off that Speedy MazzaRatti made his decision before Ellenberger hit the ground.




Posted by aussiemma
how did he make the decision before ellenberger hit the ground ? ellenberger fell to the ground unconsious and mazzagatti called it ? go watch it again man... he was out of it



I side with KFM on this point, Maz was rushing in mid-fall. Granted, he may not have made his mind up until it hit the ground, but he certainly looked like he did. Blame the stache.
KungFuMaster
6/2/12 4:35:02AM

Posted by aussiemma

how did he make the decision before ellenberger hit the ground ? ellenberger fell to the ground unconsious and mazzagatti called it ? go watch it again man... he was out of it



Mazzagatti, in his speedy head, had already made the call in his mind when Ellenberger took the last knee. The aftermath of Mazzagatti rushing to the fighters is just the formality - to make it official.
aussiemma
6/2/12 4:38:00AM
guys ellenberger was so out of it come on ! lol, i was rooting for ellenberer too but he was clearly ko'd. wether mazzagatti ran in or what it doesnt matter, go watch it again
Pookie
6/2/12 4:38:06AM

Posted by pmoney

Gonna have to disagree here KFM. Not on Mazzagati sucking, because he does. Consistently and thoroughly. Same with his brother, same with Kim Winslow.
. . .

Actually, I think Jake should've shown some class in that in ring interview. He kind of had a bitchy attitude.



1. Consistently and thoroughly. It's the type of consistency that MMA judging needs.
2. I think you mean Yamasaki's brother, Luigi. And don't you dare talk ill about Mario "Fatality" Yamasaki. Don't you do it.
3. Kim Winslow - jesus fucking christ. How can a woman look like that? And how can a woman who looks like that, still be so incredibly incompetent at her job. You would think her low estrogen levels would make her better at doing a man's job.
KungFuMaster
6/2/12 4:41:53AM

Posted by aussiemma

guys ellenberger was so out of it come on ! lol, i was rooting for ellenberer too but he was clearly ko'd. wether mazzagatti ran in or what it doesnt matter, go watch it again



How about you join my fight camp and we'll discuss it over a few e-beers? Deal?
aussiemma
6/2/12 4:42:39AM

Posted by Pookie



1. Consistently and thoroughly. It's the type of consistency that MMA judging needs.
2. I think you mean Yamasaki's brother, Luigi. And don't you dare talk ill about Mario "Fatality" Yamasaki. Don't you do it.
3. Kim Winslow - jesus fucking christ. How can a woman look like that? And how can a woman who looks like that, still be so incredibly incompetent at her job. You would think her low estrogen levels would make her better at doing a man's job.



loll ! and what is that fucken nose flick she does at the start of every fight ?
Poor_Franklin
6/2/12 4:43:58AM
I'm getting sick of picking against Kampmann & watching the fight & being deceived into believing that i made the right choice in picking against him, only to find out that I was wrong.
Pookie
6/2/12 4:45:01AM

Posted by aussiemma


Posted by Pookie



1. Consistently and thoroughly. It's the type of consistency that MMA judging needs.
2. I think you mean Yamasaki's brother, Luigi. And don't you dare talk ill about Mario "Fatality" Yamasaki. Don't you do it.
3. Kim Winslow - jesus fucking christ. How can a woman look like that? And how can a woman who looks like that, still be so incredibly incompetent at her job. You would think her low estrogen levels would make her better at doing a man's job.



loll ! and what is that fucken nose flick she does at the start of every fight ?



It's to let them know, if you try to escape from her basement, she will find you. And she will pick your nose with her gargoyle fingers.
aussiemma
6/2/12 4:46:14AM

Posted by KungFuMaster


Posted by aussiemma

guys ellenberger was so out of it come on ! lol, i was rooting for ellenberer too but he was clearly ko'd. wether mazzagatti ran in or what it doesnt matter, go watch it again



How about you join my fight camp and we'll discuss it over a few e-beers? Deal?



sorry mate im fine where i am, i never say no to a beer though
aussiemma
6/2/12 4:48:38AM

Posted by Poor_Franklin

I'm getting sick of picking against Kampmann & watching the fight & being deceived into believing that i made the right choice in picking against him, only to find out that I was wrong.



hit the nail on the head. exactly !
Kpro
6/2/12 4:53:05AM
I just watched it in slow motion on my DVR a half dozen times and Jake is not using either hand for any sort of defensive purpose unless holding the spot you got kneed in the face with one hand as you hit the canvas and roll to your side with your eyes closed is defending yourself. Good stoppage for sure.
KungFuMaster
6/2/12 4:57:14AM

Posted by Kpro

I just watched it in slow motion on my DVR a half dozen times and Jake is not using either hand for any sort of defensive purpose unless holding the spot you got kneed in the face with one hand as you hit the canvas and roll to your side with your eyes closed is defending yourself. Good stoppage for sure.



You think you can just come in here and slap some facts around - and kill a thread? I think you need a governor control too.
pmoney
6/2/12 4:57:45AM

Posted by Pookie

1. Consistently and thoroughly. It's the type of consistency that MMA judging needs.
2. I think you mean Yamasaki's brother, Luigi. And don't you dare talk ill about Mario "Fatality" Yamasaki. Don't you do it.
3. Kim Winslow - jesus fucking christ. How can a woman look like that? And how can a woman who looks like that, still be so incredibly incompetent at her job. You would think her low estrogen levels would make her better at doing a man's job.






