Does Chuck and Wandy go out the window?

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aceprone
2/25/07 3:06:25AM
Hendo's plan in the stand up was exactly what someone with good striking needs to do to counter Wandy's wild style. A straight punch. Hendo landed it multiple times. I'm not trying to make an argument, but Chucks stand up style would of probably put Wandy on the matt in the first, possible early second.

Any thoughts?
Trapt1nw0nder
2/25/07 3:10:37AM

Posted by aceprone

Hendo's plan in the stand up was exactly what someone with good striking needs to do to counter Wandy's wild style. A straight punch. Hendo landed it multiple times. I'm not trying to make an argument, but Chucks stand up style would of probably put Wandy on the matt in the first, possible early second.

Any thoughts?



I agree....Wandy's style is very accessable to chucks Jab+Right uppercut combo...i think its a very bad match-up for Wandy

I was rooting and betting on Dan,but now i kinda feel sorry for Wandy,he has alot of heart so he will always have his fans..

as to the question,i doubt they would fight unless Chuck losses soon

but hey,if chuck really wants to fight him for talking smack he will still prolly ask dana to make it happen

now that he lost i am 100% sure he is coming to UFC and work his way up like Rampage
roadking95th
2/25/07 3:23:28AM
They could still fight but Chuck would have to lose first. Wandy could come to the UFC now and make room for Rua in Pride, though I don't think he will beat Hendo the first time around. Chuck's big move now is Cro Cop, then Fedor. He would then want to fight the Rua/ Hendo winner before Wandy. This is assuming Wandy doesn't win the belt back( I wouldn't bet on it).

Chuck's new list: Cro Cop, Fedor, Rampage, Hendo/Rua winner.
Svartorm
2/25/07 3:42:12AM
I think the only thing thats changed is that if this fight goes down, Wandys paycheck just got WAY smaller.
JoeMimic
2/25/07 4:01:03AM
Dana didn't think Wandy deserved a shot after he lost to Cro Cop so its hard to say what he'll say now. It's possible he could see this as a chance to "put over" the UFC over Pride but the match has lost some major luster since Wandy stepped into the ocagon awhile ago. It sucks for Pride because they made all this hype about Wandy wanting to fight Chuck.
Manfred
2/25/07 5:14:41AM
"He just got his head kicked in" -Dana shouting back to a fan after the CC fight

"He just got knocked out by a MW" - Dana's probably reply now.

Unfortunately, IF this happens, A win by Chuck would be diminished by Wandy's possible lack of confidence. Personally, I think this fight should've happened last summer and now it'll go down like Saku/Rickson. I'd rather see Shogun/Chuck at this point.
hippysmacker
2/25/07 5:49:17AM

Posted by Svartorm

I think the only thing thats changed is that if this fight goes down, Wandys paycheck just got WAY smaller.



Good point, but I still want to see it. Obviously Chuck's style is taylor made to Ko someone with Wandy's. Maybe these back to back Ko losses will make wandy more disciplined. Who knows? Eiher way the UFC could sell this fight, and it should get done easier now that Wandy doesn't have the belt. The only difference beeing Ramapge fight's Chuck first adn Wandy might have to have a tune-up fight in the UFC to re-introduce him to the casual fan. Give him Irvin, casual fans seem to think he's good for some weird reason, he looks the part, and he has about a 1 in a million chance to beat Wandy.
Then FINALLY CHUCK VS WANDY!
brodieros
2/25/07 10:25:43AM
Dana wouldn't let it happen when wandi lost to a heavyweight in an open weight tourny. So do you think he will allow him a shot at chuck when he can't even win in his own weight division? I'm guessing......not

It doesn't make much difference, coz if he can get caught by Dan (don't get me wrong Dan got a new fan in me, but he is no chuck) then he would be a 10 sec high light reel for Chuck.
DirtySouthBoss
2/25/07 12:33:44PM
I think that we have all waited enough time to see Wandy v. Chuck, and now that I think about it I'm actually kind of glad that Wandy lost even though I got proven stupid about 1 million times last night.

