Dana White: Dan Henderson wasn't worth the money and brings nothing to the table

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SmileR
12/7/09 11:13:42PM
"He's happy, but the reality is that I pushed him into signing that deal. I told people over the weekend that he'd sign within the next week. I wanted him to s**t or get off the pot. He was in this limbo forever, and he needed more motivation to make a decision. Do you think that there's any guy we can't get that I want? Other than Fedor [Emelianenko]? So far, he's been the one guy we can't get. But everyone else that we've wanted, we got. If I wanted Dan Henderson, I could've signed him. For the money he wanted, he's not worth it. He's not a big pay-per-view star, he's not a big attraction, and he's not going to sell out arenas. He wants way too much and he doesn't bring anything to the table. Here's the reality: If I wanted him, he'd be in the UFC. It's not like, 'F***, Strikeforce beat me out.' He's been a free agent for a long time. If I wanted him, I would have signed him by now."

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SmileR
12/7/09 11:26:12PM
0 - points for subtly but he's got a point when it comes to PPV sales and marketability. Sadly Hendo is a amazing fighter but a sales dud. I still think the UFC should have held on to him though, letting a top 5 MW and LHW go while M1 -Strikeforce is building its roster is mistake.
submissionartist1
12/7/09 11:30:25PM
^$#%@ dana! hes a #% $&&^ idiot &^89 ^%^$%^* (()*&* dan %$%# strikeforce %#$#$& fedor ,m-1 , fedors managment and alistar overeem.


j/k i like all these guys but thats mor what i expected
Twenty20Dollars
12/7/09 11:33:46PM
Yeah Hendo doesnt bring a loud mouth and cocky attitude like Bisping does. Hendo only brings good wrestling, great power and never been knocked out.

But its all good because I have Showtime.
submissionartist1
12/7/09 11:38:42PM

Posted by Twenty20Dollars

Yeah Hendo doesnt bring a loud mouth and cocky attitude like Bisping does. Hendo only brings good wrestling, great power and never been knocked out.

But its all good because I have Showtime.



i need that and HD NET
EvenFlow
12/7/09 11:38:59PM
Hey, I'm president of the biggest MMA company in the world and everyone who's not on my roster or cant make me big money sucks. Hendo's only one of two guys to win a round versus Anderson in the UFC and he brings nothing to the table....wow

cmill21
12/7/09 11:47:51PM
Hendo brings wins and championship fights. Anderson isn't a huge ppv draw like Randy and Brock, does that mean he'll be let go? Dan was one of the only guys I saw with a chance at beating Andy....oh well now we'll get to see him against Jake, Gegard and Fedor...Wooooooooo hahaha Dana F'd up big.
IriShame
12/8/09 12:48:06AM

Posted by cmill21

Hendo brings wins and championship fights. Anderson isn't a huge ppv draw like Randy and Brock, does that mean he'll be let go? Dan was one of the only guys I saw with a chance at beating Andy....oh well now we'll get to see him against Jake, Gegard and Fedor...Wooooooooo hahaha Dana F'd up big.



Maybe not Randy or Brock but Anderson is becoming a draw in his own right. His fights against Thales Leites and Forrest Griffin both did pretty big numbers.
grappler0000
12/8/09 1:05:40AM

Posted by cmill21

Hendo brings wins and championship fights. Anderson isn't a huge ppv draw like Randy and Brock, does that mean he'll be let go?



Logically speaking, no. According to both of their most recent reported paydays, Henderson already makes 50k more than the champ...and he's asking for a large raise on top of that. Also, as a main event, Anderson has drawn much better numbers recently than Hendo has. His last two PPV's drew 900k and 650k...not too bad, if you ask me lol. So, as long as Anderson has realistic expectations, I would rule that possibility out. I know it was a rhetorical question, but I think it deserved a response nonetheless.
grappler0000
12/8/09 1:07:30AM

Posted by IriShame


Posted by cmill21

Hendo brings wins and championship fights. Anderson isn't a huge ppv draw like Randy and Brock, does that mean he'll be let go? Dan was one of the only guys I saw with a chance at beating Andy....oh well now we'll get to see him against Jake, Gegard and Fedor...Wooooooooo hahaha Dana F'd up big.



Maybe not Randy or Brock but Anderson is becoming a draw in his own right. His fights against Thales Leites and Forrest Griffin both did pretty big numbers.



Yeah, pretty much the only events to outdraw Anderson's last two events are UFC 100, the year end event, GSP vs Penn superfight, and Lesnar.
ncordless
12/8/09 1:21:19AM

Posted by grappler0000


Posted by cmill21

Hendo brings wins and championship fights. Anderson isn't a huge ppv draw like Randy and Brock, does that mean he'll be let go?



