Dana White slams UFC 131 judging, praises Herb Dean as best in the business

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pmoney
6/12/11 9:28:24AM
VANCOUVER, British Columbia – Another major MMA event, another set of confusing scorecards.

Following Saturday's UFC 131 event in Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada, UFC president Dana White took dead aim at a few judges' decisions he deemed unforgivable while suggesting those officials should not be used in MMA competition ever again.

However, White also laid high praise on one referee from Saturday's card, one the UFC boss said proved once again (well, twice actually) why he's the best in the business.

Article
pmoney
6/12/11 9:43:27AM
I won't argue with DW, Herb is arguably the best in the Business. I would put him and Big John #1a and #1b, kind of interchangeable. Speaking of which, glad to see Big John in the octagon again. Do they only bring him out for Canadian events or do I just not pay attention?

When I heard the judge's scorecards being read for Maia-Munoz and I heard the 30-27, I thought the fix was in! Thought they were going to call it for Maia. But Munoz got the W, so I was pleased. But how ANYONE could score that first round for Munoz.... you have to be mentally deficient to score that.

Didn't see Omigawa-Elkins, unfortunately, missed some FB/YouTube fights this time. Gonna check em out today....
Coreytron
6/12/11 10:20:24AM
Yeah, there is NO way Omigawa lost that fight to Elkins. He barely even got hit. And with the Munoz fight, he should have won 29-28.
grappler0000
6/12/11 11:03:52AM
With the judges having monitors this time around, they really don't have any excuses. It's just further proof that bad judging has been the core issue all along.
simmy
6/12/11 11:13:28AM
Wow, Omigawa absolutely gave Elkins a lesson, I couldnt believe that decision. What a disgrace,but what is really disturbing is it wasn't just one rogue judge, all 3 gave it to Elkins, shocking. Nam Pham said an asian guy can't get no love - after himself, Riki Fukuda's fight with Nick Ring & now Omigawa he might be on to something.
Twenty20Dollars
6/12/11 11:54:36AM
I think Mario is the best ref, but Idk if he ref's much anymore or I just don't notice.
prozacnation1978
6/12/11 12:20:39PM
Even with video monitors in front they can't get the judging right
Very sad!!
hashyandy4
6/12/11 1:35:18PM
Judging was obviously awful last nite, and i would have 2 say that herbie is one of in not the best ref in the game rite now
machodog76
6/12/11 3:08:21PM
Omigawa got screwed I was shocked when I heard the decision.
Svartorm
6/12/11 3:19:11PM
Am I the only one that thought Munoz was faking being hurt to draw Maia in?

He basically got forearm clubbed over the head and the started backpedaling with his right hand back a-la Robbie Lawler. Maia's stand-up is god awful and I don't think that exchange really did anything.
Twenty20Dollars
6/12/11 3:28:09PM
I thought JDS/Carwin fight could have been stopped in the first there, considering other fights had been stopped early, it was similar to Beltran/Rosa.

But, I think ref's give certain guys more time befor they call a fight. JDS was actually looking at the ref like it should be stopped.
Svartorm
6/12/11 3:40:09PM
I just watched Omigawa vs. Elkins and had it 29-28 Elkins. He landed far more punches, won nearly every exchange and pressed the action. 30-27 was terrible, but Elkins should have won it.
simmy
6/12/11 4:56:53PM

Posted by Svartorm

I just watched Omigawa vs. Elkins and had it 29-28 Elkins. He landed far more punches, won nearly every exchange and pressed the action. 30-27 was terrible, but Elkins should have won it.



Lol, there's always one. I don't know about the quality of your TV but on mine Omigawa didn't have a scratch on him but Elkins was a mess. It was another case of the Guida's/Garcia's to me, plenty of huff & puff but not really doing much or causing any damage. Quality over quantity for me every time.
bjj1605
6/12/11 6:18:05PM

Posted by simmy


Posted by Svartorm

I just watched Omigawa vs. Elkins and had it 29-28 Elkins. He landed far more punches, won nearly every exchange and pressed the action. 30-27 was terrible, but Elkins should have won it.



