700 BILLION DOLLAR BAILOUT

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POLL: Should the Goverment hand over $700,000,000
Yes it what needs to happen 39% (17)
NO, wellfare for the greedy 61% (27)
Kracker_Jap
10/15/08 2:19:58AM

Posted by ncordless


Posted by Rush

Looks like the "bailout" is working so far. The Dow Jones rebounded by going up 938 points, the biggest increase in history and almost double since the last (499) during the dot com era in 2000.



We still have a long way to go before getting out of this mess. I am hoping for the best but the surge could actually be bad news in this sense... historically "supersurges" occur in the midst of economic turmoil.


I am glad to see that the US and rest of the world is putting money into the banks and buying shares, in effect nationalizing the system. If we are going to be asked to bailout the "financial wizards" of the world because they lost their gamble with the world's money, then we should get a say in how things are run in return.

I understand some people see a "free market" as some sort of sacred cow, and it is obvious that in most situations a free market with healthy competition free from most government controls is the best. But we cannot continue to entrust something as serious as our savings and the world's ability to use credit to a bunch of gamblers and thieves.

It is not in the best interest of anyone to have our financial institutions to continue to use the world's money to advance their personal gain without any interest in the rest of the world.



Sounds like socialism to me
cmill21
10/15/08 2:30:03AM

Posted by Rush

Looks like the "bailout" is working so far. The Dow Jones rebounded by going up 938 points, the biggest increase in history and almost double since the last (499) during the dot com era in 2000.



I knew I should have bought some stock! I would have been rich lol.
ncordless
10/15/08 4:57:06AM

Posted by Kracker_Jap


Posted by ncordless


Posted by Rush

Looks like the "bailout" is working so far. The Dow Jones rebounded by going up 938 points, the biggest increase in history and almost double since the last (499) during the dot com era in 2000.



We still have a long way to go before getting out of this mess. I am hoping for the best but the surge could actually be bad news in this sense... historically "supersurges" occur in the midst of economic turmoil.


I am glad to see that the US and rest of the world is putting money into the banks and buying shares, in effect nationalizing the system. If we are going to be asked to bailout the "financial wizards" of the world because they lost their gamble with the world's money, then we should get a say in how things are run in return.

I understand some people see a "free market" as some sort of sacred cow, and it is obvious that in most situations a free market with healthy competition free from most government controls is the best. But we cannot continue to entrust something as serious as our savings and the world's ability to use credit to a bunch of gamblers and thieves.

It is not in the best interest of anyone to have our financial institutions to continue to use the world's money to advance their personal gain without any interest in the rest of the world.



Sounds like socialism to me



Yeah... either that or it sounds like the sane thing to do.

Or we could really get a "free market" going. We could get rid of all oversight and protections and just let things happen as they happen with no care about the consequences. Heck, let's get rid of the SEC and FTC. While we are at it we can get rid of those pesky UCC laws, or even better make corporations super citizens above the law. Let's get rid of all the "welfare" subsidies for farmers. Then let's see where we stand in a truly "free market".

All things in moderation. Whatever is best for the american people is the path we should choose. If partial nationalization of the banking system is "socialism" then so be it. Call it whatever you want. As long as the american people get to choose what happens (by voting for those making the decision) then we will still be a democracy.

There is nothing unamerican about putting our well-being ahead of corporate interests. It has happened time after time throughout our history. Its our country and we can do whatever we want with it.
ncordless
10/15/08 4:59:41AM

Posted by cmill21


Posted by Rush

Looks like the "bailout" is working so far. The Dow Jones rebounded by going up 938 points, the biggest increase in history and almost double since the last (499) during the dot com era in 2000.



I knew I should have bought some stock! I would have been rich lol.



You still should. There are going to be a lot of short term fluctuations but if you can find value in companies that are going to be in it for the long haul you can still get into the market cheap and make some long term investments that will pay off.
Kracker_Jap
10/15/08 8:05:02PM

Posted by Rush

Looks like the "bailout" is working so far. The Dow Jones rebounded by going up 938 points, the biggest increase in history and almost double since the last (499) during the dot com era in 2000.



Poof and then it doesn't work

Down 700 points today........

The US government should not have provided welfare for the wealthy

Capitalism says when one fail another will achieve... Lessons will be learned...

With this bail out the same greedy bastards have there jobs and we are one more step towards socialism
Rush
10/15/08 9:42:37PM

Posted by Kracker_Jap


Posted by Rush

Looks like the "bailout" is working so far. The Dow Jones rebounded by going up 938 points, the biggest increase in history and almost double since the last (499) during the dot com era in 2000.



Poof and then it doesn't work

Down 700 points today........

The US government should not have provided welfare for the wealthy

Capitalism says when one fail another will achieve... Lessons will be learned...

With this bail out the same greedy bastards have there jobs and we are one more step towards socialism




Umm, there are a few incorrect things about your statements.

First, the bailout has not really taken effect yet. I don't think any shares have officially been bought or any government money been spent/invested. That is why I used the term loosely. (see the use of " " )

Second, I think the term "welfare" for the weathy is used incorrectly. The money is not being given to the banks. It is being used to BUY shares in the market. The government will OWN what they buy.

Also an optimist will still see that there was an overall gain over the last week or so despite the big jump and plunge.

I think the lesson to be learned is that the markets have to creep up slowly. Give the program a couple of months, the time most of the packages will take to kick in.
Kracker_Jap
10/15/08 10:46:16PM

Posted by Rush


Posted by Kracker_Jap


Posted by Rush

Looks like the "bailout" is working so far. The Dow Jones rebounded by going up 938 points, the biggest increase in history and almost double since the last (499) during the dot com era in 2000.