1. I think its a perfect reason to go to the UFC now and much easier for him w/out the belt.

2. It probably sets up Hendo v. Shogun which is a great fight that Rua has deserved for too long.
brodieros
2/25/07 12:41:51PM
If he does come to UFC he will have to fight to prove himself and by that time chuck will be heavy weight or retired. Dana isn't stupid UFC isn't one of the if not the biggest MMA organizations by accident it would take alot for wandi to get a shot now.
JimiMak
2/25/07 12:54:47PM

Posted by Manfred

"He just got his head kicked in" -Dana shouting back to a fan after the CC fight

"He just got knocked out by a MW" - Dana's probably reply now.

Unfortunately, IF this happens, A win by Chuck would be diminished by Wandy's possible lack of confidence. Personally, I think this fight should've happened last summer and now it'll go down like Saku/Rickson. I'd rather see Shogun/Chuck at this point.



I've been saying this for months now. This is another Saku/Rickson. Shogun/Chuck has been more interesting, IMO, since Rua's GP win (if not before). They didn't fight in their primes, and that can't be changed. Chuck's level is still good enough to make for some interesting dream matches, but they need to happen fast. Wandy, i think, we are just watching the beginning of hiim not being up to par (for him). If they fight it will be when they're both too old, and no matter who wins (prob'ly Chuck) the other's fans will say "What if this had happened in 2000-2006?"
aceprone
2/25/07 2:06:36PM

Posted by JimiMak


Posted by Manfred

"He just got his head kicked in" -Dana shouting back to a fan after the CC fight

"He just got knocked out by a MW" - Dana's probably reply now.

Unfortunately, IF this happens, A win by Chuck would be diminished by Wandy's possible lack of confidence. Personally, I think this fight should've happened last summer and now it'll go down like Saku/Rickson. I'd rather see Shogun/Chuck at this point.



I've been saying this for months now. This is another Saku/Rickson. Shogun/Chuck has been more interesting, IMO, since Rua's GP win (if not before). They didn't fight in their primes, and that can't be changed. Chuck's level is still good enough to make for some interesting dream matches, but they need to happen fast. Wandy, i think, we are just watching the beginning of hiim not being up to par (for him). If they fight it will be when they're both too old, and no matter who wins (prob'ly Chuck) the other's fans will say "What if this had happened in 2000-2006?"



Well here's a small counter argument to that, and that's the fact that Wandy is only 30. He technically hasn't hit his prime yet. So for him to be on a down slope right now isn't too good for his career. I know I've said this before, but I really think that knockout by Cro Cop really effective him. It's similar to "post tramadic stress," to a soldier. "The Crow," is another good example of this. Never the same. So actually right now would be the perfect time for Chuck to fight Wandy because subconciously Wandy is going to be afraid of getting knocked out. It would nail the coffin shut for sure. And yes, Wandy and Chuck should of happened this past year, before any of this.

But I do agree that a Chuck vs. Shogun is a better match up. Shogun is a more complete fighter then Wandy and he is on a role.
Kazmierz21
2/25/07 2:19:57PM

Posted by brodieros

Dana wouldn't let it happen when wandi lost to a heavyweight in an open weight tourny. So do you think he will allow him a shot at chuck when he can't even win in his own weight division? I'm guessing......not

It doesn't make much difference, coz if he can get caught by Dan (don't get me wrong Dan got a new fan in me, but he is no chuck) then he would be a 10 sec high light reel for Chuck.



Hendo got one thing over Chuck to make up for the difference in size - Hendo does not get knocked out...ever

Even though I would still like to see Chuck v. Silva it has lost some luster as Silva seems to have lost a step from the beast he was 2-3 years ago - it has become blatantly obvious that all one needs to do to beat Silva is throw straight up the middle and don't let your hands down - the new showstopper would be a Chuck/Shogun matchup but I would also enjoy a Chuck/Hendo matchup if either was ever possible
ManBeast
2/25/07 3:13:06PM

Posted by roadking95th

They could still fight but Chuck would have to lose first. Wandy could come to the UFC now and make room for Rua in Pride, though I don't think he will beat Hendo the first time around. Chuck's big move now is Cro Cop, then Fedor. He would then want to fight the Rua/ Hendo winner before Wandy. This is assuming Wandy doesn't win the belt back( I wouldn't bet on it).

Chuck's new list: Cro Cop, Fedor, Rampage, Hendo/Rua winner.