Logically speaking, no. According to both of their most recent reported paydays, Henderson already makes 50k more than the champ...and he's asking for a large raise on top of that. Also, as a main event, Anderson has drawn much better numbers recently than Hendo has. His last two PPV's drew 900k and 650k...not too bad, if you ask me lol. So, as long as Anderson has realistic expectations, I would rule that possibility out. I know it was a rhetorical question, but I think it deserved a response nonetheless.



Those numbers are misleading.

It is hard to compare PPV buys in cards where there is more than one marquee matchup. Anderson's fight with Forrest was not the headliner of UFC 101, and it hard to say those buys are the result of just Anderson, Forrest, BJ, or Kenny.

If you do just go buy the numbers of their last fight, then Hendo is gonna come out on top because he fought at 100. Of course, again, doing so would be misleading because Brock and GSP were also fighting on that card.

It is also hard to compare Anderson's headlining gig against Thales and Hendo v. Franklin. Overseas fights tend to not sell PPVs very well at all, so comparing the two isn't really legit because of the circumstances.


That said, I think Hendo was probably asking for more than he is worth in a pure ppv numbers sense. He was coming off a stint on TUF that probably added to his fanbase, but it is hard to know how that would have translated.

Either way, I don't really care if he fights for SF or UFC. There are good fights for him in either org.
grappler0000
12/8/09 2:13:42AM

Posted by ncordless

Those numbers are misleading.

It is hard to compare PPV buys in cards where there is more than one marquee matchup. Anderson's fight with Forrest was not the headliner of UFC 101, and it hard to say those buys are the result of just Anderson, Forrest, BJ, or Kenny.

If you do just go buy the numbers of their last fight, then Hendo is gonna come out on top because he fought at 100. Of course, again, doing so would be misleading because Brock and GSP were also fighting on that card.

It is also hard to compare Anderson's headlining gig against Thales and Hendo v. Franklin. Overseas fights tend to not sell PPVs very well at all, so comparing the two isn't really legit because of the circumstances.


That said, I think Hendo was probably asking for more than he is worth in a pure ppv numbers sense. He was coming off a stint on TUF that probably added to his fanbase, but it is hard to know how that would have translated.

Either way, I don't really care if he fights for SF or UFC. There are good fights for him in either org.



I understand that it's difficult to compare certain aspects. Henderson was not in the main event of 100, which is the reason why I stated specifically that I was comparing both as main event draws...besides, 100 really falls into the same class as the year end Ultimate events anyway. Sure other fighters on the card can play a role in the numbers, but Anderson is definitely pulling his own weight...you just need to analyze what the other fighters bring to the table. And to be honest, I almost forgot that Anderson was the co-main event for 101. Truly, I'd say that the Anderson/Forrest fight sold more tickets than the title fight...a normal title fight for Penn draws 1/3 of PPV buys that 101 did...heck, GSP/Penn II didn't even pull better numbers. If you want a more realistic comparison, take a look at 88 and 97. UFC 88 had Chuck, Rashad, Hendo, and Franklin...it sold 480k. UFC 97 had Anderson, Leites, Chuck, and Shogun...it sold 650k. Add to the fact that Leites is no draw whatsoever and Shogun was still relatively unknown to the US audience, it's hard to deny Anderson his props. 97 may have had a title on the line, but when 1 of those fighters is irrelevant, it doesn't much make a difference...especially when 88 had more big names as well. Over time, Anderson has began pulling in solid numbers, while Hendo is still unproven. Dan's only PPV to do average or above is 100, which would've done extremely well whether he was on it or not. While it's a tough comparison when Hendo is on a European card, one thing I can say is that Hendo didn't bring in any better numbers than Franklin already pulls in regardless of opponent...which still leaves Dan's drawing power as unproven.

cmill21
12/8/09 2:44:06AM
Heres the way I look at it, Dan fought Rich at 97, in Dublin, with Shogun(thats pretty much it) on the card, drew in 320,000 buys which is at least $14400000. Dan and Rich made the UFC that much money pretty much on their own. Why can the UFC not pay their top fighters 300,000 a fight when right now other then end of the year and super bowl shows they're having 1 or 2 good fights on the card? They act like they put 4 great fights on every card, they are looking more and more like boxing. I just wen't through every UFC since 97 and I counted at the top end 3 good fights(because 2 cards had Cro Cop so that makes 3 for me) and many had 1 intriguing fight. IMHO the UFC is ripping people off, I honestly can't believe some people shell out $55 for some of these cards. They are lucky everyone takes what they say as gold and keeps buying these things. I'm not trying to bash the UFC, but when you have the kind of drawing power and make as much as you do off of us, how about doing something for the hard core fan who doesn't want to see Fitch vs Pierce or Couture vs Vera. We keep getting screwed because the UFC can say oh this guy is great he's done this and that and on top of that he's got a cheap contract when we miss out on the truly great fights while all the casuals believe it and we lose the great fighters. Oh well now we might get to see Dan vs Jake, Gegard, Fedor, and manhoef.
Aether
12/8/09 2:56:33AM
I'm starting to wonder how many more big-relatively big names Strikeforce can afford to pick up. Surely they can't keep paying for names like Fedor, Hendo, Arlovski, etc. at the rate that they are.
Drudinh
12/8/09 3:00:36AM
Dana does this to any fighter leaving his org. He loses all respect for them and puts them down. If he gets them back he praises them again. It is a cruel way of running a buisness.
cmill21
12/8/09 3:07:55AM