If I didn't have to spread the love.... Kim Winslow is a

"On the real" though, anyone remember the Shields-Ellenberger fight? I doubt the Juggernaut argued with the stoppage that night. Tonight, Ellenberger got dropped just as bad as Shields, probably worse in my estimation. He was already rocked before he started blocking knees with his face.

For the record, I thought the Shields stoppage was good too.


Posted by Kpro

I just watched it in slow motion on my DVR a half dozen times and Jake is not using either hand for any sort of defensive purpose unless holding the spot you got kneed in the face with one hand as you hit the canvas and roll to your side with your eyes closed is defending yourself. Good stoppage for sure.



all day

This thread has gotten an insane amount of responses for this time of night lol
Pookie
6/2/12 5:03:42AM

Posted by pmoney

He was already rocked before he started blocking knees with his face.



I honestly think that stagger after the short right hand was a balance issue. He was throwing the right hand and got intercepted by the counter, but he had already committed to a flurry before he threw the first punch. So then he wings the follow-up left hook and it goes way wide, he stumbles because his body weight flew in a direction he didn't intend(due to the counter) couple with his equilibrium that had just been jolted a second earlier.
Kpro
6/2/12 5:06:08AM

Posted by Pookie

he stumbles because his body weight flew in a direction he didn't intend



Are you saying Jake is fat? He did have a Tank Abbott look to him tonight.
KungFuMaster
6/2/12 5:07:45AM

Posted by Kpro

I just watched it in slow motion on my DVR a half dozen times and Jake is not using either hand for any sort of defensive purpose unless holding the spot you got kneed in the face with one hand as you hit the canvas and roll to your side with your eyes closed is defending yourself. Good stoppage for sure.



Even-though you have presented these damning facts, that still does not account for Mazzagatti's premature decision for stopping the fight. Mazzagatti made up his mind he will stop the fight while Ellenberger was in mid-air. That is how I saw it.
Kpro
6/2/12 5:11:48AM

Posted by KungFuMaster


Posted by Kpro

I just watched it in slow motion on my DVR a half dozen times and Jake is not using either hand for any sort of defensive purpose unless holding the spot you got kneed in the face with one hand as you hit the canvas and roll to your side with your eyes closed is defending yourself. Good stoppage for sure.



Even-though you have presented these damning facts, that still does not account for Mazzagatti's premature decision for stopping the fight. Mazzagatti made up his mind he will stop the fight while Ellenberger was in mid-air. That is how I saw it.



Begs the question, what if Ellenberger never landed and stayed in mid-air?
pmoney
6/2/12 5:14:26AM

Posted by Pookie

I honestly think that stagger after the short right hand was a balance issue. He was throwing the right hand and got intercepted by the counter, but he had already committed to a flurry before he threw the first punch. So then he wings the follow-up left hook and it goes way wide, he stumbles because his body weight flew in a direction he didn't intend(due to the counter) couple with his equilibrium that had just been jolted a second earlier.



That could indeed be the case. I was surprised he was wobbling after a straight forehead shot. Of course he could have been legitimately rocked, due to the added vulnerability of being caught, fully committed in mid combo... Ah well! I wouldn't be surprised if these two fought again sometime down the road.
KungFuMaster
6/2/12 5:14:38AM

Posted by Kpro


Posted by KungFuMaster


Posted by Kpro

I just watched it in slow motion on my DVR a half dozen times and Jake is not using either hand for any sort of defensive purpose unless holding the spot you got kneed in the face with one hand as you hit the canvas and roll to your side with your eyes closed is defending yourself. Good stoppage for sure.



Even-though you have presented these damning facts, that still does not account for Mazzagatti's premature decision for stopping the fight. Mazzagatti made up his mind he will stop the fight while Ellenberger was in mid-air. That is how I saw it.



Begs the question, what if Ellenberger never landed and stayed in mid-air?



Speedy Mazzagatti would have stopped it anyway. You know he's fast.
Pookie
6/2/12 5:16:42AM

Posted by Kpro


Posted by Pookie

he stumbles because his body weight flew in a direction he didn't intend



Are you saying Jake is fat? He did have a Tank Abbott look to him tonight.



I am saying he's fat.
KungFuMaster
6/2/12 5:23:14AM

Posted by Kpro


Posted by KungFuMaster


Posted by Kpro

I just watched it in slow motion on my DVR a half dozen times and Jake is not using either hand for any sort of defensive purpose unless holding the spot you got kneed in the face with one hand as you hit the canvas and roll to your side with your eyes closed is defending yourself. Good stoppage for sure.



Even-though you have presented these damning facts, that still does not account for Mazzagatti's premature decision for stopping the fight. Mazzagatti made up his mind he will stop the fight while Ellenberger was in mid-air. That is how I saw it.



Begs the question, what if Ellenberger never landed and stayed in mid-air?



Mazzagatti would have matrixed his way there at warp speed and time would slow down for everyone else including Ellenberger and Kampmann. He would then proceed to pull Kampmann away and gently set Ellenberger to the ground. And finally when Mazzagatti slows down to earthling speed, Kampmann will shake his head in disbelief and mumble, " I won?"
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