Poof and then it doesn't work

Down 700 points today........

The US government should not have provided welfare for the wealthy

Capitalism says when one fail another will achieve... Lessons will be learned...

With this bail out the same greedy bastards have there jobs and we are one more step towards socialism




Umm, there are a few incorrect things about your statements.

First, the bailout has not really taken effect yet. I don't think any shares have officially been bought or any government money been spent/invested. That is why I used the term loosely. (see the use of " " )

Second, I think the term "welfare" for the weathy is used incorrectly. The money is not being given to the banks. It is being used to BUY shares in the market. The government will OWN what they buy.

Also an optimist will still see that there was an overall gain over the last week or so despite the big jump and plunge.

I think the lesson to be learned is that the markets have to creep up slowly. Give the program a couple of months, the time most of the packages will take to kick in.



All that is fine and dandy, but considering you made the statement that the bail out is working so far, its a mute point
roadking95th
10/16/08 12:29:08AM
Been gone for awhile, so just getting a chance to chime in.

The "bail out" is a crock. I heard on the radio today, yea I know not the most reliable source, that the Treasure Sec had the heads of nine major banks in a meeting recently. He handed them a single paged letter stating how they were selling shares to the gov't and they weren't leaving until they did so. Wells Fargo, I believe that to be the correct bank, said they were in fine shape, as they didn't partake in risky morgages. Guess what? Tough, sign the paper. Socialism anyone?

A large chunk of this money is also going over seas as foriegn companies had large stakes in the failed morgages and such.

So lets see if I have this straight. Some financial institutions way over extend themselves and ran out of capital. In swopes Super Gov't who is even more over extended but they have captial, well at least they say they do. Let's see, we had to borrow money from China for some earlier bail outs because we didn't have the capital. That was only tens of billions. Now we need 850 billion plus! Fire up those printing presses boys and girls. Remember, this is an institution who can't even run itself efficiently. Hell, if the US gov't was a business, the show would have been over long ago.

Anyone have the figures on how much the treasury is increasing the number of dollars in circulation? Aren't they almost doubling the number? Not sure on that, maybe they are only adding 50%. Either way, it is crazy.

Its time the gov't sets their priorities. Figure out a fair flat income tax anda different consumption tax. List their responsibilties. Oh, I don't know... you know things for the good of all. Why is it when ever there is a budget crunch, the trash stops being picked up, firetrucks and police cruisers stop rolling, and the roads go to hell but the food stamps keep coming. Something is wrong here. Sorry about the rant

I vote the bail out is bad.
Kracker_Jap
10/16/08 12:41:09AM

Posted by roadking95th

Been gone for awhile, so just getting a chance to chime in.

The "bail out" is a crock. I heard on the radio today, yea I know not the most reliable source, that the Treasure Sec had the heads of nine major banks in a meeting recently. He handed them a single paged letter stating how they were selling shares to the gov't and they weren't leaving until they did so. Wells Fargo, I believe that to be the correct bank, said they were in fine shape, as they didn't partake in risky morgages. Guess what? Tough, sign the paper. Socialism anyone?

A large chunk of this money is also going over seas as foriegn companies had large stakes in the failed morgages and such.

So lets see if I have this straight. Some financial institutions way over extend themselves and ran out of capital. In swopes Super Gov't who is even more over extended but they have captial, well at least they say they do. Let's see, we had to borrow money from China for some earlier bail outs because we didn't have the capital. That was only tens of billions. Now we need 850 billion plus! Fire up those printing presses boys and girls. Remember, this is an institution who can't even run itself efficiently. Hell, if the US gov't was a business, the show would have been over long ago.

Anyone have the figures on how much the treasury is increasing the number of dollars in circulation? Aren't they almost doubling the number? Not sure on that, maybe they are only adding 50%. Either way, it is crazy.

Its time the gov't sets their priorities. Figure out a fair flat income tax anda different consumption tax. List their responsibilties. Oh, I don't know... you know things for the good of all. Why is it when ever there is a budget crunch, the trash stops being picked up, firetrucks and police cruisers stop rolling, and the roads go to hell but the food stamps keep coming. Something is wrong here. Sorry about the rant

I vote the bail out is bad.



I agree
Rush
10/16/08 3:49:10PM

Posted by Kracker_Jap

All that is fine and dandy, but considering you made the statement that the bail out is working so far, its a mute point




Read the second line in my reply.
ncordless
10/16/08 4:33:13PM

The "bail out" is a crock. I heard on the radio today, yea I know not the most reliable source, that the Treasure Sec had the heads of nine major banks in a meeting recently. He handed them a single paged letter stating how they were selling shares to the gov't and they weren't leaving until they did so. Wells Fargo, I believe that to be the correct bank, said they were in fine shape, as they didn't partake in risky morgages. Guess what? Tough, sign the paper. Socialism anyone?


You lost me right there. Which radio show was that? You should take this as a sign to quit listening to them because they lie to you.
roadking95th
10/16/08 8:59:12PM

Posted by ncordless


The "bail out" is a crock. I heard on the radio today, yea I know not the most reliable source, that the Treasure Sec had the heads of nine major banks in a meeting recently. He handed them a single paged letter stating how they were selling shares to the gov't and they weren't leaving until they did so. Wells Fargo, I believe that to be the correct bank, said they were in fine shape, as they didn't partake in risky morgages. Guess what? Tough, sign the paper. Socialism anyone?


You lost me right there. Which radio show was that? You should take this as a sign to quit listening to them because they lie to you.



99% sure it was Glenn Beck. He has been out in front of this issue for 2 years now. I consider him very reliable.
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