I doubt chuck will move up to heavyweight to fight CroCop or Fedor... even with the current upsets in pride I still firmly believe that Fedor and CroCop would eat chuck alive.
Kazmierz21
2/25/07 4:03:52PM

Posted by ManBeast


Posted by roadking95th

They could still fight but Chuck would have to lose first. Wandy could come to the UFC now and make room for Rua in Pride, though I don't think he will beat Hendo the first time around. Chuck's big move now is Cro Cop, then Fedor. He would then want to fight the Rua/ Hendo winner before Wandy. This is assuming Wandy doesn't win the belt back( I wouldn't bet on it).

Chuck's new list: Cro Cop, Fedor, Rampage, Hendo/Rua winner.



I doubt chuck will move up to heavyweight to fight CroCop or Fedor... even with the current upsets in pride I still firmly believe that Fedor and CroCop would eat chuck alive.



Fedor most certainly - Cro Cop v. Chuck would be kinda sick but I think in the end Cro Cop's size would prevail - Chuck wouldn't be used to getting hit as hard as that - a Chuck v. Big Nog match would be kinda sick too
MattHughes
2/25/07 4:15:00PM
I would still like to see this fight happen. I'd rather Chuck vs Wandy than Chuck vs Rashad or Jardine.
warglory
2/25/07 4:24:36PM
Wandy loses a match and everyone discredits him? Damn, if the man won everyone would continue to proclaim as the steamroller he has been. Everyone loses matches people, give the guy a break. Couture obliterated Lidell in their first match, and Liddell came back to win decisively in both return matches. Hendo is a skilled fighter and he happened to come out on top. SImple as that. Wandy vs Chuck would still be a huge draw.
Kazmierz21
2/25/07 4:35:07PM

Posted by warglory

Wandy loses a match and everyone discredits him? Damn, if the man won everyone would continue to proclaim as the steamroller he has been. Everyone loses matches people, give the guy a break. Couture obliterated Lidell in their first match, and Liddell came back to win decisively in both return matches. Hendo is a skilled fighter and he happened to come out on top. SImple as that. Wandy vs Chuck would still be a huge draw.



It would still be a good fight but I think Wandy has shown the chink in his armor and needs to evolve a little now - he'll still mash most opponents but the guys at the top of the food chain have some real good film on how to beat him now - I think Chuck would hand him a much worse beating then Hendo just did unless he switched up the game plan a little bit - Shogun v. Chuck on the other hand would be a truly great match
warglory
2/25/07 4:43:07PM

Posted by Kazmierz21


Posted by warglory

Wandy loses a match and everyone discredits him? Damn, if the man won everyone would continue to proclaim as the steamroller he has been. Everyone loses matches people, give the guy a break. Couture obliterated Lidell in their first match, and Liddell came back to win decisively in both return matches. Hendo is a skilled fighter and he happened to come out on top. SImple as that. Wandy vs Chuck would still be a huge draw.



It would still be a good fight but I think Wandy has shown the chink in his armor and needs to evolve a little now - he'll still mash most opponents but the guys at the top of the food chain have some real good film on how to beat him now - I think Chuck would hand him a much worse beating then Hendo just did unless he switched up the game plan a little bit - Shogun v. Chuck on the other hand would be a truly great match



Well of course he needs to evolve, but doesn't this go without saying for anyone who loses a fight? Liddell got his ass handed to him by Rampage, but how many people think Liddell would be a pushover now for Rampage? I for one think Chuck would beat Rampage decisively if/when they fought. Silva lost a match, it happens to the best. He will train, watch the match over and over, and train somemore. He beat Henderson once, so he knows he can beat him. Wanderlei looked human, God forbid. :-p I think the next time we see Silva fight, it's going to be a slaughterfest in his favor.

But I agree, Shogun vs Chuck would be fantastic.
jocksmall
2/25/07 6:20:19PM
would love to see this fight more than any other. chuck would be favored for reasons already outlined but wandy can beat anyone at any weight
jaba
2/25/07 7:20:35PM


Well here's a small counter argument to that, and that's the fact that Wandy is only 30. He technically hasn't hit his prime yet. So for him to be on a down slope right now isn't too good for his career. I know I've said this before, but I really think that knockout by Cro Cop really effective him. It's similar to "post tramadic stress," to a soldier. "The Crow," is another good example of this. Never the same. So actually right now would be the perfect time for Chuck to fight Wandy because subconciously Wandy is going to be afraid of getting knocked out. It would nail the coffin shut for sure. And yes, Wandy and Chuck should of happened this past year, before any of this.