Posted by Aether

I'm starting to wonder how many more big-relatively big names Strikeforce can afford to pick up. Surely they can't keep paying for names like Fedor, Hendo, Arlovski, etc. at the rate that they are.



I think the difference between these guys and elite/affliction is the fact that they haven't bougt out a bunch of orgs and built around one single fighter and they have CBS. They also did 25 million viewers IRRC.
fonduktoe
12/8/09 3:21:04AM
to say a top 10 mw and lhw brings nothing to the table when you're signing people like phil baroni is hilarious. i wish i knew what hendo was asking for when he was still in negotiations with the ufc to put it in perspective. either way there are good fights for him in strikeforce so it's a win/win for me.
george112
12/8/09 9:36:06AM

Posted by cmill21

Heres the way I look at it, Dan fought Rich at 97, in Dublin, with Shogun(thats pretty much it) on the card, drew in 320,000 buys which is at least $14400000. Dan and Rich made the UFC that much money pretty much on their own. Why can the UFC not pay their top fighters 300,000 a fight when right now other then end of the year and super bowl shows they're having 1 or 2 good fights on the card? They act like they put 4 great fights on every card, they are looking more and more like boxing. I just wen't through every UFC since 97 and I counted at the top end 3 good fights(because 2 cards had Cro Cop so that makes 3 for me) and many had 1 intriguing fight. IMHO the UFC is ripping people off, I honestly can't believe some people shell out $55 for some of these cards. They are lucky everyone takes what they say as gold and keeps buying these things. I'm not trying to bash the UFC, but when you have the kind of drawing power and make as much as you do off of us, how about doing something for the hard core fan who doesn't want to see Fitch vs Pierce or Couture vs Vera. We keep getting screwed because the UFC can say oh this guy is great he's done this and that and on top of that he's got a cheap contract when we miss out on the truly great fights while all the casuals believe it and we lose the great fighters. Oh well now we might get to see Dan vs Jake, Gegard, Fedor, and manhoef.



i have got to agree with you.

Just because dana says that someone isnt worth it doesnt mean there not.its hard not to bad mouth dana but all he does is bad mouth fighters.

im actually glad Strikeforce signed Dan.ive said it before an im still saying it.i want Strikeforce to compete with the UFC.an the more stubborn an greedy dana wants to be.the more successful Strikeforce will become.it just takes time.Strikeforce has been signing pretty recognizable names for some time now.an to be frank about it im excited about it.

The thing i like about Strikeforce is that they actually WANT to make superfights happen.with the DREAM co-promotion ideas they want to set up fights that WE fans want to see.the UFC however doesnt want superfights, what they want is their fighter to reign supreme over everyone...an that just irks me for some reason.
EliasG
12/8/09 10:23:49AM
I find it distasteful that Dana has to trash anyone not immediately with him at all times doing whatever he says. I don't much care for those kind of guys in real, everday life, and I find it in poor taste in his case as well. Dan was nothing but class in his response to Dana and thanked the UFC. Dan hasn't just fought for the UFC, he's fought for everyone and given a lot to MMA, he has earned a measure of respect and dignity.

Dana should say, good bye, he wasn't in our plans and leave it at that. Instead, he feels the need to totally trash a guy who hasn't even spoken badly about him. THis isn't TIto leaving over a bad break up, this is a fighter who negotiated in good faith, you didn't reach agreement and someone else got him---probably for less. That's the way it goes. I doubt you'll see Dan leaving Strikeforce talking crap about Scott Coker either and when/if he does leave SF, Coker will definitely NOT talk badly about him.
EliasG
12/8/09 10:25:45AM
To be quite frank, it will be nice to see Dan now without having to pay 50 for a PPV. I'll get to see him fight some good fights on free Tv. That makes me happy. I expect that you will see a slow trickle of fighters at times to this org. simply because the truth is the UFC is overbooked and is putting on too many shows right now.
tomp6581
12/8/09 11:07:59AM
If Dan wasnt a big PPV draw, then why should that matter?

The best fighters should get the best contracts surely?

If all the top fighters also get a % of the PPV, then guys who are more popular than others would get more money through that.

I know the UFC is a business, but letting Henderson go so easy just isnt right. The UFC purchased Pride so they could consolidate the talent and take MMA to the next level.