Lol, there's always one. I don't know about the quality of your TV but on mine Omigawa didn't have a scratch on him but Elkins was a mess. It was another case of the Guida's/Garcia's to me, plenty of huff & puff but not really doing much or causing any damage. Quality over quantity for me every time.




Hahaha. You're right. There is always one. That fight should have been scored 30-27 for Omigawa. Elkins didn't win one round, not even close.

Probably the worst decision in the history of the sport. Or at least tied for first.
Kpro
6/12/11 7:08:11PM
Since I only saw the 3rd round I had Omigawa winning 10-9.
Bubbles
6/12/11 7:37:43PM
didnt see the Omigawa fight, but yeah i was really shocked by some of the 30-27s being thrown out there.

Herb is definitely the best/tied for the best in the world with Big John

the one new ref (young black guy) really impressed me. he didnt allow the stalling in any of the fights to go on very long. whether it was on the ground or against the cage, he waited til there was nothing, warned the fighters, and stepped in like 5 seconds later when nothing transpired. i think we have a great new ref in the works

Herb, Big John, Kim Winslow, Yamasaki, and this new guy should be reffing every UFC fight from now on. Miragliotta can fill in on sick days. i dont care or want to see anyone else in the octagon
pmoney
6/13/11 12:17:32AM

Posted by Bubbles

didnt see the Omigawa fight, but yeah i was really shocked by some of the 30-27s being thrown out there.

Herb is definitely the best/tied for the best in the world with Big John

the one new ref (young black guy) really impressed me. he didnt allow the stalling in any of the fights to go on very long. whether it was on the ground or against the cage, he waited til there was nothing, warned the fighters, and stepped in like 5 seconds later when nothing transpired. i think we have a great new ref in the works

Herb, Big John, Kim Winslow, Yamasaki, and this new guy should be reffing every UFC fight from now on. Miragliotta can fill in on sick days. i dont care or want to see anyone else in the octagon



I agree with this 100%

I was never a fan of Miragliotta until Kos-Daley.
"Dude, are you serious?" - while restraining Daley after sucker punch.
KungFuMaster
6/13/11 1:12:05AM
I like Big John, Herb Dean, and Mario Yamasaki. All of them do a great job but I have noticed even those three have missed some questionable calls such as low blows.

But as much as I like them, I know they are human and they have made biased calls.

Randy received a glancing blow from Vitor and Randy started squinting. As I remembered, there were no blood but Big John decided to take a time out and have the doctors look at the eye. Now, Big John may have been proven right in taking the time out because the cut was severe but I question the call because I am not sure he would have done that for another fighter.

If you pay close attention to the referring, some refs will tell a fighter they have up to 5 minutes for receiving an illegal blow while with-holding the information to other fighters. I have seen this many times. Some fighters will receive the info while other fighters are encouraged to continue right away. I understand part of a ref's job is to keep the action going but it is their duty to keep the fighters safe and IMO, it should be mandatory for all refs to inform a fighter he has up to 5 minutes to recover after receiving an illegal blow.

As a ref, you have to keep in mind fighters are in the midst of a war and will probably not make the best or wisest decisions or let alone remember they have 5 minutes to recover.
grappler0000
6/13/11 2:35:21AM

Posted by KungFuMaster

If you pay close attention to the referring, some refs will tell a fighter they have up to 5 minutes for receiving an illegal blow while with-holding the information to other fighters. I have seen this many times. Some fighters will receive the info while other fighters are encouraged to continue right away. I understand part of a ref's job is to keep the action going but it is their duty to keep the fighters safe and IMO, it should be mandatory for all refs to inform a fighter he has up to 5 minutes to recover after receiving an illegal blow.



The confusion is mainly due to misinformation with the fans. It's something that's not well understood by the community as a whole. I'll reveal the secret though - Low blows are treated differently than all other illegal strikes. With a low blow, the fighter has up to 5 minutes to recover at his own discretion. With all other illegal blows, the fighter has up to 5 minutes to recover at the discretion of the ref/doctor. I can understand why it seems inconsistent to many people, but that's the reason for the confusion by fans.
Darnok
6/13/11 11:22:07AM

Posted by simmy


Posted by Svartorm

I just watched Omigawa vs. Elkins and had it 29-28 Elkins. He landed far more punches, won nearly every exchange and pressed the action. 30-27 was terrible, but Elkins should have won it.