But I do agree that a Chuck vs. Shogun is a better match up. Shogun is a more complete fighter then Wandy and he is on a role.


Ye i think your right, theres no way he could get washed up at such a young age. The cro cop fight was the first time he got Ko/TKo ed in like 8 years. He propably built up so much pride thinking he was invincible and then to get dominated so badly probably did screw with his head. I dont know why he would be so bothered by this though, i mean he stepped in the ring with the #2 fighter in the world who was outweighing him in that fight,. just steppin in the ring with cro cop and not quiting even after breakin his ribs and takin a brutal shot too the face proves how great he is.
JimiMak
2/25/07 11:09:46PM

Posted by aceprone


Posted by JimiMak


Posted by Manfred

"He just got his head kicked in" -Dana shouting back to a fan after the CC fight

"He just got knocked out by a MW" - Dana's probably reply now.

Unfortunately, IF this happens, A win by Chuck would be diminished by Wandy's possible lack of confidence. Personally, I think this fight should've happened last summer and now it'll go down like Saku/Rickson. I'd rather see Shogun/Chuck at this point.



I've been saying this for months now. This is another Saku/Rickson. Shogun/Chuck has been more interesting, IMO, since Rua's GP win (if not before). They didn't fight in their primes, and that can't be changed. Chuck's level is still good enough to make for some interesting dream matches, but they need to happen fast. Wandy, i think, we are just watching the beginning of hiim not being up to par (for him). If they fight it will be when they're both too old, and no matter who wins (prob'ly Chuck) the other's fans will say "What if this had happened in 2000-2006?"



Well here's a small counter argument to that, and that's the fact that Wandy is only 30. He technically hasn't hit his prime yet. So for him to be on a down slope right now isn't too good for his career. I know I've said this before, but I really think that knockout by Cro Cop really effective him. It's similar to "post tramadic stress," to a soldier. "The Crow," is another good example of this. Never the same. So actually right now would be the perfect time for Chuck to fight Wandy because subconciously Wandy is going to be afraid of getting knocked out. It would nail the coffin shut for sure. And yes, Wandy and Chuck should of happened this past year, before any of this.

But I do agree that a Chuck vs. Shogun is a better match up. Shogun is a more complete fighter then Wandy and he is on a role.



I don't know how you're calculating prime, it differs in different sports because of different demands on the body (strength, longevity, etc). This is still a young enough sport where it's hard to guage but for someone to be on top for more that 5-10 years is still all but unheardof. It's not about age it's about battles sometimes. and Wandy has had a lot of battles for 30. He started this way younger than chuck did. He may not even be going down, but plateauing. Unfortunately for him Chuck seems to have another few in him before we can start making that guess. And Shogun I think has the next few years to surpass both of them. Maybe post traumatic stress is part of it, but in this business that's not something Wandy can afford to have. And trust me I have been a Wandy fan for years and always will be, and don't care for Chuck. I hope I'm wrong but I think a KO loss to Hendo was the wake up call.
hippysmacker
2/27/07 4:37:01AM
Dana's comments the day after seem to say htis fight is done. However, I'm sure this is just talk. If Wandy wanted to (and is free too ) come to the UFC, I bet this match gets made in a minute. We've all wanted to see it forever, and they could sell it. I still have hope
OchoCinco
2/27/07 6:25:33AM
I know I don't care if Wandy lost I still want to see him face Chuck. I think this is most real fans opinion. The fact that he is no longer the Pride champ should make it more likely he would jump to fight Liddell. He needs to let Shogun hold the Pride belt for a while.
brodieros
2/27/07 3:57:14PM
Dana White: Liddell vs. Silva Matchup No Longer a Possibility
Posted by Performify on February 27, 2007 at 2:52 pm ET

Wanderlei SilvaAccording to a report from Canada’s CBC, UFC President Dana White is now completely discounting the possiblity of a future matchup between current UFC light heavyweight champion Chuck “The Iceman” Liddell and recently dethroned PRIDE Fighting Championships middleweight champion Wanderlei Silva.