They wanted to be the only major mma organisation, so then they have to take responsibility for the top guys who are not so popular.

If not? Then please dont discredit the orginisations that are not so motivated by popularity of their fighters, but are more concerned about their talent.
SamPan
12/8/09 11:59:40AM
Dana really shouldve resigned him. Especially after maybe the flashiest KO hes ever had
MaxOne
12/8/09 12:54:32PM
i'm glad he's in strikeforce.

ufc should have Joe Rogan as their spokesperson. He props fighters accordingly whether or not they are in the UFC. Dana can do all the behind the scenes dirty work still.

dana loves being in the limelight and he loves the power he believes his words have.
EliasG
12/8/09 4:18:27PM
Dana loves being the "UFC" and he has eaten his words more than once, but his arrogance is becoming pretty astounding lately.
WheelchairBandit
12/8/09 4:21:26PM
They resign Tito for big $$$ when the chances of him ever winning a relevant fight again are nill..............yet they won't give Dan a little extra moola?C'mon!

Dan's poor PPV numbers come from the fact that he got stuck on two European cards (which never draw big numbers,no matter who's fighting on them),and got matched up against Anderson Silva at a time when he wasn't pulling big numbers yet.

It's funny,that post-TUF 9 and a brutal highlight reel KO on the biggest UFC card ever,that the UFC would decide to let Dan go.Right now is when he's going to be the most popular and sell the most PPV's,coming off the show and the KO of Bisping.

If anything,they should have re-signed him and had him fight at 205-they need contenders in that division and he would have made for some incredible matchups that would have sold big-who wouldn't buy Dan vs. Shogun?

The only upside for the UFC in letting Dan go to Strikeforce is the hopes that he helps drain them financially along with all the other big name,high dollar fighters they have on roster.Dana is probably hedging his bets on Strikeforce going under within the next year or so and being able to get back Dan for a reasonable price.

In the meantime,I'm looking forward to seeing Dan fight Shields,Jacare,and Mousasi.And I would literaly flip my lid if they could do a fight with Fedor.That would probably be the greatest superfight ever-the Pride welterweight and middleweight champ against the Pride heavyweight champ.Dan has the skills,the heart and the sheer toughness to give Fedor a tough fight.

Brian.
GrandMaster313
12/8/09 4:42:29PM

Posted by Twenty20Dollars

Yeah Hendo doesnt bring a loud mouth and cocky attitude like Bisping does. Hendo only brings good wrestling, great power and never been knocked out.

But its all good because I have Showtime.



lol so do i
MMAcca
12/8/09 4:57:19PM

Posted by Aether

I'm starting to wonder how many more big-relatively big names Strikeforce can afford to pick up. Surely they can't keep paying for names like Fedor, Hendo, Arlovski, etc. at the rate that they are.



Strikeforce will keep signing big names, we just won't get to see them fight (more than once a year) is all.....
fullfighting
12/8/09 6:34:16PM
Ive tried to like Dana but he is just an absolutely arrogant walking contradiction. I thought he was trying to make this a real sport and the biggest sport in the world? So you let go one of best athletes? He's not a big PPV draw? He's one of the best fighters in the world and he can only make your sport/product more legit. For Dana to talk like this makes me think he's more about $$ and less about a great sport/product.
warglory
12/8/09 7:12:26PM
Wow, its amazing how many people are defending Dan when you have no idea how much he was asking for. For all we know, he was asking for Fedor money. Dan's a great fighter and an asset to any org, however, if he was asking for a bitchload of cash, then its completely realistic that Dana would not sign him. He runs a business, and is looking for a return on investment, this isn't the Olympics. Dana signed back Tito, not because he is championship material, but because he puts butts in seats and is still a UFC caliber fighter.
EliasG
12/8/09 7:13:15PM
It would be interesting to peek in on the contracts that the guys sign with Strikeforce. Is there a substantial difference between an EXCLUSIVE UFC contract and a non exclusive contract with SF?

I have no idea, maybe someone here knows but it would seem in my mind, that if you were signed to a non exclusive contract and could fight for other organizations outside of the US or in other martial arts/boxing, etc... that you may not be saddled with the same minimum number of fights, with set prices by a set time. Your management may not push for that if you can get more latitutde somewhere else and you negotiate so that you can create other revenue streams outside of SF. Then you wouldn't have a fighter on "retainer" and be paying him for nothing or scrambling to find him a fight because of contract language. You would have the freedom to put in fighters as you see fit based upon your schedule.

BUt then I don't know. The UFC carries a LOT Of exclusive contracts though. I wonder how much it costs to buy out the contracts when they can't get fights for them? I know one guy that got a 275K three fight deal and has only been on TV once. Not sure how THAT is sustainable in the UFC. If I was DANA i might be more concerned about that than SF.
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