Lol, there's always one. I don't know about the quality of your TV but on mine Omigawa didn't have a scratch on him but Elkins was a mess. It was another case of the Guida's/Garcia's to me, plenty of huff & puff but not really doing much or causing any damage. Quality over quantity for me every time.



Make that two. But I never heard any of the commentary cause I was at the fight. So maybe that would change my mind.

KungFuMaster
6/13/11 12:29:01PM

Posted by grappler0000


Posted by KungFuMaster

If you pay close attention to the referring, some refs will tell a fighter they have up to 5 minutes for receiving an illegal blow while with-holding the information to other fighters. I have seen this many times. Some fighters will receive the info while other fighters are encouraged to continue right away. I understand part of a ref's job is to keep the action going but it is their duty to keep the fighters safe and IMO, it should be mandatory for all refs to inform a fighter he has up to 5 minutes to recover after receiving an illegal blow.



The confusion is mainly due to misinformation with the fans. It's something that's not well understood by the community as a whole. I'll reveal the secret though - Low blows are treated differently than all other illegal strikes. With a low blow, the fighter has up to 5 minutes to recover at his own discretion. With all other illegal blows, the fighter has up to 5 minutes to recover at the discretion of the ref/doctor. I can understand why it seems inconsistent to many people, but that's the reason for the confusion by fans.



Thank you, grappler. I did not know that bit of information. But would you agree with me it should be mandatory for all refs to inform the fighters of their allowed time for recovery regardless of whether it is a low blow or another illegal blow?

If a low blow or an illegal blow is committed late in the fight, wouldn't you agree a fighter will probably not make the wisest decision pertaining to when he should continue. He is exhausted. He is not thinking clearly but when he hears the ref ushers him, "Are you ready to go?" - he will simply say yes, let's do this even-though he has not fully recovered from the blow.

grappler0000
6/13/11 4:58:25PM

Posted by KungFuMaster

Thank you, grappler. I did not know that bit of information. But would you agree with me it should be mandatory for all refs to inform the fighters of their allowed time for recovery regardless of whether it is a low blow or another illegal blow?

If a low blow or an illegal blow is committed late in the fight, wouldn't you agree a fighter will probably not make the wisest decision pertaining to when he should continue. He is exhausted. He is not thinking clearly but when he hears the ref ushers him, "Are you ready to go?" - he will simply say yes, let's do this even-though he has not fully recovered from the blow.




From what I've seen, with a low blow, the ref is usually telling the fighters to take their time and you'll often hear refs tell the fighter that they have up to 5 minutes or ask if they're sure that they're ready when they try to blow it off. When he's rushing them, it's because of a different type of foul...and refs generally try to get the action started back up as soon as possible in those situations. They try not to let the fighter take advantage of the situation, which I believe is the fair thing to do. I honestly can't remember any ref ushering a fighter after a low blow though...which would be the only inappropriate time to do so. Also, I'm sure all of this is also explained pre-fight in the locker room, since the ref sits down and talks to the fighters prior to the their fight. I'm sure there have been a couple of mishandled situations along the way somewhere, but generally it's not as bad as perceived. Before I decided to research the 5 minute rule, I was always pissed off over the inconsistencies, but nowadays it all makes much more sense as it's happening, since I know what should be happening as it does.
Svartorm
6/14/11 11:14:14AM

Posted by simmy


Posted by Svartorm

I just watched Omigawa vs. Elkins and had it 29-28 Elkins. He landed far more punches, won nearly every exchange and pressed the action. 30-27 was terrible, but Elkins should have won it.



Lol, there's always one. I don't know about the quality of your TV but on mine Omigawa didn't have a scratch on him but Elkins was a mess. It was another case of the Guida's/Garcia's to me, plenty of huff & puff but not really doing much or causing any damage. Quality over quantity for me every time.



Elkins had one cut caused by a clash of heads. Watch the fight again and actually score it. Fights look a lot different when you're watching them to score them vs watching to be entertained. Elkins landed one-twos all night, while Omigawa just jumped around and switched stance. Looks cool and all, but when you're not landing offense, that doesn't matter.
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