As we previously reported, Silva was defeated this weekend at PRIDE 33 by MMA veteran Dan Henderson.

The article quotes Dana White as saying:

“I’m pissed off he didn’t lose to Chuck. They (Pride) threw away the biggest fight in MMA history. Not only are they No. 2, they’re not the brightest bulbs on the porch either… I wanted that Wanderlei Silva fight so bad. I knew Chuck Liddell would knock him out. I knew it and it’s gone. I don’t know, we’re trying to figure out what we’re going to do with Chuck next.”

White goes on to say yet again that Liddell will likely move up in weight to take on top heavyweights. The article quotes Dana as saying, “Chuck doesn’t have too many more options now at light-heavy and Chuck’s already talking about going after a couple of the bigger guys.” But most interesting to me:

Asked if Pride’s Mauricio (Shogun) Rua would make a good substitute for Silva against Liddell, White said: “Nobody knows who the hell Shogun is.”



Well that says it all... you can find this on about any MMA site you look at. I would have loved to see this but Wandi couldn't prove he recovered from crop cop against a Welter Weight. i know Dan is the WW champion but Wandi was the Middle Weight champ. Chuck's hands are better than Dan's.

Northrend
2/27/07 4:31:54PM

Posted by brodieros

Dana White: Liddell vs. Silva Matchup No Longer a Possibility
Posted by Performify on February 27, 2007 at 2:52 pm ET

Wanderlei SilvaAccording to a report from Canada’s CBC, UFC President Dana White is now completely discounting the possiblity of a future matchup between current UFC light heavyweight champion Chuck “The Iceman” Liddell and recently dethroned PRIDE Fighting Championships middleweight champion Wanderlei Silva.

As we previously reported, Silva was defeated this weekend at PRIDE 33 by MMA veteran Dan Henderson.

The article quotes Dana White as saying:

“I’m pissed off he didn’t lose to Chuck. They (Pride) threw away the biggest fight in MMA history. Not only are they No. 2, they’re not the brightest bulbs on the porch either… I wanted that Wanderlei Silva fight so bad. I knew Chuck Liddell would knock him out. I knew it and it’s gone. I don’t know, we’re trying to figure out what we’re going to do with Chuck next.”

White goes on to say yet again that Liddell will likely move up in weight to take on top heavyweights. The article quotes Dana as saying, “Chuck doesn’t have too many more options now at light-heavy and Chuck’s already talking about going after a couple of the bigger guys.” But most interesting to me:

Asked if Pride’s Mauricio (Shogun) Rua would make a good substitute for Silva against Liddell, White said: “Nobody knows who the hell Shogun is.”



Well that says it all... you can find this on about any MMA site you look at. I would have loved to see this but Wandi couldn't prove he recovered from crop cop against a Welter Weight. i know Dan is the WW champion but Wandi was the Middle Weight champ. Chuck's hands are better than Dan's.




WTF does he mean no one knows who shogun is? He got the biggest cheers at Pride 33 in Vegas (was there) even bigger then Hendo/Silva. In Japan he is preety popular as well. Dana seems like a dick in my opinion.
Trapt1nw0nder
2/27/07 5:06:51PM

Posted by Northrend


Posted by brodieros

Dana White: Liddell vs. Silva Matchup No Longer a Possibility
Posted by Performify on February 27, 2007 at 2:52 pm ET

Wanderlei SilvaAccording to a report from Canada’s CBC, UFC President Dana White is now completely discounting the possiblity of a future matchup between current UFC light heavyweight champion Chuck “The Iceman” Liddell and recently dethroned PRIDE Fighting Championships middleweight champion Wanderlei Silva.

As we previously reported, Silva was defeated this weekend at PRIDE 33 by MMA veteran Dan Henderson.

The article quotes Dana White as saying:

“I’m pissed off he didn’t lose to Chuck. They (Pride) threw away the biggest fight in MMA history. Not only are they No. 2, they’re not the brightest bulbs on the porch either… I wanted that Wanderlei Silva fight so bad. I knew Chuck Liddell would knock him out. I knew it and it’s gone. I don’t know, we’re trying to figure out what we’re going to do with Chuck next.”

White goes on to say yet again that Liddell will likely move up in weight to take on top heavyweights. The article quotes Dana as saying, “Chuck doesn’t have too many more options now at light-heavy and Chuck’s already talking about going after a couple of the bigger guys.” But most interesting to me:

Asked if Pride’s Mauricio (Shogun) Rua would make a good substitute for Silva against Liddell, White said: “Nobody knows who the hell Shogun is.”



Well that says it all... you can find this on about any MMA site you look at. I would have loved to see this but Wandi couldn't prove he recovered from crop cop against a Welter Weight. i know Dan is the WW champion but Wandi was the Middle Weight champ. Chuck's hands are better than Dan's.




WTF does he mean no one knows who shogun is? He got the biggest cheers at Pride 33 in Vegas (was there) even bigger then Hendo/Silva. In Japan he is preety popular as well. Dana seems like a dick in my opinion.



dude..he is right

of course us hardcore MMA fans know who the hell he is,but the casual American fan dont know him.People barely knew who Wandy was and you expect them to know who Shogun is? there are only 14K people in the crowd and if they showed up and bought tickets for a pride event they must be well knowledged on the sport and know who shogun is....but there are still Millions of casual MMA fans out there who dont know him(the ones who buy the PPV's where it really counts)

people cheer'd hard for Shogun cuz he said "I LOVE YOU AMERICA"...of course people are gonna cheer for a oversea's fighter from Brazil who dont know english saying he loves us.

Northrend
2/27/07 5:09:47PM

Posted by Trapt1nw0nder


Posted by Northrend


Posted by brodieros

Dana White: Liddell vs. Silva Matchup No Longer a Possibility
Posted by Performify on February 27, 2007 at 2:52 pm ET

Wanderlei SilvaAccording to a report from Canada’s CBC, UFC President Dana White is now completely discounting the possiblity of a future matchup between current UFC light heavyweight champion Chuck “The Iceman” Liddell and recently dethroned PRIDE Fighting Championships middleweight champion Wanderlei Silva.

As we previously reported, Silva was defeated this weekend at PRIDE 33 by MMA veteran Dan Henderson.

The article quotes Dana White as saying:

“I’m pissed off he didn’t lose to Chuck. They (Pride) threw away the biggest fight in MMA history. Not only are they No. 2, they’re not the brightest bulbs on the porch either… I wanted that Wanderlei Silva fight so bad. I knew Chuck Liddell would knock him out. I knew it and it’s gone. I don’t know, we’re trying to figure out what we’re going to do with Chuck next.”

White goes on to say yet again that Liddell will likely move up in weight to take on top heavyweights. The article quotes Dana as saying, “Chuck doesn’t have too many more options now at light-heavy and Chuck’s already talking about going after a couple of the bigger guys.” But most interesting to me:

Asked if Pride’s Mauricio (Shogun) Rua would make a good substitute for Silva against Liddell, White said: “Nobody knows who the hell Shogun is.”



Well that says it all... you can find this on about any MMA site you look at. I would have loved to see this but Wandi couldn't prove he recovered from crop cop against a Welter Weight. i know Dan is the WW champion but Wandi was the Middle Weight champ. Chuck's hands are better than Dan's.




WTF does he mean no one knows who shogun is? He got the biggest cheers at Pride 33 in Vegas (was there) even bigger then Hendo/Silva. In Japan he is preety popular as well. Dana seems like a dick in my opinion.



dude..he is right

of course us hardcore MMA fans know who the hell he is,but the casual American fan dont know him.People barely knew who Wandy was and you expect them to know who Shogun is? there are only 14K people in the crowd and if they showed up and bought tickets for a pride event they must be well knowledged on the sport and know who shogun is....but there are still Millions of casual MMA fans out there who dont know him(the ones who buy the PPV's where it really counts)

people cheer'd hard for Shogun cuz he said "I LOVE YOU AMERICA"...of course people are gonna cheer for a oversea's fighter from Brazil who dont know english saying he loves us.




Nah man I meant when he first came out at the start of the night, was insane how many ppl cheered for him (before he said I love america)
I see what you mean with the american fans though
brodieros
2/27/07 8:58:56PM
I was quoting, thats Dana's opinion and i think he is referring to the people who just watch the fights at bars and people who don't really know MMA. the main part is Wandi screwed up his chances at Chuck.
loller90278
2/27/07 10:05:39PM
i really hope tito beats some sense into dana white when they box.
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